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Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

Old Jul 13th 2007, 4:07 pm
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Default Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

I believe I posted this in the wrong place so I'm reposting. Sorry if this is a mistake

A complicated situation, I'm not sure if anyone has any info.

No need to worry about the details but here's the info:

My wife and I are UK citizens with green cards
Moved here 15 years ago
Have 2 US Born Children
She is in a seriously depressed state and has decided to leave to return to the UK, I basically act as a single parent with her in the house
She has no plans, no job, nothing about moving, she's just going to go
Of course she wants to take the children, who by preference of staying in the US (not really staying with me) do not want to go.

Any knowledge of the legal aspects or how to get advice would be greatly appreciated.

Please don't worry about how this came about or who is to blame or why it's happening, this has taken a long time to develop and is actually not resolved, I'm just trying to get my ducks in a row.

Thanks
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Old Jul 13th 2007, 4:10 pm
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Default Re: Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

Children's home is in the US. She cannot legally take them out of the country without your agreement. This would be covered by the Hague Convention -- both the US and UK are signatories. In a divorce proceedings, I would guess you would have a good chance at maintaining this status quo.

You should both get US citizenship NOW. You because you're presumably living here, and her because she might need/want to come back some day and this is the only guarantee. There is no problem holding on to your UK citizenship as well.

The fees go considerably up at the end of this month BTW.
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Old Jul 13th 2007, 4:17 pm
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Default Re: Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

Originally Posted by tonyoci View Post
I believe I posted this in the wrong place so I'm reposting. Sorry if this is a mistake

A complicated situation, I'm not sure if anyone has any info.

No need to worry about the details but here's the info:

My wife and I are UK citizens with green cards
Moved here 15 years ago
Have 2 US Born Children
She is in a seriously depressed state and has decided to leave to return to the UK, I basically act as a single parent with her in the house
She has no plans, no job, nothing about moving, she's just going to go
Of course she wants to take the children, who by preference of staying in the US (not really staying with me) do not want to go.

Any knowledge of the legal aspects or how to get advice would be greatly appreciated.

Please don't worry about how this came about or who is to blame or why it's happening, this has taken a long time to develop and is actually not resolved, I'm just trying to get my ducks in a row.

Thanks
How dose she plan on taking care of the kids with no job or plan especially if she doesn’t do much for them now with a roof over head and someone to look after them.
What do you mean the kids want to stay, but not with you?
I’m sure you could get some advice from a counselor, or if nothing else they could recommend someone who would know the laws and alike.
Best of luck mate, sounds like a sticky situation.
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Old Jul 13th 2007, 4:27 pm
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Default Re: Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

Hey thanks guys, it certainly is a stick situation.

What I meant is that the children want to stay in the US because it's their home. They are not choosing Dad rather than Mom, they are choosing to stay in their home country and that means staying with Dad. If they had to choose between Mom and Dad without the location move who knows what they would choose, they love us both, but they choose to stay in the US first.

Hopefully that makes sense.

You are correct, she has no plan and has not thought it through but she's obsessed with the move and it's damaging our day to day lives.
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Old Jul 13th 2007, 4:35 pm
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Default Re: Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

Originally Posted by tonyoci View Post
Hey thanks guys, it certainly is a stick situation.

What I meant is that the children want to stay in the US because it's their home. They are not choosing Dad rather than Mom, they are choosing to stay in their home country and that means staying with Dad. If they had to choose between Mom and Dad without the location move who knows what they would choose, they love us both, but they choose to stay in the US first.

Hopefully that makes sense.

You are correct, she has no plan and has not thought it through but she's obsessed with the move and it's damaging our day to day lives.
So you stay the kids stay and mum goes the way of the UK. Let her do her thing and get her head straight, maybe then she will realize she wants to be with her children and will come back... Maybe not but at least the kids will get what they want. Best wishes
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Old Jul 13th 2007, 4:37 pm
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Default Re: Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

Originally Posted by tonyoci View Post
Hey thanks guys, it certainly is a stick situation.

You are correct, she has no plan and has not thought it through but she's obsessed with the move and it's damaging our day to day lives.

It does sound rough, and I think the point that should be emphasized is that the kids want to stay in the US regardless of which parent is in the US (which I'm gathering is what you are saying). I think if you couch it in those terms, your wife will have a harder time turning it into a mom v. dad issue.

Of course we're not privy to the details, but I'd say a) some counseling, even if she is going, would be helpful, and b) perhaps a trip of 3-6 months back to the UK will help her understand what it is she wants out of life, or at least get her on a track in which she knows she should be looking (right now, with the limited info, it sounds like she is a bit lost).

