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HMRC imposing new limits on time in UK!

HMRC imposing new limits on time in UK!

Old Jul 25th 2011, 6:09 pm
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Exclamation HMRC imposing new limits on time in UK!

Have you guys seen this article about HM tax bods planning to limit further the number of days that Expats can spend back home without risking being taxed:

http://britishexpats.com/articles/fi...rules-warning/

The current limit, I believe, is 91 days in any tax year. The writer of the article doesn't say what new limits are being considered, or how/where one may direct (the apparently 'invited') comments to HMRC...

Does anyone know whether, if one does end up having to file tax returns with HMRC, they will take into account taxes already paid to the IRS? I know there is a Dual Taxation Agreement between the UK and the US, but is it at all likely that this agreement may fall foul of these new residency restrictions?

I am in the final stages of moving back permanently, and giving up my Green Card. My DH will be staying in the US for a few more years, but was hoping to spend extended periods with me back in London. I am just hoping that these new proposals won't put a spanner in the works...
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Old Jul 25th 2011, 7:04 pm
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Default Re: HMRC imposing new limits on time in UK!

When we were looking at the UK tax rules a few years ago...the number of days allowed in the UK were spread over a 4 year period...not 1 year.
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Old Jul 25th 2011, 7:15 pm
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Default Re: HMRC imposing new limits on time in UK!

Originally Posted by Jerseygirl View Post
When we were looking at the UK tax rules a few years ago...the number of days allowed in the UK were spread over a 4 year period...not 1 year.
Over 4? I thought it was an average spread over 3...but yes, they make it complicated.

Anyway, El, not going to get your USC first?

Good luck with your plans to back back
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Old Jul 25th 2011, 7:19 pm
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Default Re: HMRC imposing new limits on time in UK!

Originally Posted by Bob View Post
Over 4? I thought it was an average spread over 3...but yes, they make it complicated.

Anyway, El, not going to get your USC first?

Good luck with your plans to back back
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/cnr/faqs_general.htm#13nr

If you exceed 183 days in 1 year you are considered resident for tax purposes...or...if over a period of 4 years you average over 91 days...you may also be considered a resident for tax purposes.

Edit: Pssstttt...she'll have you for calling her El.

Last edited by Jerseygirl; Jul 25th 2011 at 7:23 pm.
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Old Jul 25th 2011, 7:27 pm
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Default Re: HMRC imposing new limits on time in UK!

Originally Posted by Jerseygirl View Post
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/cnr/faqs_general.htm#13nr

If you exceed 183 days in 1 year you are considered resident for tax purposes...or...if over a period of 4 years you average over 91 days...you may also be considered a resident for tax purposes.

Edit: Pssstttt...she'll have you for calling her El.
I thought the limit of days allowed in the UK was reduced from 183 to 91 days a couple of years ago?

I find it somewhat frustrating that the article by Rhiannon Davies is very short on details - and no links. I hope she'll check into this thread and enlighten us.
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Old Jul 25th 2011, 7:32 pm
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Default Re: HMRC imposing new limits on time in UK!

Originally Posted by Elvira View Post
I thought the limit of days allowed in the UK was reduced from 183 to 91 days a couple of years ago?

I find it somewhat frustrating that the article by Rhiannon Davies is very short on details - and no links. I hope she'll check into this thread and enlighten us.
AFAIK it's still spread over 4 years...which is confirmed by HMRC's website. The article by RD doesn't hold much credibility without a link.

If you look at the link...it gives you a link to Helpsheet HS302...which gives you info about UK/US tax treaty.
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Old Jul 25th 2011, 7:39 pm
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Default Re: HMRC imposing new limits on time in UK!

Originally Posted by Jerseygirl View Post

Edit: Pssstttt...she'll have you for calling her El.
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Old Jul 25th 2011, 7:42 pm
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Default Re: HMRC imposing new limits on time in UK!

Originally Posted by Bob View Post


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Old Jul 25th 2011, 9:42 pm
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Default Re: HMRC imposing new limits on time in UK!

There are several stories in Google News about new proposals that change the math

http://gulfnews.com/business/opinion...hange-1.841626

http://www.expatica.com/nl/finance_b...est_17518.html


The main highlights of the proposals are that:
Residence status will be decided on an annual basis, with each year being viewed in isolation from the previous year.
It will be harder to break residence for UK tax purposes than it will be to become resident.
The 91 day average test will be scrapped, the 183 day rule will remain.
Up to three separate tests will be used to determine whether a person is resident or not, and the maximum number of days a person may spend in the UK each year. Each test has separate conditions.


The people affected the most are the Monday-Wednesday UK workers who spend the rest of the week somewhere else in Europe (M&W were travel days and didn't count toward the limit).
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Old Jul 25th 2011, 10:55 pm
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Default Re: HMRC imposing new limits on time in UK!

Originally Posted by Elvira View Post
I hope she'll check into this thread and enlighten us.
I've alerted her to this thread and await a response. Will update you when I hear back.
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Old Jul 26th 2011, 1:38 am
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Default Re: HMRC imposing new limits on time in UK!

There is more on the proposed changes here:

http://www.mondaq.com/x/137058/IRS+H...Fools+Advisors

Here is the official consultation document (warning: legalese)

http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/consul...dence_test.htm
http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/d/cons..._residence.pdf

Interested parties have until 9 September 2011 to email their concerns / questions.
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Old Jul 26th 2011, 2:26 am
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Default Re: HMRC imposing new limits on time in UK!

Originally Posted by penguinsix View Post
Interested parties have until 9 September 2011 to email their concerns / questions.
and have their names placed in line for audit.
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Old Jul 26th 2011, 8:36 am
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Default Re: HMRC imposing new limits on time in UK!

Hi there,

this is the first time I have guest posted to this particular publication. Most don't allow you to add any links to the content. Perhaps that's not the case on this website, I'm afraid I just assumed. That's why there were no links to HMRC or back to the article on my site that covers everything you need to know (hopefully)...

See both: http://www.shelteroffshore.com/index...cy-rules-11062
and http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/d/cons..._residence.pdf for all the details you need.

I hope you find this useful to you as you research. The 'rules' are far too open for interpretation at the moment, and this has caused problems for a number of people I know. A statutory test is therefore welcome - as long as they don't restrict the number of days we Brits can visit 'home.'

Rhiannon
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Old Jul 26th 2011, 3:29 pm
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Default Re: HMRC imposing new limits on time in UK!

Thanks, y'all - looks like there's plenty for me to read up on!
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