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Children's education in US

Children's education in US

Old Jan 25th 2017, 12:25 am
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Default Children's education in US

Hi,

My wife and I are considering moving to Arizona for 2-3 years (for a job opportunity).

We have 2 boys aged 10 and 12. The youngest will start senior school this autumn and the 12 year-old will be starting year 9.

The move will obviously be a disruption to them but we want to minimise this and are not sure of the options available to us.

I understand the youngest would enrol in Middle School but our main concern is for our son who is about to start year 9 where he would be selecting his options in the UK in preparation for GCSE's.

We have heard UK kids can still study for and sit GCSE's in USA but I've also read that unless you enrol in one of the limited British Schools (none in AZ I think) and you opt for state education you have to accept the US system (high school diploma - no sat until 18?).

Has anyone been through this process and knows what the options are or can provide advice on the pitfalls etc?

Many thanks
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Old Jan 25th 2017, 12:36 am
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Default Re: Children's education in US

Originally Posted by paulalton2017
Hi,

My wife and I are considering moving to Arizona for 2-3 years (for a job opportunity).

We have 2 boys aged 10 and 12. The youngest will start senior school this autumn and the 12 year-old will be starting year 9.

The move will obviously be a disruption to them but we want to minimise this and are not sure of the options available to us.

I understand the youngest would enrol in Middle School but our main concern is for our son who is about to start year 9 where he would be selecting his options in the UK in preparation for GCSE's.

We have heard UK kids can still study for and sit GCSE's in USA but I've also read that unless you enrol in one of the limited British Schools (none in AZ I think) and you opt for state education you have to accept the US system (high school diploma - no sat until 18?).

Has anyone been through this process and knows what the options are or can provide advice on the pitfalls etc?

Many thanks
You might look for schools that offer the IB.
Find an IB World School - International Baccalaureate®

Our eldest son completed his GCSEs in the UK, and did two years of US high school, getting sufficient US grades to be accepted at a UK Uni.

Our youngest son is in his third year of High School, and again, doing work of sufficient quality to be accepted in the UK if he wants. There are acceptable equivalences from the US to the UK in education.
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Old Jan 25th 2017, 4:33 pm
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Default Re: Children's education in US

Bear in mind you will also need to consider how old they will be when you expect to return to the UK, assuming you don't manage to get permanent residency and stay in the US.
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Old Jan 25th 2017, 5:39 pm
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Default Re: Children's education in US

You can study for IGCSE (international GCSE) in certain places in the USA. Not a bad option at all. My eldest did this in France. If your intention to go back to the UK for GCSE or A level then it's definitely worth considering if there is a school near where you are going to live. Here's a link:
http://www.cie.org.uk/i-want-to/find...bridge-school/

There were a few for Arizona.

Otherwise the International Baccalaureat is also a very good option and you are more likely to be able to find a local school that offers this. Pre-IB and IB loosely follow the British curriculum so it makes it easier to switch back when you return if you don't want to continue with IB.
look for schools here
UNITED STATES - International Baccalaureate®

The IB is widely accepted and well regarded by US universities as well as UK and EU ones. (Personal experience talking here as both my eldest kids are doing or have finishedIB)
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Old Jan 25th 2017, 5:56 pm
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Default Re: Children's education in US

Originally Posted by paulalton2017
.... The move will obviously be a disruption to them but we want to minimize this and are not sure of the options available to us.

I understand the youngest would enrol in Middle School but our main concern is for our son who is about to start year 9 where he would be selecting his options in the UK in preparation for GCSE's. ....
Minimize isn't the word I would choose given that you would be turning his educational world upside down. The situation might be manageable, but the results are unpredictable - some children do well, but it completely derails the education of others.
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Old Jan 25th 2017, 8:31 pm
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Default Re: Children's education in US

So they'd be 11 and 13 when you moved? Depending on where you live in AZ, your youngest will be in 6th grade and will either be in the final year of elementary, or the first year of middle school (districts in metro Phoenix are mostly K-5 or K-6). I've done both by moving kids aged 11 at different times - my oldest arrived in the US and went into elementary for a year (in Phoenix); my youngest moved states and went into a middle school where she didn't know anyone. I'd very much recommend the former, as it's far easier academically and socially to be in one classroom with one teacher and group of kids, rather than being shuffled around. It took the full school year for my otherwise sociable daughter to find some solid middle school friendships, and it was academically a bit of a train wreck (but all good now in 7th grade).

Your older one would go into the final year of middle school. This isn't as bad as starting as a newbie at the beginning of middle school; all the teachers will know he's new and make allowances, and the social groups can often be reforming as kids start to get funneled into streamed classes ready for high school.

Issues on the US end - nothing major, but the streaming/ accelerating for math will have already taken place, and it will be hard (but not impossible) to get on the track. If your oldest is in any way good at math, say the top 20% of his year group, you'll want him in that advanced track. All the other kids are in one mixed ability set and he'd find the pace frustrating.

Issues on the UK end - you'll be bringing back a 16 year old with no GCSEs, and an education that doesn't neatly dovetail. For example, math here goes deep by year, rather than wide - he'll be great at algebra by then, but might not have done a speck of geometry. Sciences are similarly split - he'll have done deep Biology, but no Chemistry or Physics. He'll be a whizz at US history, but won't know anything about the Elizabethans or Georgians.