Good luck with this.
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Old Jul 13th 2007, 4:42 pm
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Default Re: Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

Thanks again, she is clinically depressed and if anyone understands that illness it totally clouds your judgment in ways that your sense of reality is lost. She cannot understand how illogical her thinking is.

Problem is that she is not rational enough to consider logical aspects such as what they want or what makes sense. I have suggested a 4 week trip in September, followed by a re-evaluation, followed, perhaps by a "permanent" move for just her in January. My hope of course is that she realizes that it's not what she wants. This is relatively likely to happen.

The problem is that she pictures a perfect life in a country cottage with her lovely children. Reality is she could only afford a small place, her children can be little buggers, especially for her, and she would not have me doing 80-90% of the parenting.

Obviously you're only getting one side of this but thanks for the support.
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Old Jul 13th 2007, 4:50 pm
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Default Re: Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

Originally Posted by tonyoci View Post
Thanks again, she is clinically depressed and if anyone understands that illness it totally clouds your judgment in ways that your sense of reality is lost. She cannot understand how illogical her thinking is.

Problem is that she is not rational enough to consider logical aspects such as what they want or what makes sense. I have suggested a 4 week trip in September, followed by a re-evaluation, followed, perhaps by a "permanent" move for just her in January. My hope of course is that she realizes that it's not what she wants. This is relatively likely to happen.

The problem is that she pictures a perfect life in a country cottage with her lovely children. Reality is she could only afford a small place, her children can be little buggers, especially for her, and she would not have me doing 80-90% of the parenting.

Obviously you're only getting one side of this but thanks for the support.
Don’t want to overstep any boundaries, but is she on any medication for her condition or seeing anyone about it? Perhaps someone out side of her immediate situation would help her to see things more clearly.
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Old Jul 13th 2007, 4:54 pm
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Default Re: Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

I'm terribly sorry about her depression, which is a true illness. If she wants to go to the UK, she should go and stay with parents/siblings, and get psychological treatment. She is no help to anyone until she gets well. When she gets well, she can decide what she wants to do.

Good luck.
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Old Jul 13th 2007, 5:02 pm
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Default Re: Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

She is on meds (has been for years though I never really understood why until last year) and is seeing someone. She was actually committed to the psych ward for a few days a couple of weeks ago. At the moment none of this is helping because she just doesn't seem to want to be helped which is a common problem.

I don't mind being asked questions about this as long as people are understanding about it.
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Old Jul 13th 2007, 5:12 pm
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Default Re: Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

Originally Posted by tonyoci View Post
She is on meds (has been for years though I never really understood why until last year) and is seeing someone. She was actually committed to the psych ward for a few days a couple of weeks ago. At the moment none of this is helping because she just doesn't seem to want to be helped which is a common problem.

I don't mind being asked questions about this as long as people are understanding about it.
Well jeezz what more can you do. I hope she stays safe and is not in a position to hurt herself or anyone else. Maybe being back home with family and getting a rest from things is what she needs. I notice in the title of the tread it says divorce. Is that really necessary right now. Seems to me that it’s just one more thing to put stress on the situation. Be strong man, I’m sure it’s hard.
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Old Jul 13th 2007, 5:47 pm
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Default Re: Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

She insists she wants divorce (which again is actually a quoted symptom of people in her position). My post was purely a fact finding thing - If there is a divorce how does it work ? not meaning that I want that at this point.
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Old Jul 13th 2007, 5:50 pm
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Default Re: Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

Originally Posted by tonyoci View Post
She is on meds (has been for years though I never really understood why until last year) and is seeing someone. She was actually committed to the psych ward for a few days a couple of weeks ago. At the moment none of this is helping because she just doesn't seem to want to be helped which is a common problem.

I don't mind being asked questions about this as long as people are understanding about it.
Won't these facts have some bearing on a custody descision?
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Old Jul 13th 2007, 5:52 pm
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Default Re: Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

Originally Posted by tonyoci View Post
She insists she wants divorce (which again is actually a quoted symptom of people in her position). My post was purely a fact finding thing - If there is a divorce how does it work ? not meaning that I want that at this point.
Sorry I don’t know how that works. I’m sure someone on here does though.
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Old Jul 13th 2007, 5:53 pm
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Default Re: Divorce, children, return to the UK (repost)

Originally Posted by tonyoci View Post
She insists she wants divorce (which again is actually a quoted symptom of people in her position). My post was purely a fact finding thing - If there is a divorce how does it work ? not meaning that I want that at this point.
Divorce is state specific so there are 50 different answers to your questions. However, generally as soon as the first petition goes in the kids are locked in the state where they are at the time and you will need the court's permission to move them out.
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