Englishmum

OK....a big rant to start with and sorry this post has turned out to be a long one:

I'm a bit cheesed off at the moment with my car. In general I love the car - but I think I soon need to part ways with it.

It's a Volvo XC90 and we bought it new 7 years ago and it's been accident-free. The problem is, when things go wrong with Volvos, it's very expensive. We've always had it serviced and maintained at the dealers where we bought it and have all the full service history receipts.

Thank God we took out the extended warranty with it when the first factory one expired....a few months later my spouse went skiing up in Vermont and the transmission failed when he put it into 'W' winter mode (at around 48,000 miles) although he was able to drive it back to NJ. Luckily the extended warranty covered the cost (nearly $4k!). I understand that there may be a class action lawsuit as many of these cars have had the same problem.

Now I don't use the car much as I'm splitting my time between here and Singapore, but since I know next to nothing about cars I did take out another extended warranty earlier this year. It's just reached 70k miles....and since I got back in early September its *twice* been back to the Volvo dealers; the parking brake - it's a footbrake not a handbrake - jammed and I couldn't reverse it out of the garage. It had to be towed to the dealers. This wasn't covered under the warrranty and cost $600 A few days later when I was driving the car it was making a dreadful loud squealing sound - and there was a burning smell - but I was able to drive it back to the dealers; it was something to do with the parking brake again and they gave me a loaner car. This time I just had to pay the $100 excess.

Yesterday my son parked the Volvo on the street to get his car out....there is a warning light saying that the coolant level is low and to pull over safely... I've parked it back in the garage and thought as it is Sunday I'd get my son to take me to PepBoys and buy some anti-freeze. When I had my old (stick-shift) cars in England I used to buy some RadWeld if there was a leak, and top up with anti-freeze from Halfords or a petrol station. To my knowledge, I've not noticed any leaks from the radiator on this Volvo.

However....I've had a quick look in the car's handbook and it says "Normally, the coolant does not need to be changed. If the system must be drained, consult your Volvo retailer....." "Top off with Volvo Genuine Coolant/Antifreeze only". What has freaked me out is what I read below on this link....

http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.f18a651 (OMG - re; coolant leaking into the engine and headgasket needing to be replaced, costing $4.4k )


Now I have a fear that if I don't use their own brand anti-freeze it will be an excuse to invalidate the warranty. I can't get any bloody Volvo branded antifreeze on a Sunday as they're closed, so I'll have to stay at home today

I have a feeling that it's all connected with the car going in for repairs in the first place, and it's not due to be serviced for another 5k miles. I'll call Volvo in the morning and I guess they'll tell me to get it back to them....more $$$ and time wasted and I guess it will have to be towed (they are about 6 or 7 miles away).

Although I love the car, I only wanted to keep it for about 2 more years when I will probably return to live in England but I think it's going to now be one thing going wrong after another (and I've put four new tyres and a new battery into the damn thing too!). Grrrr

So....if I replace it, I think I'd only want a small secondhand car of about 12-18 months and would definitely want a manufacturer's/official dealers warranty so would probably want to buy from a dealer than a private purchase. I like my son's Subaru Outback, it's a 4 wheel drive and can get up the slope on our drive in winter weather.

How do I find out how to get a fair trade-in price on an older car? I haven't a clue how to negotiate when buying a car and trading it in (I'm not confident to try and sell it privately on my own and my spouse is almost never in the US.

Ray

you wont get a great deal from a subaru dealer.. he will just trade it on
they will go by book price

cluedweasel

As Ray said, they'll probably wholesale the car on. Look at the trade-in / wholesale value on these sites and use it as a guide;

http://www.kbb.com/
http://www.nadaguides.com/

Most dealers I know go by the NADA guides more than any other.

Another tip. Negotiate the price of the car you are buying separately. They'll just use smoke and mirrors on you if you try to negotiate the trade in price and selling price together. Pick the car you want and get the price on that first. Then let them know you want to trade your current car. Good luck.

RoadWarriorFromLP

It's likely that even a Volvo dealer would wholesale your trade-in at an auction. (Your car is a bit old for the dealer to resell it themselves.)

Because of this, a dealer is unlikely to give you much for it. If your goal is to get the highest price, then your best strategy would be to sell it independently.

If the manufacturer **requires** you to use a specific coolant, oil, etc, then heed their warning. Automakers increasingly are using unique formulations for their fluids, and you should take those requirements seriously. If the automaker merely recommends its own product, then you can ignore that and buy whatever conforms to their standards.

When you have a problem, it can make sense to first check the NHTSA website to see whether there is a Technical Service Bulletin (TSB) or recall notice that applies to you. When that is the case, you won't have to pay for the repair, even if the car is out of warranty. Recalls are not common, but TSBs can be.

TSBs - http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/tsbs/
Recalls - http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/recalls/recallsearch.cfm

As far as repairs are concerned, find a good independent shop that specializes in Volvos. That should greatly reduce your repair costs. Take it to the dealer for recalls, TSBs and warranty work, but otherwise get your service done at a good independent if you can.

Enthusiast forums can be useful places to learn about the problems that are common to your car. Edmunds is worth a look, but you might find better information elsewhere.

Without knowing why you need coolant, it's hard to recommend that you trade in the car now, given your intentions to leave the country. The problems do sound annoying, but not serious enough to dump the car, at least not thus far.

If you do decide to trade in your car to the dealer and purchase a different car, then start by negotiating the new car purchase, before negotiating the value of your trade-in second.

The dealer will try to confuse you by combining everything together and trying to get you to focus on monthly payments instead of the new car purchase price, but you are better off if you keep these transactions separate. Remember that most new car purchases consist of three separate components: (a) the price that you pay for the new car, (b) the financing terms (including your down payment, the interest rate and the term/ maturity), and (c) the price that the dealer pays for the old car. A lot of the car buying process is essentially a shell game, in which the dealer tries to distract you while he moves the numbers around in his favor.

TimNiceBut

Try finding a good Volvo specialist instead - it's not uncommon for more modern vehicles to have certain quirks that aren't covered in the dealers' maintenance schedule - "sealed for life" systems are a typical example. In general the affected systems seem to last a lot longer when they're regularly maintained and have the fluids changed.

I realise this doesn't help with trying to trade in the vehicle but even if you get shot of the Volvo, you might want to keep this in mind for your next vehicle.

Dan725

Is there a Carmax (www.carmax.com) anywhere near you? I like how they separate the buying and selling process. They will look at your car and give you a price, regardless of whether you buy from them or not - and the offer will be good for 7 days. Might not always be the best price......but at the very least it will give you a ballpark figure you can then beat the other dealers up with.

avanutria

I second this. I read a great book on how to buy a car once. It was saying to get a firm trade in price settled first, if necessary by insinuating that the trade in value was of most importance to you and you are less concerned about monthly payments, interest rate etc. Get the trade in value in writing and initialed by the dealer. Then, change tactics - now the interest rate etc are of most importance to you. If they try to adjust the trade in value, point out that the initialed value that they gave you is the only value you will accept.

Edited to add: I am pretty sure this is the book I had, and I highly recommend it:

http://www.amazon.com/Insiders-Guide...216812&sr=8-14