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k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

Old Jul 30th 2002, 11:17 pm
  #1  
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Default k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

My fiance has gone to the interview on July 25th at chennai consulate. They didn't care about the relationship all they asked was about religious differences between us as if its a crime. We have known each other for 5 long years. We had all the photoes all the evidence engagement photoes, phone bills, letters etc. All they cared is about the religious difference.
One indian lady working in the consulate had interviewed him on his religious beliefs. She insulted him by saying "couldn't u find anyone in ur religion". what gives them right to insult people. My fiance is broken. He didn't expect this kind of treatment from an 'American Consulate'.
This is our first marriage both for me and for my fiance. we had planned for our wedding in sept, but all our dreams are shaken.
They have given a 221 g slip saying "your case requires furthur administrative processing. we will contact you when ur case is ready to proceed".
They stamped his passport saying "received application" and gave that back to him. All the documents are still with them.
How long does this administrative process take.....??
shali
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Old Jul 30th 2002, 11:48 pm
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Default Re: k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

Wow I was shocked to see that there is more in India who refuse for such silly reasons. and here you have had such a long relationship too.

Where is your love from what part of India? Are you sure there is not any more reason for the 221(g)?

But does not matter, seems now all over India they are being out of line with their questions. I would like to tell you to contact your Sentor and let they work on this with you, have them contact the consulate to find out the reason as it is the law they much give you a written reason, as I found this out when my Now Husband was also put into Review with a 221(g).

Our case took 4 hard months to fight but I never stopped contacting the consulate nor the Sentor, and they too kept in contact with them demanding a reason, as we were not talk why.

If you would like to write me here is my email maybe I can help and I know there are others on this NG that would be able to help you too.

We went through the Mumbai Consulates and boy they are the worst to go through...

Wishing you the best hang in there he will get the visa just it will take more time.. as they can't refuse him forever unless there is major reasons such as a police record etc.

Good luck and keep your chin up..
P.S.
Where are you living now in the US? What state and where does he live? What part of India.
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Old Jul 31st 2002, 12:34 am
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Default Re: k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

My Fiance is from Hyderabad india. I am in Oregon. I contacted my congressman's office. They said they will put an inquiry hope to hear something by thursday.
My Fiance doesn't have any records with police or courts. He is a good law abiding citizen. we didn't fail the medical exam either.
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Old Jul 31st 2002, 2:20 am
  #4  
Dale Legan
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Default Re: k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

I'm sorry to hear that and am a little worried now as my fiancé is a different
religion. We filed the I-29F and received our first notice about 2 weeks ago that is
was received.

This is ridiculous ~ pursuit of happiness is an unalienable right. And, what is more
essential to that pursuit than choosing a mate for life. Someone should start a
revolution. !

"shali" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > My fiance has gone to the interview on July 25th at chennai consulate. They didn't
    > care about the relationship all they asked was about religious differences between
    > us as if its a crime. We have known each other for 5 long years. We had all the
    > photoes all the evidence engagement photoes, phone bills, letters etc. All they
    > cared is about the religious difference. One indian lady working in the consulate
    > had interviewed him on his religious beliefs. She insulted him by saying "couldn't
    > u find anyone in ur religion". what gives them right to insult people. My fiance is
    > broken. He didn't expect this kind of treatment from an 'American Consulate'. This
    > is our first marriage both for me and for my fiance. we had planned for our wedding
    > in sept, but all our dreams are shaken. They have given a 221 g slip saying "your
    > case requires furthur administrative processing. we will contact you when ur case
    > is ready to proceed". They stamped his passport saying "received application" and
    > gave that back to him. All the documents are still with them. How long does this
    > administrative process take.....?? shali
    >
    >
    >
    > --
 
Old Jul 31st 2002, 4:50 pm
  #5  
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Default Re: k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

What is going on in Chennai consulate? Have all the Mumbai consulars moved here? The 221(g)'s are coming from here on a daily basis. Trying to figure out the Indian Consulates is a bit like looking at Gregor Mendals law of Genetic Probabilty {A/A + A/a + a/A + a/a = A + 2Aa + a }I f you can understand this, you will have a fair idea of how Indian Consulates work.

After reading this please do a search here for 221(g)'s, you will find more information. It is hard to write it all in one response. Make use of all the other responses.

i do not believe religious difference can be a cause for denial, BUT it can be a cause for interview harrassment. Indian fiance's are commonly chided during the first interview about the age of fiance, the looks of fiance, the former marital status of fiance etc.

Notice i said the first interview~~~the one conducted by the Indian. If your fiance was shocked by this kind of behaviour at an American Consulate, he should also be shocked that an Indian National would treat a fellow citizen like such.

