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The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

Old Mar 24th 2010, 8:20 am
  #181  
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Default Re: The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

Originally Posted by dakota44
The Republican Party has been the party of the rich, and yet they draw support from those whom they provide nothing for. That always amazes me. Their tax cuts always benefit the wealthy or higher income people and, as you said, increase the deficit. The G.W. Bush tax cuts are a primary reason for the massive financial problems facing the government now. Trickle down economics has always been a bullshit theory. Honest, if we give multi- millionaires trillions in tax cuts, some of it will trickle down to you. We promise. Right. Take those tax cuts for the wealthy back and the cost of health care would not be so daunting. I prefer spending money to provide services, and in the case of the all too often ignored infrastructure, jobs. Better to have a deficit that produces something. It beats giving the wealthy more play money to buy a new luxury car or expand the pool area. Or hire another illegal alien to clean their house. You are spot on about Corporate taxes, especially since so many of them avoid taxes altogether by setting up offshore headquarters while they also farm out jobs to the rest of the world and end up with tax breaks for that too.
Yes I was a little upset when democrats changed the stimulus package to remove $70 billion worth of school construction and replaced it with elimination of AMT in order to get 3 republicans to support the package. I doubted that it would do any good supplying someone with a lot of money already in the bank with extra money when the problem was a lack of demand.

When you look at the final stimulus package, there was $288 billion in tax cuts, $224 (extended unemployment, cobra subsidies, education, and welfare), and $275 billion in job creation ($46 billion for transportation, $31 billion to modernize federal buildings, and many others).

I think it would have been much better to use more of the tax cuts for infrastructure projects since it was obvious to me from the beginning that this recession was going to last a long time and the tax cuts (especially for the rich) would not significantly increase demand.

The package is for 10 years but most will be spent in 3 years ($185 billion in 2009, $400 billion in 2010, and $135 billion in 2011).

Last edited by Michael; Mar 24th 2010 at 8:34 am.
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Old Mar 24th 2010, 11:37 am
  #182  
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Default Re: The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

Originally Posted by fatbrit
I'm a bloody miracle.
Wonders never cease to amaze me!
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Old Mar 24th 2010, 11:43 am
  #183  
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Default Re: The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

Originally Posted by dakota44
The Republican Party has been the party of the rich, and yet they draw support from those whom they provide nothing for. That always amazes me. Their tax cuts always benefit the wealthy or higher income people and, as you said, increase the deficit. The G.W. Bush tax cuts are a primary reason for the massive financial problems facing the government now. Trickle down economics has always been a bullshit theory. Honest, if we give multi- millionaires trillions in tax cuts, some of it will trickle down to you. We promise. Right. Take those tax cuts for the wealthy back and the cost of health care would not be so daunting. I prefer spending money to provide services, and in the case of the all too often ignored infrastructure, jobs. Better to have a deficit that produces something. It beats giving the wealthy more play money to buy a new luxury car or expand the pool area. Or hire another illegal alien to clean their house. You are spot on about Corporate taxes, especially since so many of them avoid taxes altogether by setting up offshore headquarters while they also farm out jobs to the rest of the world and end up with tax breaks for that too.
Ah but that's the politics of envy. You too can be a millionaire if you work hard and play by the rules. Two things the average rich Republican supporter doesn't do! They're selling a dream and Joe the Plumber is sold on it.
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Old Mar 24th 2010, 11:49 am
  #184  
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Default Re: The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

Originally Posted by simongb
It makes me laugh when Americans (Fox News) use terms like 'socialism' because they have no idea what they're talking about. What also makes me laugh is when the very people who would be helped by healthcare reform are on the news jabbing their fists in the air in anger because they don't want health care reform. "Don't you dare help me improve my situation in life. I'd rather be homeless because of my medial bills!" Oh, the ignorance....
I've seen this sort of statement before. It reminds me of the condescending, paternalistic attitude shown by many colonizing nations of the 17th, 18th and 19th centuries towards indigenous people. "How can they not understand that our ways are so much better for them than their backwards traditional methods? They are ignorant savages that must be forced into changing their ways. If they will not do so voluntarily, we will do it by force. It's for their own good, they're just too stupid to realize the favor we're doing them.".
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Old Mar 24th 2010, 11:53 am
  #185  
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Default Re: The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