It's very likely he'll have to insert an extra year into his education, to get sufficient GCSEs to go onto an A level track, if that's his likely future. You'll want to talk to some local schools to see if this was an option, and explore how he might feel about that.

It's tricky - if everyone was on side, this would be an exciting family adventure, and presumably career-enhancing for you. But there are potentially massive pitfalls in setting out to knowingly and deliberately move a 16 year old from one system to another.
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Old Jan 25th 2017, 10:09 pm
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Default Re: Children's education in US

Just another consideration, especially for the eldest, depending on how long you're out in the US and if wanting to study uni in the UK. I believe there's still the 3 year UK residency requirement to get the home rates, which wouldn't be much difference these days, but the difference would be the eligibility of getting students loans and paying it back after study, or having to pay it all up front as a international student.

Good luck and welcome to BE!
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Old Jan 25th 2017, 10:38 pm
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Default Re: Children's education in US

This is our WIKI on schools that will help explain a few basics.

Education: What do I need to enroll the kids in school? : British Expat Wiki

You may want to consider an IB or an International School in Arizona which might have courses more in line with what they'd get in the UK (though by no means identical).
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Old Jan 25th 2017, 11:34 pm
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Default Re: Children's education in US

I wouldn't go the AP route for your elder child... as Kodokan says, this does not dovetail well with the UK system should you wish to go back.

in your shoes, I'd do pre-IB and then onto IB in the UK or stay in the USA and finish the IB here and University in the UK is still an option provided your visa for the USA is a temporary one and you haven't taken residency.
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Old Jan 26th 2017, 1:35 am
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The trouble with staying in the US for the oldest to finish, is that it just kicks the can down the road for the youngest, who'd then be 16. Same issues.
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Old Jan 26th 2017, 1:43 am
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Default Re: Children's education in US

Originally Posted by kodokan
The trouble with staying in the US for the oldest to finish, is that it just kicks the can down the road for the youngest, who'd then be 16. Same issues.
sure.

But after going through it all once, want to bet that they stay put until both kids finish school??? Staying on a temp visa to avoid expensive college fees here in the USA. Although God knows what the UK will be charging by then when the kiddoes won't have the option of going to the EU for a cheaper degree. Might be cheaper to stay in the USA!
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Old Jan 26th 2017, 2:14 am
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Default Re: Children's education in US

Originally Posted by petitefrancaise
sure.

But after going through it all once, want to bet that they stay put until both kids finish school??? Staying on a temp visa to avoid expensive college fees here in the USA. Although God knows what the UK will be charging by then when the kiddoes won't have the option of going to the EU for a cheaper degree. Might be cheaper to stay in the USA!
Too true! But it's a very risky strategy. Remember you and I agreed before on how if you move here with teens, it's daft to do it on a temp visa where you might have no control over when it's revoked. What if one of their lads gets to 17, and their employer lets them go and they have just a week or so to leave the US? What happens if the oldest starts college, is two years in, and then the whole family has to return to the UK? (Or they have to send the oldest back to uni in the UK, which most parents wouldn't be able to seriously mentally plan for when looking at their then 12 or 13 year old).

The choices are to move but plan for a return in 2-3 years, with the resulting chaos to the older one's education or a firm commitment to go the IB route at both ends (if it's metro Phoenix, there are quite a few high schools that offer this and the course tends to attract the more academically motivated students/ families). Or to move, but get green cards and consider staying longer term throughout both their high school educations, and winging it a bit on how best to do college for now. Or don't come.
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Old Jan 26th 2017, 2:34 am
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Default Re: Children's education in US

I don't think you should move teenagers unless you have a fairly solid plan in place for university and I most definitely would not have moved my eldest here without the offer of green card sponsorship but then our plan was for her to attend university here in the USA. I think IB is a pretty safe all round bet though - that's the really great part of it - that you can move around and pretty much follow the same curriculum with a few local adjustments.

It would be interesting to hear how kids get on in the UK going to A levels from a pre-IB course though. Probably doesn't happen very much though because there's no need.

On a side note, Italian neighbour did quite a bit of investigating when the family were in Rome for Christmas and even the very, very, very academically elite public Italian universities are now accepting IB ( since last year, so it's a new development).
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Old Jan 26th 2017, 2:49 am
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Is Middlest still off to Europe for his college, PF? I would hope there'll be some sort of grandfathering in for pre-Brexit students, or a fast track to a study visa to finish off, etc. But then where would he want to live and work, afterwards? I'm sure it's very unsettling for you all
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Old Jan 26th 2017, 2:59 am
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Default Re: Children's education in US

Originally Posted by kodokan
Is Middlest still off to Europe for his college, PF? I would hope there'll be some sort of grandfathering in for pre-Brexit students, or a fast track to a study visa to finish off, etc. But then where would he want to live and work, afterwards? I'm sure it's very unsettling for you all
yes, he is. Just waiting for replies which will be coming in after March 1st. We have no idea about what will happen post Brexit. At the moment, the universities are still accepting UK students as nornal. Even if we end up paying international rates it's about the same as UT here in Austin. He's happy to stay in Europe afterwards but that might change.
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