There are typically 2 interviews. First by Indian person and second American person. The Indian's interview is usually rough, while American is usually cool and stern.

First the Indian officer may ask for any documents. The Indian officer does not have any authority to reject. It is key is not to argue anything with him/her listen to everything, without getting provoked. They jump on any sign of agitation exhibited at this point. The Indian officer asks for all the documents, h/h can think of, some of which may seen incredulous to you. For instance, the recent case where a fiance was asked to produce pictures from a siblings marriage. If you cannot produce these or let them get under your skin they will begin talking rough. As h/s has only right to collect documents, h/s cannot reject the visa, but can put a a comment that documents are incomplete and the American will analyze the situation.

In your case i would suggest you contact your Congressional liason (or attorney) to find out where the status of you case sits. You can also begin to familiarze yourself with the FAM (Foreign Affairs Manual). i will quote a few paragraphs below.

You can find the FAM at
http://www.foia.state.gov/fam/fams.a...=2&id=10&fam=0
*start* reading at document 40.201


..................
9 FAM 42.81 PN1.2 Prepare Form OF-194
an applicant is refused a visa under
NA 221(g) resulting from post actions, posts should annotate the OF-194 to ndicate that the case has been refused pending an investigation, an advisory opinion, or administrative processing, as appropriate. The applicant should be given a realistic estimate of the time needed for the processing and instructions on how the applicant can follow-up at the end of this period.
.................

i quote this one, as you might have been seeing the recent threads mentioning "administrative reviews". Yours appears to be marked "administrative processing". Pehaps there is a difference. i would ask the Congressional liason or attorney you approach what and if the difference is. Perhaps the processing is a notch below the severity of the review.



....................


And according to the FAM the Conslulate MUST
respond to Congressional inquiries within 3-5 days. You can read this at the above site
..................
9 FAM PART IV Appendix E
700 INSTRUCTIONS RELATING TO
CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENCE

It is most important to answer promptly inquiries from Members of
Congress. Posts may respond to inquiries by telegram, e-mail, a letter or fax. Posts are reminded that congressional inquiries must be answered within 3 working days. Implicit in the congressional use of a telegram is desire for a prompt reply, preferably within 2 working days. Replies to such inquiries should be courteous and friendly, and the content as fully responsive to the inquirer as possible under the law and regulations
......................

And i quote thr below section, just because i never have and find it amusing. Perhaps this is why they are rude. If they were nice you might be tempted to slip a bill into their pocket ? Oh please.

........................
9 FAM 42.81 PN3 Informing the Applicant of Refusal
If a tone of authority is not evident, the applicant may misunderstand the officer’s intentions and believe the visa
might still be issued. (In some societies, such a situation might be
interpreted as an invitation to a bribe.)
.......................

Best wishes and please keep us informed. So many 221(g)s do not come back around to let us know the outcome.
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Old Jul 31st 2002, 11:26 pm
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Default Re: k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

thanks for all the support that this site provides. I have got lot of information from this site.
I will inform the outcome of this fight. I have involved my congressman. Didn't receive any news from them yet.
I myself have mailed to the consulate and they replied the same saying "your case is under administrative process wait until we contact you".
There isn't much age difference between us, and we both are in our mid 20's. No previous marriages. Don't know how they can't see we r in love.
This was the first question that indian lady had asked my fiance. what are your and ur fiances backgrounds. once he answered that she asked him ' In which religion are you going to raise ur child'.? Any couples with religious difference please have an answer ready.
............May be we have to lie and say we don't practice any religion.
Does any one know actually what they do during admistrative processing and how long it takes.
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Old Aug 1st 2002, 12:21 am
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Default Re: k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

shali <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
    > My Fiance is from Hyderabad india. I am in Oregon. I contacted my congressman's
    > office. They said they will put an inquiry hope to hear something by thursday. My
    > Fiance doesn't have any records with police or courts. He is a good law abiding
    > citizen. we didn't fail the medical exam either.

I am so sorry to hear about all of your troubles. I see from your post that you're in
Oregon, and already contacted your Congressman's office. But I just wanted to give
you the email address of Julie Bildhauer - she is the Immigration Liaison at
Congressman Wu's office. She helped us when we ran into a very minor snag. Perhaps
she can really put her skills to use in your case.

Her email is: [email protected]

I really hope they can help you. Wish you the best!

