Chandler

Hi

I'm in the process of moving from London to NY with work and I am currently negotiating my package. My company are refusing to simple FX my current wage as they want to take into account living costs and are offering me the equivalent of 10% less than my sterling wage.

My question is this, is NY (by which I mean Manhattan) really much cheaper than London on a day-to-day basis? For those of you who are out there, would you have sacrificed 10% of your GBP wage to make the move?

All comments would be extremely welcome.

Many thanks in advance

Big Vern

Here's a good starting point - not the most accurate indicator but ok...

http://www.homefair.com/homefair/cal...c.html?type=to

If you are earning say 40K gbp,
-10% = 36k grp at the current rate = $ 65,728

XE.com will help you convert....

NC Penguin

Is your employer reducing your salary whilst you work in NY on the basis that the cost of living is 10% less than in London?

Hmmm. I find it a little hard to believe that NY is that much less than London.

Are you being offered a COLA (cost of living allowance) on top of the regular salary? That may be why you're getting offered a lower base salary.

Also, more generous employers offer expats on assignment health insurance cover. This is especially important if living and working in the US (just read threads on this forum about medical bills/cover).

If you're single, you may be able to afford to live in Manhattan.

Just my 5 cents.

Englishmum

Your bargaining strength can come down to whether or not how badly they want/need *you* in NYC...and how senior you are in the company.

So....the two questions I have for you are: Did you ask to transfer to NYC or did they ask you to go there?

and - what job do you do?

(I'll speak with my husband later tonight....he works in Times Square for a British company (L1A visa holder) but he's on a business trip in London right now).

Ben

We don't live in NYC but do live in NYstate (Long Island). The cost of living in Manhattan is very comparable to London as long as your company is paying health insurance for you totally and you don't need a car. Health insurance is very expensive. If they expect you to pay for it yourself, entirely (including any family you may have remember) then negotiate this into your salary. For a family policy it is approx. $12,000 a year. Cars are very expensive to keep if you are living in Manhattan. Not only is the insurance a lot more than back home you also having garaging fees.

Just remember, just like London, you don't have to live in Manhattan. There are the boroughs, Long Island and New Jersey. If you choose NJ just remember that your taxes will be different because you have to pay both NY and NJ taxes. While you don't have to pay the full amount as there is a policy between the two states for this, it is more than what you would have to pay if you lived in NYstate.

anotherlimey

There wouldn't be many places I would be willing to take a pay cut to move to. NY is expensive to live in, especially Manhattan. How badly do they need you out there?

Yahoo has listings for the cost of living for every zipcode, I seem to remember that where I lived (on Long Island) the average household income was $55000 but the average expenditure was $59000.

I have a feeling most companies would just transfer the current salary, my company did when I went to live in NY. But I guess it depends on what else they will give you.

-tom

Pulaski

I'd guess that your employer is in the right ballpark, not because it is much cheaper to live in New York, but because the exchange rate is screwy.

When I moved to New York in 2001, working in Manhattan but commuting in from White Plains, I found it to be as expensive as London, if not more so, BUT that was when the exchange rate was $1.40/£, ..... and looking back even at that rate I took a 10% paycut!

Over the past ten years the $/£ rate has swung too and fro a bit, but has generally averaged around the $1.50-$1.60/£ mark, and I think that that is what your employer is really saying - "we'll give you a 'typical' exchange rate for your UK salary not the current rate", because one thing is certain, it does not cost 28% more (change in FX rate/ rate in 2001) to live in New York today than when I moved over in 2002.

I don't know what your job is but your employer may also be saying "this is the rate for the job in New York, like it or lump it!" And that is a whole other question!

Chandler

Thanks for all the info. All of the above posts are greatly appreciated.

As requested, here are some facts and figures.

- If I move I will be dropping an initial $11,000-$15,000 per annum, which breaks down as:
- Current wage if FX'ed from GBP to USD is $74,000. At present the offer, albeit initial, is $63,000.
- At the turn of the year my wage will rise in the UK office to (if FX'ed from GBP) $78,000, but I have no guarantee that this rise will be allocated in full by the NY Office.
- I fully expect my medical bill to be picked up by the firm.
- There will be no extra per month towards living costs.
- I will be moving on an L1, which will allow for my wife to work once her EAD comes through.

As per most humans I'm loathed to accept any cut in wage, but I'd like to live in NY for a few years and I wouldn't complain if that meant dropping a couple of thousand $ because I am not viewing this as a money making exercise.

In addition I appreciate that a couple of years ago my wage if FX’ed at 1.60 as opposed to the current 1.82 would result in a level of approx $63,000. It is for this reason that I am trying to mitigate the vagaries of the FX rate from my decision and instead focus upon what it costs to have a comfortable standard of living in NYC.

One final point of note, I omitted the figures off my first posting because everything is relative and whilst some people would love to raise there salary from A to B others reading this may already be earning Ax10. However, never having lived in NY for a prolonged period I have no frame of reference regarding day-to-day costs. My concern is that the above figures will result in a very noticeable drop in living standards. Or am I way off beam?

Thanks again for all your thoughts,

anotherlimey

You say you expect your medical insurance to be paid for, is this for definate? Medical insurance can be expensive if you have to buy it yourself.

I think you'll have the same standard of living as you do in the UK, most things are cheaper here in the U.S., even in NY.

-tom

Pulaski

YEs, I have company paid medical insurance but I still have to make a contribution towards it, .... and it isn't small! So make sure what you are actually being offered.

