UK Pension incl Lump Sum
#16
Re: Voluntary NI Payments
Agreed.
Whenever I ran the numbers I always came up with the purchasing of additional UK pension years as being a good deal. The way I did it is figure out how much each additional year purchased adds to your UK pension, then guestimate what you would need to get as a return on your money if you decided not to give it to HMRC but rather invest it yourself and come up with a consistent year in year out return to match or better what the UK is giving you. The only possible 'wrinkle' would be if you fell off a cliff just after turning 65 or so and didn't get a chance to get the punts.
Whenever I ran the numbers I always came up with the purchasing of additional UK pension years as being a good deal. The way I did it is figure out how much each additional year purchased adds to your UK pension, then guestimate what you would need to get as a return on your money if you decided not to give it to HMRC but rather invest it yourself and come up with a consistent year in year out return to match or better what the UK is giving you. The only possible 'wrinkle' would be if you fell off a cliff just after turning 65 or so and didn't get a chance to get the punts.
I've been paying Class 2 for 32 years and have a few free years of contributions
lets assume it started at £150/year and has risen by 1.5% each year and is now around £240/year. If I had invested those payments at 5% and let the sum continue to compound until age 66 I'd have £23k and that would buy an annuity in the US worth £1.5k/year (I've left everything in £ to eliminate exchange rates and used today's rates...they might be higher 10 years time). So today 35 years of NI would get me a UK state pension of £8k/year, but if we inflate it by 2% for 10 years it will be £9.7k/year.
#17
Forum Regular
Joined: Dec 2006
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 66
Re: UK Pension incl Lump Sum
It does. The only issue is that TT would not allow me to leave the zip code field for my UK pension provider empty, so I entered 99999. The income ends up on line 16a.
#18
Just Joined
Joined: Feb 2016
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 28
Re: UK Pension incl Lump Sum
Can I check if the UK lump sum ( assuming it is over the 25% tax free proportion) is taxed by the UK first and then you effectively deduct that from the tax due in the US, or if you file the Non Resident tax form with HM Inland Revenue is it paid entirely tax free in the UK and tax is only due in the US? Thanks
#19
Re: UK Pension incl Lump Sum
Can I check if the UK lump sum ( assuming it is over the 25% tax free proportion) is taxed by the UK first and then you effectively deduct that from the tax due in the US, or if you file the Non Resident tax form with HM Inland Revenue is it paid entirely tax free in the UK and tax is only due in the US? Thanks
If you take the 25% lump sum over your lifetime in annuity or as "substantially equal payments" so that it qualifies as income it will be both US and UK tax free.
#20
Just Joined
Joined: Feb 2016
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 28
Re: UK Pension incl Lump Sum
Thanks for the quick reply and i understand the first part of the answer if I take it as lump sum all in one go.
I am surprised though by the ability to receive the 25% tax free in the US if I convert to an annuity or " substantially equal payments" as I had assumed that it would still be considered as taxable income.
I am surprised though by the ability to receive the 25% tax free in the US if I convert to an annuity or " substantially equal payments" as I had assumed that it would still be considered as taxable income.
#21
Re: UK Pension incl Lump Sum
Thanks for the quick reply and i understand the first part of the answer if I take it as lump sum all in one go.
I am surprised though by the ability to receive the 25% tax free in the US if I convert to an annuity or " substantially equal payments" as I had assumed that it would still be considered as taxable income.
I am surprised though by the ability to receive the 25% tax free in the US if I convert to an annuity or " substantially equal payments" as I had assumed that it would still be considered as taxable income.
#22
Re: UK Pension incl Lump Sum
However, when you e-file, your IRS submission through Turbo Tax will only include the latter. In fact - look at the top of the TT 1099-R - you'll see that it says: "Keep for your records" ....(it's really like a worksheet for the 4852 and your backup records.
As many (all?) States won't allow for e-filing if a return includes Form 4852 - you should be aware of the above. In other words, when using snail mail...don't include the 1099-R when you post the required copy of the 1040 with your State return.
And yes, it's line 16a for pension/annuity income