dj6372

Hey Antihero welcome!

I've just moved from SoCal (Marina Del Rey) to Atlanta so will give you my thoughts.

90k For Production Manager for agriculture in the area, seems about right, plus a car very nice, is the job involving a lot of travel? Company cars are not the norm here unless you are expected to travel a lot. I worked in Production Manager and Ops Manager roles and a car was never an option.

Check the bonus objectives, I know it sounds obvious but are they achievable................................

Medical, when they say they will cover you, do they mean only you, because that generally is the cheaper part..........................once you add the family then the cost becomes an issue.

Rent is eye watering, I paid a lot more than $2400 for a small (nice) 1 bed apartment, we actually looked at moving to the area, but were less than impressed with the accommodation standard and availability

Definitely need a second car for Mrs Antihero, you will be in a beautiful area, but the transport links are hopeless.

5k relo............................forget it, I moved from LA to Atlanta and we used the full 15k company relo offered, and we only had a small amount of crap/stuff.................

One thing is bugging me though, why bring in someone on a Visa for a PM role, its not really a hi end role, and there would be a lot of local talent available.

In my opinion go for it, its great area and opportunity but renegotiate!!

1. Really really pin down the medical, the cost/no cost will make a big difference.
2. Ask for more relo.
3. Green card.

All the best, its a great part of the world.

Antihero

Hiya , thanks for the reply , good information to know

Well we work in a company that requires specialist knowledge so finding someone who has experience in what we do is alot harder , its also the potential next step they are offering me in 1 to 2 years. The offer of the car is really to balance the perks of the current Contract in the UK , Medical would be all the family and this again is to support the financial impact and difference to the UK.

I have gone back to them with a few questions today , so hopefully some feedback by monday ! lol but its great everyone on here giving me feedback and ideas , i was starting to feel a little overwhelmed and will i be be making the right decision for me and my family to move out there !! its a big move and i do not want to get it wrong or contracted where i am stuck in a rutt because i didn't ask for more or get the detail right .....

jammiie

I would push them much harder on the relo fee and also be sure to ask for it as a lump sum (after tax) rather than any kind of expense account as there will be a lot of indirect costs associated with your move that you need to offset against this. I moved out to Boston in 2017 in a non-managerial role and was given a $25k (after tax) lump sum for moving expenses.

For me, my relo fee had to cover things like:
- Furniture shipping
- Reimbursement of summer holiday that I had already booked and paid for from the UK which I would have lost.
- Mortgage costs while I sold my UK house (I didn't want to have to find money for UK mortgage and US rent)
- Buying out existing UK contracts like Phone and TV package (we had recently taken two new iPhones with TMobile and had to pay a significant amount to break the 24-month contract early)
- Cat shipping
- x months worth of lost income for my spouse while she waiting for her EAD to arrive to allow her to work in the US
- Deposit on US housing rental
- Depost on US car
- All new electrical items due to the voltage difference

Most of these things I wouldn't have been able to input receipts for against an expense system so I was insistent that it needed to be a lump sum and I was so glad I did.

Pulaski

It might seem crazy, but I have no doubt that it easily possible, especially if any in-patient care is involved.

​​​​​​​Ten years ago I developed blood poisoning resulting from an infected skin ulcer, and was refered for three days/nights of in-patient treatment, comprising three days on an antibiotic drip, plus the most minor surgery imaginable under general anesthetic - removal of a small septic skin ulcer on my arm, and a smaller one on my leg. The cost? .... Over $20k!!! And that was ten years ago!

sherbert

To illustrate the healthcare a little better, they might mean this: health insurance is provided to *you* for free. If you want to add your family you will need to pay a monthly fee. My OH's company offers health insurance to employees for a nominal fee of $5/month. As soon as you add a spouse to the insurance it shoots up to $600/month. Yes. $600. If you add on kids, up it goes.

Whatever package you choose, you'll have extra costs on top of your monthly payments: i.e. money that you must pay to visit the doctor, to have a test, to get medication. It's usually called a co-pay and is usually a percentage of the final price. E.g. you pay $20 for each doctor visit, or $10 for each prescription you need. On top of that you might have a deductible which you must meet before the insurance company will start paying out in full and you don't need to contribute with your co-pays. Our company for example puts a $4000 deductible in place, which my OH blows in the first month of each year due to treatment for a chronic condition. After that, all our visits are free (we still pay $10 for every medication prescribed). So we know that we are going to pay 4k in January every year and then not much more if we stay in network (i.e. visit the doctors who work specifically with our insurance company).