Jennifer & Peter US/NL in Portland, OR

    >
    >
    >
    > --
 
Old Aug 1st 2002, 6:01 pm
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Default Re: k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

My fiance got a call from consulate to come to consulate on any working day. I hope they will issue the visa this time without harassing him anymore.
Although i am excited about the call, i am confused why they have given a call so soon with in a weeks time. He went for the visa on 25th july and he got the second call on august 1st.
They didn't give any information whether they want to interview him more, or calling him to say he is ineligible for visa or they want to give visa.
please pray for us if u will.
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Old Aug 1st 2002, 6:27 pm
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Default Re: k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

I'm praying for you!

My husband and I just ended our 3-day ordeal with the Chennai consulate. I believe I know exactly which lady you are referring to who gave your fiance such a time about religion. I was interviewed in a room with the American male who is in charge (Tim Hall) and an Indian gentleman and this lady.

She first started in stating it didn't look like my photos were taken at a temple, and I tried to explain to her that we had a small ceremony in the temple and then had the rest in the hall next door; but she likes to hear herself talk, and it's difficult to get your point across. She must have strong personal beliefs against interreligious marriages---but then why is she working at an American consulate??

She also demanded to see a legal document given from the temple (which we didn't have). I told her that the temples are not equal to the courts of law in India. Having been stressed to the max already, I was about to put up with her attitude though and I told her she had no right to judge. I think Tim Hall must have given her a look of some sort cuz she got up and left the room after that and wasn't to be seen for the rest of the interview.

After that, the interview was smooth sailing. Tim is clear in his questioning and asks for specifics, but at least he doesn't harrass (at least he didn't me). Also, the other Indian gentleman was very kind.

But, if in the case of your fiance, others come across an unfriendly and downright rude consulate officer, isn't there some procedure to complain? Couldn't you ask to speak to whoever is in charge? I don't think anyone should just graciously accept verbal abuse or them trying to make you feel ashamed.

Anyways, I'm sure your fiance will have better luck next time. Most probably he'll have Tim and this other gentleman in there for the interview. I was able to joke with them in between questions and the could see I wasn't so nervous. I think mannerisms during the interview are very important, i.e., no fidgeting or nail-biting, etc. if you can help it.

I think after the interview they will see they have no legal basis to deny his visa anyways. Just that it's too bad they hire officers that abuse their job in order to get their personal opinions across to you.

Please let us know how he does when he goes back for another interview! Again, good luck.

Kim
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Old Aug 2nd 2002, 1:03 am
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Default Re: k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

