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Class 2 NI. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributions?

Class 2 NI. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributions?

Old Oct 27th 2018, 12:39 am
  #211  
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Default Re: Class 2 NI abolished. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributio

Originally Posted by nearpost1



thank you for that. Trouble is they want a u.k. address to confirm my identity. I have not had one of those In forty years, and they rejected my U.S. address. I will keep working with it. Many thanks anyway chawkins99
Another one here who opened an account while in the US having not been back in the UK for nearly 20 years. Unfortunately I can't remember what address I used....but realistically the only one I could have given was the last one they had on record for me.
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Old Oct 27th 2018, 2:26 am
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Default Re: Class 2 NI abolished. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributio

Thanks all. Since I am now 65, paid up to thirty units, and just started receiving my four week pension payment, I’ll probably have little use for the online account anyway.
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Old Nov 9th 2018, 4:43 am
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Default Re: Class 2 NI abolished. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributio

Hi guys,

Some really useful tips in this thread.

Back in 2012, I applied to back-pay my missing contribution years.
They sent back a letter, with a table listing each missing year, and the cost to purchase each missing year.
There are also 2 columns at the end; 'pay without penalty' date of April 2019, and a 'final pay date' of April 2023.

So I figured, back then in 2012, no reason to pay anything before I have to. Alas, now I'm a few months before the first deadline, so I'm prioritising this in my life now.

So I'm just curious if anybody knows, what is the penalty if I delayed until April 2023?
Does it just mean paying the 2023 price instead of the price quoted in my letter?

Of course it seems like a terrific investment nevertheless, so I am likely to pay the Piper before April 2019.

Also, I'm under the impression one has to contact HMRC after payment, in order to direct them how to allocate funds.
Anyone had any luck doing this by email? Is it quicker than post?
They seem to take weeks/months to finally getting around to opening mail sent through the post, and telephone - on top of being lengthy and expensive and with no paper trail - appear to be received by a general operator, not a specialist caseworker who can allocate my funds there and then over the phone.

Good thread, thanks for sharing your experiences!

Last edited by Lisboa; Nov 9th 2018 at 4:47 am.
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Old Nov 9th 2018, 4:58 am
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Default Re: Class 2 NI abolished. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributio

Originally Posted by Lisboa
They sent back a letter, with a table listing each missing year, and the cost to purchase each missing year.
Note that it seems not all years are equal. You have a list of all the missing years - factual. However not all of those years will necessarily add to your pension entitlement even if paid. You need to speak to the pension folks (don't have telephone number handy but easily googled) who were super helpful and super quick to advise which years from my list would count towards entitlement years.

Originally Posted by Lisboa
Also, I'm under the impression one has to contact HMRC after payment, in order to direct them how to allocate funds.
I made my bulk payment earlier this year. Having got my 'list' and spoken to the pension people I simply sent off a check with a very detailed cover letter and an annotated copy of the 'list' making it clear which years were being paid. I was extra detailed having heard others' tales of hassle. It all went perfectly without need of any further contact. It didn't take weeks for them to open the letter!

I chose to send a check, which then gave the option of the detailed cover letter, rather than a bank transfer - simply because the latter doesn't allow you to provide the detail I mentioned. If paying electronically I suspect further contact would be necessary as they wouldn't know which years you were paying.
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Old Nov 9th 2018, 5:53 am
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Default Re: Class 2 NI abolished. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributio

Originally Posted by Lisboa
Hi guys,

Some really useful tips in this thread.

Back in 2012, I applied to back-pay my missing contribution years.
They sent back a letter, with a table listing each missing year, and the cost to purchase each missing year.
There are also 2 columns at the end; 'pay without penalty' date of April 2019, and a 'final pay date' of April 2023.

So I figured, back then in 2012, no reason to pay anything before I have to. Alas, now I'm a few months before the first deadline, so I'm prioritising this in my life now.

So I'm just curious if anybody knows, what is the penalty if I delayed until April 2023?
Does it just mean paying the 2023 price instead of the price quoted in my letter?

Of course it seems like a terrific investment nevertheless, so I am likely to pay the Piper before April 2019.

Also, I'm under the impression one has to contact HMRC after payment, in order to direct them how to allocate funds.
Anyone had any luck doing this by email? Is it quicker than post?
They seem to take weeks/months to finally getting around to opening mail sent through the post, and telephone - on top of being lengthy and expensive and with no paper trail - appear to be received by a general operator, not a specialist caseworker who can allocate my funds there and then over the phone.

Good thread, thanks for sharing your experiences!
I paid by wire transfer as I don't have a UK bank account. I think I paid about 6 years back payments but I called them before sending the money. Told them what to allocate to which year which they noted on the system.

They are really helpful. Probably the most helpful government help line I've ever dealt with.

It took 3-4 months but all was correctly allocated except for the last one which was short due to wire transfer fees. Take note: make sure you take these into account and then add an extra tenner. Better to be over than under.

The following year, I paid that year PLUS the under-payment from the previous year PLUS extra just to be sure.

I will pay next year's in the same manner and I will be fully paid-up.
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Old Nov 9th 2018, 6:00 am
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Default Re: Class 2 NI abolished. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributio

18 months back my wife went through this, managed to get some back years paid up and started the monthly direct debit for continuing payments. I logged on line today to check her record for 2017/18 since at some point they missed 2 successive payments. Instead of 10 months payments they have recorded 12 weeks payments so she is short over £500. This also begs the question of where this year’s monthly payments are going.

She will have to call them yet again next week.
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Old Nov 9th 2018, 6:07 am
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Default Re: Class 2 NI abolished. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributio

Thanks for the quick reply!

