UK2US1979

Which office of the SSA did you call? Local or Regional. If I recall correctly, your wife's UK pension was not subject to WEP because she had already been WEPed out on account of other pensions?
In my case, because I have been drawing the SS for the past 3 years or so and will be getting the UK state pension only now (actually a couple or three months from now), I should probably file Form 308 with appropriate notes on why Pre April1975 employment years are not to be part of the WEP calculation as the contributions up until then were flat rate stamps as opposed to "earnings based" ( which became effective April 6, 1975) on which the current Pension system is based.

http://www.socialsecurity.gov/forms/ssa-308.pdf.
Of the Questions 3 to 5 in this form, as I understand it, employment periods in Q4 (and hence portion of the pension related to this period) are the ones subject to WEP. This then should include only the years/periods from April 6, 1975 on. If periods Pre 1975 are included in Q4, there is a risk of WEP mistakenly calculated also on Pre 1975 contributions/years.

I will appreciate yours and nun's and others thoughts on this.

nun

The IPC BR1 is the international pension claim form.....is that what you mean? I would be very dubious about anything DWP tells you about US SS or WEP as they know nothing of the US system. Just follow the SSA rules.

gester

Can one assume that form 308 is not required when SSA contributions exceed 30 years?

lansbury

If you are required to file it or not in those circumstances I am not sure. However it will not make any difference in regards to WEP as WEP doesn't come into play if you have 30 or more years of contributions.

UK2US1979

It sounded something like that but I am sure she was referring to some other document. I agree with you I should just file what the SSA requires. i.e 308. It seems to me, Question 3 is the pertinent one in that it is on which the calculation is made. If so, what is the relevance of Q 3 and even Q 5 to that matter? Your thoughts?

UK2US1979

<It seems to me, Question 3 is the pertinent one in that it is on which the calculation is made> Sorry, meant to say Q4 is the pertinent one.......

lansbury

My wife has the UK State pension, and a UK private pension. Either of those on their own caused her to reach the maximum deduction under WEP. They took details of both, so it didn't matter discussing voluntary contributions with them. My wife had 9 years of work contributions, and 3 extra years we purchased, plus her penson was increased when I retired to 60% of mine. But as her private pension which is all earnings related would have maxed out the WEP there was no point in discussing the finer points of the UK State pension. We filed online and each received an email to call a telephone number and speak to a named person to complete our application. One person dealt with both of us, but where in the USA they were I have no idea.

ExRN

I'm new to the forum and to British expats so forgive me if this is not on topic. I clicked on the link from a previous page in this discussion which showed the SSA.gov publication on WEP. Several posts in this forum have said WEP does not apply after 30 years substantial earnings. The publication says the same yet the table at the end has 30+ years = 90%
Last year my SSA was up to 85% after 29 years substantial earnings so they were sticking to that chart. How do I get to 100% ?

Peter124

Take a look at this chart:
Retirement Planner: How the Windfall Elimination Provision Can Affect Your Social Security Benefit

lansbury

The SSA work out you Average Indexed Monthly Earnings over the period you paid into SS. That amount is split into three bands. The lower band at present is $0 to $791. The 90% refers to the amount of your earnings in that band which will be paid as SS. The other higher bands have lower percentages. 90% is the most that you can get from the lowest band. It isn't a percentage of your SS payment.

If you make 30 years of payments WEP does not apply.

ExRN

Thank you both for the info.
I can now retire!!!

UK2US1979

I am trying to figure out how the deferral lump sum will be treated for WEP purposes ( if, at all). Therefore will really appreciate your input.
As I reasearch and read more about it, form 308 question pertaining to Lump sum is for situations where people have cashed out their Pension instead of taking periodic payments in future years. SSA manual talks of how such lump sum is treated for calculation of WEP etc.i.e it is spread out in future years using the actuarial table.
I also remember reading somewhere in the SSA manual that WEP applies when the other pension is received as opposed to when one became eligible. Do others here have similar understanding? So, if that is the case, am I correct in understanding that WEP will not be calculated on my past Social security which I have been receiving for the past 3+ years?

Could I make a case that WEP should be calculated on UK state pension going forward plus " extra pension" which I could have taken instead of the lump sum even though I did not opt for the first option. For all I know, this is how the SSA would treat such situations any way but at present I dont know for sure. Obviously I want to avoid paying WEP on the past 3 years or of Social Security out of my lump sum. That would be a lot.

Any thoughts nun, lansbury and others?

lansbury

My understanding is SS take the lump and calculate what your pension would be if you didn't take the lump sum, but took the higher monthly pension. That higher pension amount is used in the WEP calculations.

WEP only comes into play from the date you are receiving both your UK and US pensions.

Sailortobe

I received my award letter for UK state pension at the beginning of April this year - there was no other supporting documentation for submitting to SSA here.
Now that I have the ward letter I have the joy of informing SSA as I am already receiving social security. Can anyone clarify for me that no more than a 50% diminishment is benefits can be expected after WEP. In the back of my mind i seem to remember lansbury saying he expected no social security - but perhaps I'm misremembering.

lansbury

I did say that but that would have been caused by the Government Pension Offset, not WEP. Fortunately even the GOP didn't come into play so I will indeed be receiving a SS spouse benefit.

This is the online WEP calculator Online Calculator (WEP Version). We used it to work out Mrs L pension and it was spot on to what she was awarded.