This is great news Shali. We are sending our best wishes.

~~~For Shali, Kimmini, Ravi, and Michael (the current Indian cases having received221 (g)'s)~~~

Would you do something for us here?

1. Have your fiance check their passport and see if they put any stamps or writing in it from the first interview. And let us know what is notated. Kimmini's fiance's did not.

2. Give us a physical description and name of both the first and second interview officers. Good job Kimmini on your observations.

3.Compare the following sheet awarded to 221-ers to what yours looked like and relate which boxes were checked and any notations that were made.

For posterity and for future searchers of this site, this is what the form given from the consulates looks like. It covers both the 212 and 221 denials (and quasi-denials).

This example is marked *where ours was checked*



Dear Visa Applicant,

This office regrets to inform you that you have been found ineligible to
receive an immigrant visa under the following section(s) of the
immigration
and Nationality Act of 1952, as amended. The information contained in the
paragraph(s) marked pertains to your application. Please disregard the
unmarked paragraphs.

[ ] Section 212 (a)(4) which prohibits the issuance of a visa to anyone
likely to become a public charge.

[ ] Section 212(a)( ) __________________________________________

[X] *checked* Section 221(g) which prohibits the issuance of visa to
anyone
whose application does not comply with the provisions of the immigration
and Nationality Act of 1952 , as amended.

[ ] Further consideration will be given to your visa application upon the
presentation of the following :
[ ] Medical reports of ___________________________________________
[ ] Three color photographs (see reverse) of _____________________
[ ] Birth Certificates (see reverse) of __________________________
[ ] Certified copy of the Alien Registration Card (Green Card) of __
[ ] Notorised Affidavit indicating that ___________________ is physically
present in the united states.
[ ] Credible evidence of adequate financial support.
[X] *Checked* - Other:*the following was then handwritten* All correspondence between petitioner and him,
cards, letters, telephone bills. Petetioner's travel documents, tickets,
Hotel bills, boarding pass, appointment letter, leave application.


Please return to this office with the item(s) requested above, your
passport, and visa issuance fee ($65) at 7.45 AM Monday through Friday.
This application is valid for 12 months. If you do not present the
requested items within this period, you will be required to pay again the
appication fee ($260). Section 203 (e) of the immigration and Nationality
Act requires the cancellation of your application if you fail to take the
requested action within one year following a visa denial under section
221(g). Should you fail to return by the last working day of the current
month, you may expect a delay of two months or more in the processing of
your visa application.

The Visa section is closed to the Public on the last workday of each
month.

(Vice) Consul
Consulate General of United States
Mumbai, India (FORM I - 194)


And as for who to complain to? i think that would be Mr. Theodore Andrews, DOS Bureau of South Asian Affairs.

His email is [email protected]
phone number is (one or both of these)
202-647-2140 202-647-1112
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Old Aug 2nd 2002, 12:20 pm
  #11  
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Default Re: k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

Hi, I wish you all the best....I hope it all works out good for you. I didn't know
Chennai was turning out to be the next horror story in the saga of Indian
consulates!!! I wish someone would do something about this....my heart goes out to
everyone in this situation..... regards alpona
p.s I am a Mumbai consulate victim/veteran!(things worked out in the end!!!)
 
Old Aug 2nd 2002, 4:22 pm
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Default Re: k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

In my Fiance's passport they have stamped "received application". It doesn't say anything like 221 g or 212 on the passport.

On the blue colored paper, they gave the following letter.

Dear Visa Applicant,

This office regrets to inform you that you have been found ineligible to receive a visa under the following section(s) of the immigration and Nationality Act.
The information contained in the paragraph(s) marked 'X' pertains to your application. Please disregard the unmarked paragraphs.

[x] Section 221g which prohibits the issuance of the visa to anyone whose application doesn not comply with the provisions of the Immigration and NAtionality Act or regulations issued pursuant thereto. The following remarks apply in your case:*
(the info in { } is hand written)
{Your case requires further administrative processing. We will contact you when your case is ready to proceed.}

[] Section 212(a).....
[] Other
[] Further consideration will be given to ur visa application after you ovtain and present the documents listed above and/or the following.
[] You are eligible for waiver of the grounds of ineligibility. To apply for a waiver, follow the instructions in the attached Form I-724.
Sincerely yours,
American Consular Officer.

About the complain against that lady..I am thinking...may be I should give her a second chance. If she does it again this time then I will complain.
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Old Aug 2nd 2002, 4:46 pm
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Default Re: k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

Hi Shali!
This sounds like a case of another round thru the "paddle machine". You are getting the visa! When the 221(g) is not noted in the passport this typically is showing they want to "chat"{process?} you some more.

Be prepared to be interviewed again. Go in there and face them~~be polite. Do not show any anger. Sticks and stones may break your bones.....but you are coming home. If they/she gets nasty again, think all the bad things you want, but answer in a tone that is polite and respectful. Tell her, "Thank you for your concern, you have addressed those issues with your fiance and have found comfort in each other. "

Best wishes,

When will he go again?
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Old Aug 2nd 2002, 5:20 pm
  #14  
Johnson Pervis
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Default Re: k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

Your religion should never have come up. How did they figure you were different
religions? The forms don't ask that, do they? Sometimes it is a mistake to volunteer
information. Sometimes it is a mistake not to "stretch the truth" a little and not
emphasize differences such as religion. One of you could convert, you know? Religions
differences are one of the top reasons marriages don't work and the consulate knows
this. It is statistics, you know?

--
Johnson "shali" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > My fiance has gone to the interview on July 25th at chennai consulate. They didn't
    > care about the relationship all they asked was about religious differences between
    > us as if its a crime. We have known each other for 5 long years. We had all the
    > photoes all the evidence engagement photoes, phone bills, letters etc. All they
    > cared is about the religious difference. One indian lady working in the consulate
    > had interviewed him on his religious beliefs. She insulted him by saying "couldn't
    > u find anyone in ur religion". what gives them right to insult people. My fiance is
    > broken. He didn't expect this kind of treatment from an 'American Consulate'. This
    > is our first marriage both for me and for my fiance. we had planned for our wedding
    > in sept, but all our dreams are shaken. They have given a 221 g slip saying "your
    > case requires furthur administrative processing. we will contact you when ur case
    > is ready to proceed". They stamped his passport saying "received application" and
    > gave that back to him. All the documents are still with them. How long does this
    > administrative process take.....?? shali
    >
    >
    >
    > --
 
Old Aug 2nd 2002, 6:46 pm
  #15  
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Default Re: k1 refused by giving us 221g slip

My fiance is going to face them again on august 6th. Praying and hoping that this should be the last time .

We didn't volunteer the religious information. They asked him. During the process of his 'religious interview' he told them that he doesn't have any objection to convert to my religion. This is where the problem started, and our gracious indian lady has insulted him. she didn't like the idea that he is willing to convert to my religion.
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