TheCoach

I stumbled across this forum over the weekend and have been impressed with the insightful and informative knowledge everyone is able to provide. I wish to thank you in advance for your help and suggestions.

On Friday I was denied a TN visa at my local POE. I have an offer to coach college basketball in the US and the school wanted me to make a TN application at a Teacher-College. In addition to my coaching responsibilities I would be teaching two physical education classes. Nothing was stamped in my passport (is this normal on a denial?) and I was politely told that I should be applying for an H1B.

Would my coaching college basketball qualify as a classification for an H1B visa? There is no such thing as a formal coaching education; personal experience and the knowledge I have attained over the past 12 years of coaching would be my pre-requisites for the H1B. I do hold a BA (in Economics) which would be equivalent to a 3-years US BA. The position I have offered to me does require a BA, regardless of what field (16 of the 19 people on staff in the athletic department do not have phys. ed related degrees). Furthermore, the nature of coaching is that for the first year I would be paid only $3,000. Camp money and the money earned through the beginning of next season would probably make it closer to $10,000 for the fiscal year. I have friends in the area with which I can stay and make it work financially. This is a golden opportunity for me that may never come up again, and many people are willing to help me make it happen. So how would my H1B application shape up?

Finally, I have know my presented US girlfriend for 6 years - we have dated the last 3. During the past year the idea of marriage and a K1 has come up and prior to me having this job offer it is something we were considering. Should I be denied an H1B for some reason, would that give me two official US VISA denials? Will this hurt my chances of obtaining a K1 visa? We have more than enough boarding passes, phone bills and pictures to show that our relationship is valid. Believe me, I have the credit card bills to prove it as well

Any advice and or thoughts on the topic would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you for your time!

Stuart Brook

TheCoach wrote:
    > I stumbled across this forum over the weekend and have been impressed
    > with the insightful and informative knowledge everyone is able to
    > provide. I wish to thank you in advance for your help and suggestions.
    > On Friday I was denied a TN visa at my local POE. I have an offer to
    > coach college basketball in the US and the school wanted me to make a TN
    > application at a Teacher-College. In addition to my coaching
    > responsibilities I would be teaching two physical education classes.
    > Nothing was stamped in my passport (is this normal on a denial?) and I
    > was politely told that I should be applying for an H1B.
    > Would my coaching college basketball qualify as a classification for
    > an H1B visa? There is no such thing as a formal coaching education;
    > personal experience and the knowledge I have attained over the past 12
    > years of coaching would be my pre-requisites for the H1B. I do hold a
    > BA (in Economics) which would be equivalent to a 3-years US BA. The
    > position I have offered to me does require a BA, regardless of what
    > field (16 of the 19 people on staff in the athletic department do not
    > have phys. ed related degrees). Furthermore, the nature of coaching
    > is that for the first year I would be paid only $3,000. Camp money
    > and the money earned through the beginning of next season would
    > probably make it closer to $10,000 for the fiscal year. I have
    > friends in the area with which I can stay and make it work
    > financially. This is a golden opportunity for me that may never come
    > up again, and many people are willing to help me make it happen. So
    > how would my H1B application shape up?
    > Finally, I have know my presented US girlfriend for 6 years - we have
    > dated the last 3. During the past year the idea of marriage and a K1
    > has come up and prior to me having this job offer it is something we
    > were considering. Should I be denied an H1B for some reason, would that
    > give me two official US VISA denials? Will this hurt my chances of
    > obtaining a K1 visa? We have more than enough boarding passes, phone
    > bills and pictures to show that our relationship is valid. Believe me,
    > I have the credit card bills to prove it as well
    > Any advice and or thoughts on the topic would be greatly appreciated.
    > Thank you for your time!

Gee ... I hate to say "told you so" ... but I am sure I remember
suggesting that you would NOT get a TN for this. I'm not even sure it
would qualify for an H1B.

As a Canadian you did not get a visa denial. You got an ENTRY denial.
In all probability the denial was simply "insufficient documentation",
which is a catch all to say that in this case you didn't have sufficient
documents to justify your request for entry.

Remember too that the College is going to take the first step by
attempting to get an H1B employment approval, which should not hurt you.

As to the fiance visa ... it's unlikely to cause a problem, and H1B is
the best one to go for in the interim since it removes question of
immigrant intent.

Stuart

TheCoach

Stuart,

Yes you did mention about the TN - The school insisted that it fit. I was to teach two classes in addition to coaching and they 'argued' in the letter that 16 of the 19 people in the athletic staff didn't have a BA in their field. Furthermore, a BA was required for the job and they believed that such a fact deemed the position 'professional'. I agreed with you, just telling you what the school thought and why.