Do not underestimate the eye-watering costs of healthcare is all I am trying to say - it's likely to cost you about 800- 1000 a month to insure your entire family even if the company is saying it's 'no cost' because what they probably mean is that it's no cost to you on your own. Try to have someone from the company explain the different options to you as there might be e a couple of different packages that you can take out and some might be more suitable than others.

Having lived in both SoCal and now in NorCal, prices and caveats mentioned above are all correct. You'll be absolutely shocked by the price of absolutely everything in California, including fresh food, booze, clothing for kids (not VAT exempt), family activities, childcare, housing (and with the quality vs price ratio). The only things that are cheap are petrol and adult clothes (and not in a good way: crappy fabrics designed to be worn once and thrown away).

However, your family is young and you are being transferred (rather than having to jump through hoops and wait years for a visa) so think of it as an adventure.

Pulaski

But, while relatively rare, it isn't unheard of for someone on a "true expat package" to have healthcare costs entirely reimbursed. .... The problem then comes if the transfer is made "permanent" typically linked to a green card application, then all the expat benefits go away, including subsidized/reimbursed healthcare, flights home, etc. go away.

​​​​​​​Oh and with careful planning, and smart choices of insurance plan, employer-backed healthcare can cost a LOT less than "$800-$1,000 per month". All-in, we probably pay only around $300-$400 month for health insurance and all other add-on fees for a family of three,and that includes a typical one "emergency" trip to an urgent care clinic, or even to the A&E.

TheKingOfHearts

I'll add my 2 cents here on the Healthcare package; I work for a huge conglomerate and for those in the right corporate banding who are transferred internationally (we call them GME's (Globally Mobile Employee)) they are covered under a completely separate Healthcare plan than "local" employees for a number of years. This plan is worldwide (I know, crazy..) coverage at ZERO cost (including co-pays, deductibles etc) to the employee whilst they're part of this transfer program.

So whilst I agree with others that it's almost unheard of that you be offered a $0 option, it's not impossible.

aquatone

For the OP I am going to put a different perspective on the comments above. I moved from the UK to Santa Barbara just up the coast and I know Ventura very well, and then to the Bay area where I currently live. Two places that have a reputation for being as expensive as they get in the USA. What you have to remember is that you will be embracing a different lifestyle and the things you might have spent money on in the UK you may not in CA and vice versa. Just the climate means you are not going to eat 3 heavy meals a day. Eating out can be much cheaper than in the UK and for good quality if you look for it and I am not talking about iHop or Burger King. Yes eating in is always going to be cheaper, but as an example if you shop in (say) Trader Joes which is perfectly good quality you are going to pay less than Safeway let alone Whole Foods. One of the big differences between the US and the UK is that there is far less price homogeneity. You want brand quality clothes? Drive down to the Factory Outlets in Oxnard and get significant discounts from the local Mall. Yes housing anywhere near the coast is expensive and so is water... but a lot of things are cheaper. You are not going to be spending as much heating your home in winter and being near the coast you probably won't need AC in the summer. I personally find the UK shockingly expensive for so many things. (Especially eating out and clothes, electronics, cars etc) Yes some things are more expensive in CA, some are cheaper, fruit, vegetables for example. You just have to look for it. Its a different lifestyle and balance of spending and is not as black and white as painted. Given you have the medical side fairly well covered it seems, a big part of the adventure is finding out.

I do think that $90K is on the low side for the Ventura area and I think you could make a case for rounding it up a bit, but with the other benefits it may well be worth it. If you decline can you go through the rest of your life wondering "what if only...". Seems you have been given a great opportunity and even if it does not work, you will have experienced something different. If it does though, it will be the best thing you have ever done. It was for me when I moved to the area with 2 kids of 3 and 5 and not a great deal more than what you are being offered. (And that was in Santa Barbara!)

carcajou

$90,000 is fine; that is a lot more than most Americans make. Only 5% of the country makes six figures and 2% above $200,000. If your wife is also going to work that will be easily doable. That money certainly will not get you Beverly Hills but the LA area is huge.

Fully agree with others on the health care. My grandfather had a pacemaker changed some years ago and that would have been $50,000 had he not been covered fully.

Pulaski

"Most" Americans also have a standard of living that is not worth crossing the North Atlantic for. The OP should bare in mind that compromising on housing costs in the US invariably comes hand in hand with compromises on quality of schools, and on personal safety with respect to firearms usage, and availability of illegal drugs in the neighborhood.

