Go Back  British Expats > Living & Moving Abroad > USA
Reload this Page >

Baby Nationality & Passports?

Baby Nationality & Passports?

Old Nov 3rd 2005, 11:09 am
  #31  
CPW
BE Enthusiast
 
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 622
CPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Baby Nationality & Passports?

Originally Posted by Manc
ayup Alfie, indeed the nipper will be entitled to two passports and nationalities.

the general rule of thumb is thus

If standing on US soil, use the US passport

If standing on UK/EU soil, use the British passport.
That's certainly the most straightforward option. The US requires that US citizens deal with US officials as such. Therefore, a US citizen (including a baby) travelling overseas will need a US passport to re-enter the US (or endure an awful lot of hassle). The US authorities impose no restrictions on what passport a dual citizen may use outside the US. Neither does this requirement mean that the US citizen has to show a US passport to, say, an airline employee when checking in (since such an employee is not a US official) - it may well be easier, on a trip from the US to the UK, to show the British passport, although if just going for a short trip with a return or onward ticket, it doesn't really matter since a US passport is fine for that purpose.

The UK, conversely, has no such requirement: it merely expects that the passport you present to the UK immigration authorities should be adequate for the purpose of the trip. So, British citizens who are also US citizens and who are travelling to the UK for a short holiday, say, are quite within their rights to use a US passport to enter the UK. However, they will not be treated as British citizens if they do - i.e. they will have to fill in a landing card, queue in the 'Other passports' queue, and be interviewed by a passport control officer about the length and purpose of their stay, etc. (A baby travelling with its parents won't be interviewed, of course, but the parents could be questioned about their intentions as to the length of the baby's stay and so on.)

So on travel grounds alone it makes sense to use a British passport to enter the UK.

Last edited by CPW; Nov 3rd 2005 at 11:49 am.
CPW is offline  
Old Nov 3rd 2005, 9:38 pm
  #32  
Forum Regular
 
Joined: Aug 2002
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 130
Margueriteuk is just really niceMargueriteuk is just really niceMargueriteuk is just really niceMargueriteuk is just really niceMargueriteuk is just really niceMargueriteuk is just really niceMargueriteuk is just really niceMargueriteuk is just really nice
Default Re: Baby Nationality & Passports?

Originally Posted by JAJ
Are there reasons other than citizenship why you'd want to give birth in the UK rather than the US?

You've asked a complex question whereby you want a comparison of the UK rules for citizenship by birth vs US citizenship by descent. Or the other way around.

If you want meaningful information on a question like this you need to be specific about:

- whether you're legally married (you say you are)
- is the mother British and the father American, or vice versa?
- how did each parent get citizenship (birth, descent, naturalisation etc)
- how long has the British parent lived in the UK, and the American parent in the US.

And so on.

Jeremy
Jeremy,

Reasons would be to be with my family at this time.

I am legally married (K1 Fiancée Visa) and as the mother am British and my husband, the father, is a US citizen.

Citizenship for both parents by birth in UK (mother) and birth in US (father)

British parent lived in UK 29 years, US parent lived in US 34 years.

I have just found this useful information on Documenting a Child Born in the UK to U.S. Citizen(s)

http://www.usembassy.org.uk/cons_web...childindex.htm

U.S. citizen parent appears in person at the US Embassy London - Consular Section in order to execute an application for a "Consular Report of Birth Abroad" before a consular officer. At that time, a passport application may also be executed.

Still would then need to get a UK passport and the birth would be registered in the UK on the day of birth.

Did I miss anything?

Marguerite

Last edited by Margueriteuk; Nov 3rd 2005 at 10:33 pm.
Margueriteuk is offline  
Old Nov 4th 2005, 3:16 am
  #33  
JAJ
Retired
 
JAJ's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 34,649
JAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Baby Nationality & Passports?

Originally Posted by Margueriteuk
Jeremy,

Reasons would be to be with my family at this time.

I am legally married (K1 Fiancée Visa) and as the mother am British and my husband, the father, is a US citizen.

Citizenship for both parents by birth in UK (mother) and birth in US (father)

British parent lived in UK 29 years, US parent lived in US 34 years.

I have just found this useful information on Documenting a Child Born in the UK to U.S. Citizen(s)

http://www.usembassy.org.uk/cons_web...childindex.htm

U.S. citizen parent appears in person at the US Embassy London - Consular Section in order to execute an application for a "Consular Report of Birth Abroad" before a consular officer. At that time, a passport application may also be executed.

Still would then need to get a UK passport and the birth would be registered in the UK on the day of birth.

Did I miss anything?

Marguerite

One thing you may have missed would be whether your K1 visa allows you re-entry to the United States *and* if you have an Adjustment of Status petition in place, you may need to apply for and get Advance Parole.

Ask on one of the US immigration forums.

Basically the steps shown are the way to document US citizenship for the child if born in the UK. As well as that, you would get the child a British passport from the UK Passport Service.


If child is born in the US then on the basis of what you post it will be a British citizen by descent automatically. However it's very important to document this properly by getting *both* a consular birth certificate from the British Embassy, and a British passport.

