chartreuse

Ah, right. I see we've reached the point in the discussion where you start re-defining terms to mean whatever you want them to.

dakota44

You should go back and read some of your own posts. If you can't see the distinction, then I grieve for you.

chartreuse

Nope. I don't anticipate being eligible for any subsidies, by the time they come in. So you can't call it sour grapes.

It's what it says on the tin. A complaint that the system will unfairly penalise childless couples, simply for being childless.

dakota44

You would be absolutely apoplectic in Canada.

I've mentioned how much more tax I had to pay versus the U.S., and had no complaints about that because of the health care I received. But check this out. Not only does a family all that free health care, below certain income levels they also get a check every month, we call it Baby Bonus. National Child Benefit Supplement and, in Ontario, Ontario child benefit Supplement. Ready to get your freak on???? Now this is a baby breeder system at the low income scale and, no doubt, abused by many. Without it my taxes would no doubt have been significantly lower. But I still had no real complaints because I knew a lot of good hardworking people, in low paying jobs, with decent kids who benefited from it. There will always be the deserving and the undeserving who benefit from any program.

These are NET Income figures, not gross. The bonus is non taxable income and is paid to the mother, except in cases where there is no mother present, who must file a tax return and declare her spouses income.

Family of four, two kids under 18. Income $20k....$732 a month.
Family of 6, four kids under 18. Income $20k.....$1,446 a month.


Let's bump the income. $40k.........two kids.......$287 a month.
4 kids..........$860 a month.

$60k a year...2 kids.......$160 a month
4 kids.......$497 a month

More kids? No problem.
$20k yr. 6 kids........$2,159 a month
$40k yr $1,574 a month
$60K YR. $920 a month

How about $80k per year? 2 kids........$92
4 kids........$331
6 kids........$720

I can hear all the families downloading the Canada immigration forms now.

I will add that I seldom qualified for more than $200 a month, and for the last 10 years I was there and my kids were under 18, for nothing and yet I generally did not complain about the system except in the cases where it was obvious abuse of the program.

Michael

Things have changed since you and I were younger and raising children in the states. Although the US normally does not give direct subsidies except to the poorest, it currently does give tax credits such as child care credits, earned income credits, and pay to work credits that were not available when we were younger. And those credits are refunds if you don't make enough money to pay taxes.

dakota44

This is true, but they fall far short of what Canada does through the baby bonus and they generally don't reach the same income levels you see receiving baby bonus checks.

Michael

Canada is not too bad with taxation at about 33% of gdp as compared to the US at about 28%. Now if we can only figure out a way to cut our military budget in half so we have similar expenditures as most other western countries to try to balance the budget, then it wouldn't overly concern me if our taxes rose a couple more percent for infrastructure, transportation, and possibly some more social programs.

However, I don't think I would feel too comfortable having our taxes go up like some countries in Europe to 45%-50% of gdp.

dakota44

U.S. GDP is 14.4 trillion dollars. 5% of that is a huge chunk of change. 720 billion. Raise the taxes to that level, invest in infrastructure and health care.

I have always failed to understand the failure to invest in infrastructure, satisfied instead to let it crumble and collapse. The number jobs that would develop and businesses that would be created or significantly boosted by massive infrastructure repair would be huge. A significant portion of the investment would be returned in the form of income taxes, sales taxes, lower unemployment payouts, lower welfare payouts, FICA etc.

Michael

Yah, but conservatives think it is a waste of money. They would rather let the infrastructure collapse and then try to fix it just like New Orleans or now trying to wait until the last minute to see if global warming is real. If we wait that long and the conservatives are wrong, we will be spending tens of trillions of dollars trying to save our coastal cities and probably without much success.

Same thing for energy independence/clean energy. I know oil is cheap but that is $150-$500 billion each year (depending on the price of oil) going into someone elses pocket instead of hiring Americans. That is about a 1%-3% difference in unemployment.

chartreuse

Nothing to do with politics. It's because everything in this country is made of cheese. Can openers, houses, roads, dams - all cheese.

dakota44

For a nation that likes to brag about being "The Greatest" it sure does lag in too many areas. But then, what do you expect when everything is about corporations and profits in a nation that is tax averse.

dakota44

Of course it's about politics. Citizens: "The roads need repair. Out bridge is in bad shape. The school is decrepit." Politician: "We can fix all of those. We will need to raise tax revenue to do it." Citizen: "You raise my taxes and I'll vote your socialist ass out of office." Politician: "OK. No tax increase." Citizen: "Good. Now when are you going to fix those things." Politician: "Depends on how much more of this country the Chinese are willing to buy."

It's all politics. Citizens who bitch about paying taxes, and politicians to afraid to ignore them.

chartreuse

It certainly appears to be all politics with you two. "Conservatives suck! Liberals are super! Yaddad yadda yadda."

Give it a rest, for Christ's sake.

dakota44

There are plenty of Liberals who have avoided the cost of repairing our infrastructure. It isn't just a Republican aversion. Whether on the local, State or National level, fear of raising the revenue to do it, infrastructure repair has taken the furthest back seat on the bus. I blame all politicians for that.

Bob

I thought that 65% thing finished, they only offered that for those who lost their jobs before April?