How come you don't think it would qualify for an H1B? Is there anything that qualifies?

Is it right for me to feel a little ticked that all I wanna do is coach basketball but for some reason this seems to be a huge ordeal? Haha, that is just me venting

So I probably got an entry denial. So if I am ever asked if I was refused admissio to the US, I should reply yes? Will this make it a big deal for me to visit friends in the US for a weekend in the future?

Yes the college is prepared to try the H1B, but is the salary an issue?

Can you comment in your posting that applying for an H1B would remove the quesion of intent? I would think that they might say "Hey, this guy applied for a TN then an H1B and now he wants a K1". Mind you, we have a valid relationship with all the documentation that I mentioned.

Thanks for your constructive comments.

Stuart Brook

TheCoach wrote:
    > Stuart,
    > Yes you did mention about the TN - The school insisted that it fit. I
    > was to teach two classes in addition to coaching and they 'argued' in
    > the letter that 16 of the 19 people in the athletic staff didn't have a
    > BA in their field. Furthermore, a BA was required for the job and they
    > believed that such a fact deemed the position 'professional'. I agreed
    > with you, just telling you what the school thought and why.
    > How come you don't think it would qualify for an H1B? Is there anything
    > that qualifies?

Again there is the matter of relevence. If you have 12+ years coaching
/ teaching experience you might get the H1B ...

    > Is it right for me to feel a little ticked that all I wanna do is coach
    > basketball but for some reason this seems to be a huge ordeal? Haha,
    > that is just me venting

I understand the frustration, but in a curious way, America is very
protectionist and is a country of laws, and are driven by the letter of
the law as opposed to the spirit of the law. The result is very strict
codification of laws. This is one of many reasons I'm no longer in the
US and returned to Canada.

    > So I probably got an entry denial. So if I am ever asked if I was
    > refused admissio to the US, I should reply yes? Will this make it a big
    > deal for me to visit friends in the US for a weekend in the future?

Yup. If you had the code # it would help, but explaining that you were
denied a TN because of mismatched education will be sufficient, and
probably won't be a problem.

    > Yes the college is prepared to try the H1B, but is the salary an issue?

Yes ... the salary must be appropriate for someone in your position.

    > Can you comment in your posting that applying for an H1B would remove
    > the quesion of intent? I would think that they might say "Hey, this guy
    > applied for a TN then an H1B and now he wants a K1". Mind you, we have
    > a valid relationship with all the documentation that I mentioned.

H1B permits immigrant intent, so you should be OK going H1B to K1. Just
give it a fair time.

Stuart

Sylvia Ottemoeller

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"TheCoach" wrote in message =
news:435132.1033934942@britishexpats-
.com...

    > I stumbled across this forum over the weekend and have been impressed
    > with the insightful and informative knowledge everyone is able to
    > provide. I wish to thank you in advance for your help and =
suggestions.
    >=20
    > On Friday I was denied a TN visa at my local POE. I have an offer to
    > coach college basketball in the US and the school wanted me to make a =
TN
    > application at a Teacher-College. In addition to my coaching
    > responsibilities I would be teaching two physical education classes.
    > Nothing was stamped in my passport (is this normal on a denial?) and I
    > was politely told that I should be applying for an H1B.
    >=20
    > Would my coaching college basketball qualify as a classification for
    > an H1B visa? There is no such thing as a formal coaching education;
    > personal experience and the knowledge I have attained over the past 12
    > years of coaching would be my pre-requisites for the H1B. I do hold a
    > BA (in Economics) which would be equivalent to a 3-years US BA. The
    > position I have offered to me does require a BA, regardless of what
    > field (16 of the 19 people on staff in the athletic department do not
    > have phys. ed related degrees). Furthermore, the nature of coaching
    > is that for the first year I would be paid only $3,000. Camp money
    > and the money earned through the beginning of next season would
    > probably make it closer to $10,000 for the fiscal year. I have
    > friends in the area with which I can stay and make it work
    > financially. This is a golden opportunity for me that may never come
    > up again, and many people are willing to help me make it happen. So
    > how would my H1B application shape up?

