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Passport Renewal Does not Require Countersignatory

Passport Renewal Does not Require Countersignatory

Old Apr 16th 2020, 7:46 pm
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Default Passport Renewal Does not Require Countersignatory

Hello How are you!

I was surprised when I submitted my passport for renewal. It expired in 2013 and I live in the UK most of the year but also live in the US for 2 months with my son. I submitted my application through the online service for a passport renewal, and it did not bring up the section for me to enter an individuals details to confirm my identity etc, would you know why?

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Old Apr 16th 2020, 8:34 pm
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Default Re: Passport Renewal Does not Require Countersignatory

Originally Posted by FloridaBritishExpat View Post
Hello How are you!

I was surprised when I submitted my passport for renewal. It expired in 2013 and I live in the UK most of the year but also live in the US for 2 months with my son. .....
Which passport? US, UK, or another country? And how are you using it to travel if it expired in 2013?
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Old Apr 16th 2020, 8:37 pm
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Default Re: Passport Renewal Does not Require Countersignatory

Sorry my apoligies. I used to travel back and forth from the UK to the US. Now I am in the UK since 2013 as my UK passport has expired. However I was always under the impression that I would need a countersignature when renewing my passport but I guess that is not the case. For a UK Adult Passport Renewal, I believe you only need a countersignature if the way you look has changed from the original passport. Let me know if I am comprehending this correct?
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Old Apr 16th 2020, 8:39 pm
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Default Re: Passport Renewal Does not Require Countersignatory

Originally Posted by FloridaBritishExpat View Post
Sorry my apoligies. I used to travel back and forth from the UK to the US. Now I am in the UK since 2013 as my UK passport has expired. However I was always under the impression that I would need a countersignature when renewing my passport but I guess that is not the case. For a UK Adult Passport Renewal, I believe you only need a countersignature if the way you look has changed from the original passport. Let me know if I am comprehending this correct?
Correct, most British adult passport renewals do not require a counter signature. This was not previously the case if there was both a significant gap between expiry and the new application, and the previous passport was not a digital passport.
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Old Apr 17th 2020, 10:50 am
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Default Re: Passport Renewal Does not Require Countersignatory

My passport (RFID) had minor water damaged so I decided to get a replacement rather than take a chance. It still had 5 years on it. I applied for a replacement and was required to have a cosign and attend the passport office. I've probably had 5 adult passports never with any gaps. I wonder if it's random selection?
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Old Apr 17th 2020, 1:50 pm
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Default Re: Passport Renewal Does not Require Countersignatory

I have to say that the UK online system was brilliant. I renewed my daughters passport earlier this year and it was so quick and easy, with great tracking provided along the process. Took the picture on my phone at home, had a friend in the UK do the identity validation online and paid online. From application to getting everything back it only took a few weeks, 10 days of that was USPS getting the old passport from Cleveland to London. They have certainly made things a lot more streamlined and easier to do if you are out of the UK.
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Old Apr 17th 2020, 2:08 pm
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Default Re: Passport Renewal Does not Require Countersignatory

Security for renewal of expired passport is tighter. I fell foul of this when I let my teenage daughters' passports expire.
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Old Apr 17th 2020, 4:20 pm
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Default Re: Passport Renewal Does not Require Countersignatory

Originally Posted by user77575775 View Post
My passport (RFID) had minor water damaged so I decided to get a replacement rather than take a chance. It still had 5 years on it. I applied for a replacement and was required to have a cosign and attend the passport office. I've probably had 5 adult passports never with any gaps. I wonder if it's random selection?
It's probably because it was damaged - it would be quite a good way to get a "genuine" fraudulent passport - steal/ acquire a real passport, damage it, then apply for a replacement using your own picture, and voila! You have a "totally legit" bogus passport.
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Old Apr 17th 2020, 5:46 pm
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Default Re: Passport Renewal Does not Require Countersignatory

Originally Posted by Pulaski View Post
It's probably because it was damaged - it would be quite a good way to get a "genuine" fraudulent passport - steal/ acquire a real passport, damage it, then apply for a replacement using your own picture, and voila! You have a "totally legit" bogus passport.
You used to have to give 2 photos when you applied for a passport. Now it’s all digital I would hope they save a copy of the picture in a data base, so even if they can’t compare the photo in the passport to the one stored on the RFID chip they will have a reference independent of the ones in the passport. But this is a government we are taking about so logic may not apply.....
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Old Apr 17th 2020, 6:39 pm
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Default Re: Passport Renewal Does not Require Countersignatory

Originally Posted by tht View Post
You used to have to give 2 photos when you applied for a passport. Now it’s all digital I would hope they save a copy of the picture in a data base, so even if they can’t compare the photo in the passport to the one stored on the RFID chip they will have a reference independent of the ones in the passport. But this is a government we are taking about so logic may not apply.....
All true, but give me a stolen passport for the right gender and race, similar height and weight, and ballpark age, and a photo of someone with makeup and wig to approximate the photo in the passport, and then some time with photoshop to tweak the photo subtly to match the eye-nose-mouth-ear geometry of the original passport holder, and I could give you a plausible photo that would be a close enough match to pass all but the most determined scrutiny.
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Old Apr 17th 2020, 9:34 pm
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Default Re: Passport Renewal Does not Require Countersignatory

Originally Posted by Pulaski View Post
All true, but give me a stolen passport for the right gender and race, similar height and weight, and ballpark age, and a photo of someone with makeup and wig to approximate the photo in the passport, and then some time with photoshop to tweak the photo subtly to match the eye-nose-mouth-ear geometry of the original passport holder, and I could give you a plausible photo that would be a close enough match to pass all but the most determined scrutiny.
I always assumed that at least in certain countries they were checked against a database with the original photo as one comes up on the screen... although that could be the one encoded on the rfid chip. I thought the point now was that a computer did the matching to avoid what your describe.... your description sounds like something out of a Jason Bourne movie.
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Old Apr 18th 2020, 1:28 am
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Default Re: Passport Renewal Does not Require Countersignatory

Originally Posted by tht View Post
I always assumed that at least in certain countries they were checked against a database with the original photo as one comes up on the screen... although that could be the one encoded on the rfid chip. I thought the point now was that a computer did the matching to avoid what your describe.... your description sounds like something out of a Jason Bourne movie.
I am not sure what you're comparing with what? I wasn't talking about tinkering with the picture in the previously issued passport - why would anyone think that would work for more than 5 minutes at an off-line encounter with a government agent?

Under the scenario I described above, the original, genuine passport isn't tampered with, so yeah, when you send in the damaged passport, the match to the Passport Office's archive picture would be perfect. And you are applying for a new passport, with a new pair of photos, and so long as the picture is reasonably similar it would pass visual inspection. ... To pass the computer/ automated inspection the picture would have to be stretched or compressed slightly to ensure that the relative spacing of the main facial features (eyes, nose, mouth, chin, and ears) matches those in the picture in the photograph.

Last edited by Pulaski; Apr 18th 2020 at 1:30 am.
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