I wouldn't be so sure about that for someone living in Manhattan. There are few, if any, big chain supermarkets ("groceries") so food shopping may be at much more expensive "corner store" shops. The alternative is to eat out more often, and whilst that is a lot cheaper than in the UK, it soon adds up if you are eating out most nights of the week.

Also the cost of housing in Manhattan is absurd. You should consider yourself lucky if you find an apartment in a half decent area for $2,500 a month, and even then it is likely to be tiny.

BTW If you are going to be living in Manahattan, forget about owning a car - you'll pay $400 a month for garage parking.

Chandler

Thanks for the info.

It would seem that owning a Car is out, which from my albeit limited experience of NY won't prove a huge problem because there appears to be nowhere to park.

Of greater concern is that approx 50% of my wage will be swallowed up by housing leaving the remainder to cover Tax and Bills. To me, that seems to be cutting it a bit close to the bone. :scared:

Englishmum

You can see apartment rental prices here on the very popular:

http://www.craigslist.com (go to the NY section)

You might find it best to live just across the Hudson River in Hoboken, New Jersey. You can take the PATH subway trains from Midtown - 33rd St & Broadway, 14th St, Christopher St & World Trade Center or the NY Waterway ferries. Loads of young Brits and other expats live in Hoboken - one guy posts here.

Haven't had a chance to discuss your queries with my husband - he flies back from London on Wed night or Thursday - he's always in meetings or out to dinner after work. He does bring in project managers etc. from London and has a couple of grad trainees from London too.

When do you have to make your decision and sign a contract? Make sure that anything agreed with is *down in writing*.

THFC1

I think you may struggle to live on $63,000 in Manhatten. I've heard stories of partners waiting several months for their EAD's so I wouldn't budget for the second income initially just in case. My wage is the same as your offer and this works out to be $1720 every two weeks after tax and health contributions - hopefully that will give you an idea of what you can afford. No one seems to be paid monthly over here.

As Englishmum said, Hoboken could be an option as it is slightly cheaper but you can still get into World Trade in 10 - 15 minutes on the Path train. It's a lively town woth lots of bars and restaurants. You would have to pay more in tax as you would pay some to NY and NJ. I think this only works out as $1000 extra a year though. However, if you have some savings your willing to dip into I would live in Manhatten for the experience. You can always move some where cheaper after a year.

Good luck!

Bushranger

- If I move I will be dropping an initial $11,000-$15,000 per annum, which breaks down as:
- Current wage if FX'ed from GBP to USD is $74,000. At present the offer, albeit initial, is $63,000.
- At the turn of the year my wage will rise in the UK office to (if FX'ed from GBP) $78,000, but I have no guarantee that this rise will be allocated in full by the NY Office.
- I fully expect my medical bill to be picked up by the firm.
- There will be no extra per month towards living costs.
- I will be moving on an L1, which will allow for my wife to work once her EAD comes through.


I would urge you to be careful. I moved here six months ago. My firm is small so I had to research and negotiate my package. I was sent to start a company so my boss really wanted me here. Therefore I was able to get a salary increase ($20k for more resposnsibilty). However, I made sure I was not out of pocket on all the other stuff. You can't jump countries without incurring expnses. I came with my wife so we will have similar issues

- I agreed to become an employee of the Inc and be paid in $ (We are savers so plan to convert to Sterling on our return)
- Found a place to rent in Manhattan for $2,000 (and this is cheap)
- My mortgage in the London was $985 (so disposable income would take a hit moving to NYC)
- Don't forget the brokers fee (Another months rent at least. You will struggle to find a place without one - as you have no credit history and frankly you don;t need the hassle)
- Flats are unfurnished here in NYC (so you have to go out and buy a load of stuff $2/3,000 dollars should do it from IKEA)
- Get compensation for you wifes loss of earnings. It took my wife 4 months to get a work permit. We applied the day she arrived and she could not work until then. Work should be easy to find once she has a Social Security Number.
- Health insurance is $3,500 each (the company should pay as Healthcare benefit is 'free' in the UK.
- Payment for shipping stuff to US (Clothes/Kitchenware/Linen)
- I persuaded my boss to pay my rent for the first year
- Two flights a year back to London for my wife.
- I own a flat in London and rent that out. My boss tried to off-set my rental income agains cost of accommodation . However, I was able to 'proove' that I would only break even.

We decided to live in Manhattan for the first year (near my office) until we know the city better. I'd advise this becuase you won't know where you like until you get here. This way you save money on transport. I walk to work.

Finally, I find New York on a par with London for day to day expenses. Cooking is difficult given the size of the kitchen you will have. We eat in mostly - but most other people eat out. My colleague who came from England never cooks and she spends about $10 for lunch and $20-30$ per day on meals out. Alcohol is more expensive but you drink far less than on a night out with Brits.

You decide what to do. My boss's orignal offer was a 10% in salary increase. So I think i did well to get all this other stuff. If you don;t ask you won't get it.
However, i forgot to negotiate
- Compensation for cancelling UK mobile phone contracts (couple hundred)
- Agreement to pay expenses for our return etc etc should I lose my job.

I don't think sending you to NY for a salary less 10% is fair. All of the above (which is true) proves it. Based on what i can see from your info - you will be seriously out of pocket unless you get a better offer.

Cheers

Chandler

My wife will work here (UK) for the first two months of her EAD being processed and only come out towards the end of the third month to start looking for work. Hopefully, this joint income will make life easier.

With regard living location. If I'm moving to NY then I can't help but feel that I should live in Manhatten at least intially for the experience. However, a year on bread and water isn't appealing, I want to be able to do some ....