Originally Posted by another bloody yank
I've seen this sort of statement before. It reminds me of the condescending, paternalistic attitude shown by many colonizing nations of the 17th, 18th and 19th centuries towards indigenous people. "How can they not understand that our ways are so much better for them than their backwards traditional methods? They are ignorant savages that must be forced into changing their ways. If they will not do so voluntarily, we will do it by force. It's for their own good, they're just too stupid to realize the favor we're doing them.".
Of course, now I see it:
Death to the poor!
More to the rich!
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Old Mar 24th 2010, 1:07 pm
  #186  
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Default Re: The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

Originally Posted by fatbrit
Of course, now I see it:
Death to the poor!
More to the rich!
Yep, you've got me pegged.
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Old Mar 24th 2010, 1:18 pm
  #187  
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Default Re: The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

Originally Posted by another bloody yank
I've seen this sort of statement before. It reminds me of the condescending, paternalistic attitude shown by many colonizing nations of the 17th, 18th and 19th centuries towards indigenous people. "How can they not understand that our ways are so much better for them than their backwards traditional methods? They are ignorant savages that must be forced into changing their ways. If they will not do so voluntarily, we will do it by force. It's for their own good, they're just too stupid to realize the favor we're doing them.".
Two (unrelated) comments on this;
(1) Count the USA in as one of the worst of the paternalistic colonisers (westward expansion, Hawaii, Philippines, etc)
(2) I think your analogy is false; the indigenous peoples did not vote for the American, British or French oppressors. By contrast, the American people did vote in the current President & Congress.
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Old Mar 24th 2010, 1:29 pm
  #188  
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Default Re: The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

Originally Posted by another bloody yank
I've seen this sort of statement before. It reminds me of the condescending, paternalistic attitude shown by many colonizing nations of the 17th, 18th and 19th centuries towards indigenous people. "How can they not understand that our ways are so much better for them than their backwards traditional methods? They are ignorant savages that must be forced into changing their ways. If they will not do so voluntarily, we will do it by force. It's for their own good, they're just too stupid to realize the favor we're doing them.".
Exactly. It's why I generally don't hang around with British people any more.

And then there is this: Obamacare will eventually control the people. This is what it's about.

http://www.breitbart.tv/shocking-aud...rol-the-people

This will not end well.
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Old Mar 24th 2010, 1:31 pm
  #189  
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Default Re: The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

Originally Posted by Octang Frye
Exactly. It's why I generally don't hang around with British people any more.
You can't seem to stay away from here, though.
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Old Mar 24th 2010, 1:40 pm
  #190  
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Default Re: The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

Originally Posted by robin1234
You can't seem to stay away from here, though.
That's because I like ABY, Leslie, Cindyabs and co. Hanging around with the rest of you oiks also serves to remind me how far I evolved.

I notice you dodged the point. No doubt someone will try and say it was a slip of the tongue.

Last edited by Octang Frye; Mar 24th 2010 at 1:42 pm.
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Old Mar 24th 2010, 1:42 pm
  #191  
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Default Re: The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

Originally Posted by another bloody yank
Yep, you've got me pegged.
I always knew you were a secret billionaire.
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Old Mar 24th 2010, 2:09 pm
  #192  
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Default Re: The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

Originally Posted by Octang Frye
That's because I like ABY, Leslie, Cindyabs and co. Hanging around with the rest of you oiks also serves to remind me how far I evolved.

I notice you dodged the point. No doubt someone will try and say it was a slip of the tongue.
What point? The one about Obama being a poor substitute for Mussolini?
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Old Mar 24th 2010, 2:12 pm
  #193  
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Default Re: The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

Oh my gosh...this thread just refuses to die...
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Old Mar 24th 2010, 2:19 pm
  #194  
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Default Re: The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

Originally Posted by robin1234
Two (unrelated) comments on this;
(1) Count the USA in as one of the worst of the paternalistic colonisers (westward expansion, Hawaii, Philippines, etc)
(2) I think your analogy is false; the indigenous peoples did not vote for the American, British or French oppressors. By contrast, the American people did vote in the current President & Congress.
Count 1: No arguement here. I don't think I stated otherwise.

Count 2: Also true, but how does it invalidate my analogy?
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Old Mar 24th 2010, 2:19 pm
  #195  
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Default Re: The health care bill is past by just 7 votes!

Originally Posted by lifehouse51
Oh my gosh...this thread just refuses to die...
You're new here, aintcha?
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