​​​​​​​Obviously $90,000 is survivable, but even in a low cost state you won't be living the American dream on $90,000, and California is usually recognized as being among the most expensive states to live in.

Steerpike

To be fair to the OP, you should clarify this to state that the 'cost' of over $20k was what the hospitals/doctors billed the insurance company (I assume), NOT what you had to pay out of your own pocket.

To the OP, I'll also add to the healthcare discussion. Think of healthcare in the US as being made up of two major components; insurance, and use. The insurance in your case is going to be through your employer. 'Most' employers cover the employee's insurance cost at or close to 100%, but don't cover 'spouse and kids' at 100%. So you need to find out what their coverage is for spouse and kids. I would guess that your company normally covers only the employee at 100%, but in you case they are offering to pay the spouse and kids premiums as part of the 'package' they are offering you. That would be how I interpret their statement that they are covering your healthcare '100%'. So let's assume that's the insurance side covered. Now we move on to 'use'.

If you are healthy and accident-free, you don't pay anything more. But let's assume there are various 'medical events' in your family. The company will typically have 'one plan for everyone' (some offer a few choices). Any 'plan' will have deductibles, copays, and max out-of-pocket (MOOP) numbers. For a family, these could easily be in the realm of $5,000 (deductible) and $10,000 (MOOP) - maybe more. The MOOP number is the worst-case scenario, and you should at least consider that it could happen - almost 'any' significant event can run bills up $20,000 (as in Pulaski's example above). It's doubtful that your employer is offering to reimburse you the actual out-of-pocket expenses as it is an unknown. BUT - you may just be able to get them to offer reimbursement of that; if you stay healthy they pay nothing, if you actually have an 'incident' then they cover your costs.

In summary - find out if they are covering all your INSURANCE costs, and also find out if they plan to cover your actual out-of-pocket costs, should they occur.

I've been in the US for over 35 years and only had 1 'medical event'. But you have kids, and kids are ... kids.

You should be able to work up a budget by now and see if the $90k is going to cut it. The tax situation is pretty easy to figure out with both Federal and State components (CA has one of the highest state tax rates so don't ignore that). Both Fed and State taxes are progressive so don't just apply the percentage. You'll also pay Social Security tax at about 6.2% flat rate, and Medicare tax at about 1.45% flat rate (that is, not progressive). There are more opportunities in the US to deduct items (compared to UK), but until / unless you buy a home you aren't likely to be able to take advantage of them.

Good Luck! I came to CA back in 1983 and loved it, and still love it today.

robtuck

Even if all the OP is getting is the family fully insured at the employers cost, that's pretty good and worth a fair chunk you'd usually have to add onto salary. Lets not forget the NHS is not FREE, the tax burden will be much lower as a result when comparing disposable income vs. current UK level.

Pulaski

I agree, but that doesn't really help with the question as to what sort of lifestyle you can bankroll with $90k/$105k gross pay.

The problem I see with Antihero's comment about his wife working, is that the cost of daycare for the children may wipe out most of her net pay, such that there is at best marginal benefit to her working. The cost and standard of daycare for children is highly variable - I am not sure what the current costs for daycare are in California, but unless you are comfortable leaving the children in an "in-home daycare" (literally in someone's home), I would imagine that the cost per child per month would start at at least $2k, and quite possibly more, and if Mrs AH is working then there is still going to be the cost of after school care (and maybe before school care) when the children start school. So for two children, $4k/mth after tax is equivalent to over $60k pa gross.

robtuck

He did mention Nursery when explaining current situation, so while some funding is probably available, that's equally as expensive in the UK these days - certainly a job down the local Tesco wouldn't cover the childcare fees from a private nursery. He's on GBP45k today, so when you roll the Healthcare benefit in, plus the bonus potential and one car being covered, he's probably looking at a doubling up of take home pay allowing for FX. With one child at school, and the other likely only a year away from Pre-K? the childcare may balance out with their current spend. Rent is going to be the big one - not an issue if moving from London, but maybe a painful exercise if from Stoke.

Antihero

Hey all... thanks for more replies... well currently we mortgage our house and nearly paid so payments are 1 quarter to US rent. My wife works part time currently and with all the free hours for childcare and salary sacrifice childcare only costs us about 100 a month for 30 hours a week. Looking at prices US looks about 1000 dollars a month full time.

I am just trying to work out if it's worth the move. We get to save about 1500 pounds a month here and that with having a good lifestyle , not extravagant but good. I just don't want not to be able to do anything in the US as we couldn't afford it