Originally Posted by celticgrid
Note that it seems not all years are equal. You have a list of all the missing years - factual. However not all of those years will necessarily add to your pension entitlement even if paid.
Under which circumstances can a full year of paid class 2 or class 3 contributions not count towards your pension entitlement?
​​​​​
I haven't read anything like this before (except for folks who spoke about being contracted out for a few years, but decades ago).

The letter I received even states each qualifying year will entitle me to 1/30th of the full state pension. (Though now I believe it's 35 years).

Originally Posted by celticgrid
the pension folks (don't have telephone number handy but easily googled) who were super helpful and super quick to advise which years from my list would count towards entitlement years.
Did they say why certain years wouldn't count, even if you had paid 52 week's worth of contributions?

Originally Posted by celticgrid
I made my bulk payment earlier this year. Having got my 'list' and spoken to the pension people I simply sent off a check with a very detailed cover letter and an annotated copy of the 'list' making it clear which years were being paid. I was extra detailed having heard others' tales of hassle. It all went perfectly without need of any further contact. It didn't take weeks for them to open the letter!
Sounds good.
Seems there isn't an email address on their website anyway, and I don't have a cheque book, so I'll likely proceed with bulk electronic payment, and I guess telephone them 2 to 3 days later for confirmation and tell them how to allocate funds, year by year.
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Old Nov 9th 2018, 2:02 pm
  #218  
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Default Re: Class 2 NI abolished. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributio

Originally Posted by Lisboa
Under which circumstances can a full year of paid class 2 or class 3 contributions not count towards your pension entitlement?
​​​​​
I haven't read anything like this before (except for folks who spoke about being contracted out for a few years, but decades ago).

The letter I received even states each qualifying year will entitle me to 1/30th of the full state pension. (Though now I believe it's 35 years).

Did they say why certain years wouldn't count, even if you had paid 52 week's worth of contributions?
Need to separate out 2 types of year.

The fully-paid-as-they-went-by years are affected by whether you were contracted out, to what degree, etc. As you note. That's reasonable.

When talking about he years that would not count, these are ones where you were not paying and are now seeking to back-pay. When I had my list of (I think) 12 years of missing payments I was clearly told that for them to count towards a pension I had to pay...and a bit of memory needs checking here but it was something like...

Must pay either one of the most recent 2 years, plus any 4 of the preceding years. They happily advised me to pick the cheapest 4 years! Anything more than that and those additional years would not generate pension credits.

They are very helpful. I'd check with them first before paying anything.

If your letter says 30 years then it was produced before all the 2016 changes came into effect - some of the stuff I was told most probably came into force at that time, such as the changes to spouse entitlement.

Anyway, good luck. The detailed "why" doesn't bother me as I only needed a few years to reach the 35, and I think this year (18/19) and next will bring the magic number up.
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Old Dec 18th 2018, 3:00 am
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Default Re: Class 2 NI abolished. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributio

Originally Posted by OldJuddian
I finally paid for 5 years of Class 2 NICs, using my UK bank account.The money has left my account, so I hope it eventually gets credited to my NI account. Only time will tell. I used the account details they have online for SortCode/Account number&name/Ref number.
As it is nearly 2 months I called them today, and was very pleasantly surprised that after a very short wait a very polite, kind, person confirmed that the payments had been made but there is an 8-13 week backlog.
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Old Dec 18th 2018, 3:50 am
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Default Re: Class 2 NI abolished. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributio

Congratulations!

Is that 8-13 week backlog in relation to actually allocating your funds to each individual year?
They should still be able to verify, within a matter of days, that an online payment has at least hit their bank account, right?


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Old Dec 18th 2018, 8:36 am
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Default Re: Class 2 NI abolished. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributio

Originally Posted by Lisboa
Congratulations!
Is that 8-13 week backlog in relation to actually allocating your funds to each individual year?
They should still be able to verify, within a matter of days, that an online payment has at least hit their bank account, right?
Yes, they can see if there is a pending payment, but actually getting it allocated to your NI record has the long backlog as it need to be worked on by the caseworkers.
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Old Dec 18th 2018, 8:51 am
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Default Re: Class 2 NI abolished. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributio

Originally Posted by OldJuddian
Yes, they can see if there is a pending payment, but actually getting it allocated to your NI record has the long backlog as it need to be worked on by the caseworkers.
This backlog info is very helpful. Dwp cashed my 30th and final unit (I reached 65 in September) back on October 12th. I’ve put in a couple of calls over the last 6 weeks, run the gauntlet of the automated screening system (Its hell I tell ya!), then been told they are too busy to pick up, finally after obsessivley hammering away, got someone on the line, who agreed to send a note to the relevant body to get my pension increased from 29 units to 30 units. Repeated the whole thing a few weeks later to eventually get the same assurances. I wish they’d said “Go Away, and check back in 13 weeks” the first time I called. 😀
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Old Dec 18th 2018, 8:54 am
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Default Re: Class 2 NI abolished. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributio

My wife is still in this waiting game. They have the money but have not allocated it yet. It is pretty frustrating.
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Old Dec 19th 2018, 4:33 am
  #224  
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Default Re: Class 2 NI abolished. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributio

I've been getting a letter every year telling me how much I need to pay for that year.
Does anyone else get a letter?
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Old Dec 19th 2018, 4:35 am
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Default Re: Class 2 NI abolished. What about us poor expats paying voluntary contributio

Originally Posted by Hotscot
I've been getting a letter every year telling me how much I need to pay for that year.
Does anyone else get a letter?
Yes, I have a stack of them.
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