taffie77

Wouldn't that be the case in (for example) Supermarkets though? I really can't remember, as I only used cash when I was in the UK last year.

Re the tap and pay - I've seen terminals in US stores with the logo that indicates that they can be used. Mostly in Target though, and nobody wants to use cards there anymore I think you can use Google Wallet or similar at those terminals too.

Markie

No, the merchant isn't taking any risk, even though they tend to believe they are. The liability shift is that the least secure party is liable. If the merchant has EMV, but the issuing bank doesn't, the issuing bank is liable, not the merchant.

And as for why not - because it goes against the whole "use it everywhere" Visa and MasterCard are so proud of!

Target doesn't have contactless here, but yes, Google Wallet is just standard (MSD not EMV) contactless, so can be used at any contactless-enabled terminal in the US (like EMV, lots of shops have contactless terminals with the contactless function disabled just like they have the EMV function disabled).

hungryhorace

I didn't realise that. Good to know. Thanks!

Markie

Unfortunately, many small shopkeepers don't realise that either. They just know "ermagersh we're liable for fraud if we're not EMV-compliant, we better quit allowing Americans to use their credit cards!"

There have even been reports from Ireland of shops refusing chip-and-signature cards (including signature priority since it never gets to enter the PIN) on the same misguided principle. Of course, Ireland is probably the worst place in the world for credit cards in general - Visa/MC rules are rarely enforced and MANY shops force DCC against the cardholder's will - making a fortune for the shops, but massively defrauding travellers.

scrubbedexpat091

"Are we liable for fraud if the chip doesn’t work and the cashier uses the stripe?

In Canada, Visa has mandated a liability shift that will require Canadian retailers to absorb fraud cost if they accept magnetic-stripe cards instead of chip & PIN cards after 2010."

This is what we got from the processor that provides our credit card terminals. If true, I can see why some merchants are not willing to take the risk.

Markie

It's not true though, that's the confusion, what it's referring to is if the MERCHANT doesn't accept chip and PIN. Not if you take a card that isn't chip and PIN.

scrubbedexpat091

Not sure, its just what the payment processor sent, but gives no detailed explanation.

Its not a big issue for me, and doubtful Visa/MC will do anything about it. They don't really enforce their rules here.

MarylandNed

They should be able to manually key in the number though.

MarylandNed

Visa and Mastercard are doing the same thing in the US.

MarylandNed

I have an Andrews Federal Credit Union "GlobeTrek" VISA card that has chip & PIN.

https://www.andrewsfcu.org/credit_ca...k_rewards.html

- No balance transfer fees
- No annual fees
- No cash advance fees
- No International/Foreign Transaction fee

wtkp0u

That looks like the real thing. Apparently not open to everyone though

MarylandNed

Actually that's what I thought. All I had to do was open a savings account and put $5 in it to become a member. Then I was able to get the chip & PIN VISA card. By the way, I forgot to mention that the card can also be swiped in situations where the merchant can't handle chip & PIN.

MarylandNed

This is where I originally heard about this card:

https://community.ricksteves.com/tra...s-credit-union

My 2 teenage daughters were travelling to Europe and I wanted to get them a chip & PIN card because I had heard that US tourists were increasingly encountering problems trying to use swipe cards in Europe. I travel to Canada a lot and they don't see swipe cards very often anymore.

It's a bit of a pain to get but it's well worth it. I forget all the details now but basically I had to open a AFCU savings account and place $5 in it. I was then a AFCU member and eligible to apply for their "Globe Trek" VISA card. I had to supply some paperwork but I was able to do everything over the phone and email PDF copies of my paperwork to them.

DebzinUS

Yes, you would think that they should be able to manually key in the numbers... However, they said they couldn't, or more likely, wouldn't! I need to get a Chip and PIN card before my next trip home.

MarylandNed

They are violating their agreement with the credit card company then. I've had conversations with my credit card companies (including VISA and Mastercard) on this issue and they've all said very clearly that all of their merchants can process a swipe card somehow - either by swiping or manually keying the number. If not, I was told to immediately call the credit card company via collect call at the number on the back of the card. Who really wants that hassle though?

I had the same issue in a restaurant in the UK a few years ago. The young person processing my payment had no clue what to do with my US swipe card. So even though they should be able to process swipe cards, you could still run into issues. Getting a chip & PIN card is a good idea - that's what I did.

To be honest, it seems ridiculous to me that the US is behind the rest of the world on so many of these issues. Chip & PIN technology is much more secure. I have lost count of the number of times I've had a swipe card compromised. No fraud liability for me but it's still a PITA to deal with.