The mismatch of field of degree to field of the job position will make =
this H-1B petition rather tricky, and I would suggest that a good =
immigration attorney be hired to prepare the petition. =20

The terms of the salary as you have described them will be unacceptable =
to INS. You must have a guaranteed wage which falls within 95% of the =
"prevailing wage." The employer can obtain H-1B status for a part time =
position, and get an hourly wage determination, but you should realize =
that INS can audit the H-1B, ask for payroll records, and check the =
number of hours you actually worked. =20

There are a few different ways to obtain a prevailing wage determination =
(PWD). The least risky way is for your employer to get a PWD is to send =
a prevailing wage request to the state employment service agency (SESA) =
of its state. =20

There is a way to get an idea of how the PWD will come out: =20

Go to
http://edc.dws.state.ut.us/owl.asp.
Under "Advanced (Keyword) =
Search" select the state, and click on Continue. On the next page, =
under "Advanced Search," select the county in which the job is located. =
Under "Select an Occupation from the list" select an appropriate job =
classification. =20



I saw two which might fit your job: 25-1193 and 27-2022. =20



Under "Select a Data Source," change the selection from "All Industries" =
to "Education(ACWIA)" and click on Search. =20

=20

You will see a Level I prevailing wage and a Level 2 prevailing wage. =
The state employment service agency will select level 1 or level 2 based =
on the job description and requirements that the employer provides them =
on the Prevailing Wage Request.=20



In Los Angeles, it appears that you would have to be offered at least =
$30,000 per year to meet the prevailing wage requirement.=20




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Â
"TheCoach" <[email protected]> wrote in=20
message news:435132.1033934942@briti-
shexpats.com...
    > I stumbled across this forum =
over the=20
weekend and have been impressed> with the insightful and =
informative=20
knowledge everyone is able to> provide. I wish to thank you =
in=20
advance for your help and suggestions.> > On Friday I was =
denied a=20
TN visa at my local POE. I have an offer to> coach college=20
basketball in the US and the school wanted me to make a TN> =
application=20
at a Teacher-College. In addition to my coaching> =
responsibilities=20
I would be teaching two physical education classes.> Nothing was =
stamped=20
in my passport (is this normal on a denial?) and I> was politely =
told=20
that I should be applying for an H1B.> > Would my coaching =
college=20
basketball qualify as a classification for> an H1B visa? =
There is=20
no such thing as a formal coaching education;> personal =
experience and=20
the knowledge I have attained over the past 12> years of coaching =
would=20
be my pre-requisites for the H1B. I do hold a> BA (in =
Economics)=20
which would be equivalent to a 3-years US BA. The> position =
I have=20
offered to me does require a BA, regardless of what> field (16 of =
the 19=20
people on staff in the athletic department do not> have phys. ed =
related=20
degrees). Furthermore, the nature of coaching> is that for =
the=20
first year I would be paid only $3,000. Camp money> and the =
money=20
earned through the beginning of next season would> probably make =
it=20
closer to $10,000 for the fiscal year. I have> friends in =
the area=20
with which I can stay and make it work> financially. This =
is a=20
golden opportunity for me that may never come> up again, and many =
people=20
are willing to help me make it happen. So> how would my H1B =

application shape up?
The mismatch of field of degree to =
field of the job=20
position will make this H-1B petition rather tricky, and I would suggest =
that a=20
good immigration attorney be hired to prepare the petition. =

Â
The terms of the salary as you have=20
described them will be unacceptable to INS. You must =
have a=20
guaranteed wage which falls within 95% of the "prevailing wage."Â =
The=20
employer can obtain H-1B status for a part time position, and get an =
hourly wage=20
determination, but you should realize that INS can audit the H-1B, ask =
for=20
payroll records, and check the number of hours you actually =
worked. =20

Â
There are a few different ways to =
obtain a=20
prevailing wage determination (PWD). The least risky way is for =
your=20
employer to get a PWD is to send a prevailing wage request to the state=20
employment service agency (SESA) of its state.Â
Â
There is a way to get an idea of how =
the PWD will=20
come out:Â
Â

Go to http://edc.dws.state.ut.us/ow=
l.asp. =20
Under "Advanced (Keyword) Search" select the state, and click on =
Continue. =20
On the next page, under "Advanced Search," select the county in which the=20
job is located. Under "Select an =
Occupation=20
from the list" select an appropriate job classification. =20

Â
I saw two which might fit your job:Â 25-1193 and =
27-2022.Â
Â
Under "Select a Data Source," change the selection =
from "All=20
Industries" to "Education(ACWIA)" and click on Search. Â
Â
You will see a Level I prevailing wage and a Level 2 prevailing =

wage. The state employment service agency will select level 1 or =
level 2=20
based on the job description and requirements that the employer provides =
them on=20
the Prevailing Wage Request.
Â
In Los Angeles, it appears that you would have to be offered at =
least=20
$30,000 per year to meet the prevailing wage requirement. =

Â

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