Be aware that as the child will be British 'by descent' as it's born outside the UK, it will not automatically be able to pass on its British citizenship to its own children if they are also born overseas.


Jeremy
JAJ is offline  
Old Nov 4th 2005, 4:07 am
  #34  
Just Joined
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4
newbieme is a jewel in the roughnewbieme is a jewel in the roughnewbieme is a jewel in the roughnewbieme is a jewel in the rough
Default Re: Baby Nationality & Passports?

Originally Posted by cindyabs
USC babies do indeed have to have a passport and it's good for 5 years.
Newbie here - hoping this is in right place. My kids and I are British. I brought my kids here and married a USC. We are still raising the funds to file the necessary paperwork and expect to have enough by the New Year. However, my children's passports will be out of date in February 06. How might this affect us when we file the papers? Can I send them off to UK for renewing even though they contain out-dated visas? If anyone knows what we should do, please let me know as this is causing us concern. Kindly, NEWBIE.
newbieme is offline  
Old Nov 4th 2005, 4:15 am
  #35  
JAJ
Retired
 
JAJ's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 34,649
JAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond reputeJAJ has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Baby Nationality & Passports?

Originally Posted by newbieme
Newbie here - hoping this is in right place. My kids and I are British. I brought my kids here and married a USC. We are still raising the funds to file the necessary paperwork and expect to have enough by the New Year. However, my children's passports will be out of date in February 06. How might this affect us when we file the papers? Can I send them off to UK for renewing even though they contain out-dated visas? If anyone knows what we should do, please let me know as this is causing us concern. Kindly, NEWBIE.

You renew British passports in the US at the British Embassy in Washington DC, not via the UK authorities.

You can find the details at: http://www.britishembassy.gov.uk

As for your other questions, you may get more of a response if you post on one of the US immigration forums.


Jeremy
JAJ is offline  
Old Nov 4th 2005, 5:15 am
  #36  
Just me!
 
antjen's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2002
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 752
antjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Baby Nationality & Passports?

Originally Posted by Manc
I don't know. You can be a UK citizen without a passport for sure, entering the UK as a UK citizen on a US passport might raise some serious eyebrows though
so if you were to enter the uk as a uk citizen without a uk passport, how do they know you are a uk citizen? - take you word for it - who is likely to carry their naturalisation certificate around with them

Anthony
antjen is offline  
Old Nov 4th 2005, 5:42 am
  #37  
Bob
BE Site Lead
 
Bob's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Location: MA, USA
Posts: 91,738
Bob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Baby Nationality & Passports?

Originally Posted by antjen
so if you were to enter the uk as a uk citizen without a uk passport, how do they know you are a uk citizen? - take you word for it - who is likely to carry their naturalisation certificate around with them
they'll treat you as an american if you used a US passport.
Bob is offline  
Old Nov 4th 2005, 11:53 am
  #38  
@matthewb76
 
Manc's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2003
Location: Missouri
Posts: 21,886
Manc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Baby Nationality & Passports?

Originally Posted by antjen
so if you were to enter the uk as a uk citizen without a uk passport, how do they know you are a uk citizen? - take you word for it - who is likely to carry their naturalisation certificate around with them

Anthony
Anthony, that's not what I said.
I said
"You can be a UK citizen without having a passport for sure"

I know because my Grandfather "refused to eat that foreign muck" for 50 odd years and never had one............

I never said anything about going abroad without one though.

Last edited by Manc; Nov 4th 2005 at 11:58 am.
Manc is offline  
Old Nov 4th 2005, 1:40 pm
  #39  
Just me!
 
antjen's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2002
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 752
antjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond reputeantjen has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Baby Nationality & Passports?

Originally Posted by Manc
Anthony, that's not what I said.
I said
"You can be a UK citizen without having a passport for sure"

I know because my Grandfather "refused to eat that foreign muck" for 50 odd years and never had one............

I never said anything about going abroad without one though.
Of course you can be a citizen without holding an appropriate passport.

Though you did say in your email 'entering the UK as a UK citizen on a US passport might raise some serious eyebrows though' - which implies going abroad without one - as why else would you enter the uk using a foriegn passport?
antjen is offline  
Old Nov 4th 2005, 1:42 pm
  #40  
@matthewb76
 
Manc's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2003
Location: Missouri
Posts: 21,886
Manc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond reputeManc has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Baby Nationality & Passports?

Originally Posted by antjen
Of course you can be a citizen without holding an appropriate passport.

Though you did say in your email 'entering the UK as a UK citizen on a US passport might raise some serious eyebrows though' - which implies going abroad without one - as why else would you enter the uk using a foriegn passport?
I have a friend in Canada whom is a dual citizen. born in London of canadian parents. He used to enter the UK all the time on his Canadian passport as it said he was born in London.


they didn't seem to give a toss, but I guess times have changed.

I have to add, I'd never enter the UK without a British passport.
Manc is offline  
Old Nov 4th 2005, 6:11 pm
  #41  
Bob
BE Site Lead
 
Bob's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Location: MA, USA
Posts: 91,738
Bob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond reputeBob has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Baby Nationality & Passports?

Originally Posted by Manc
I have a friend in Canada whom is a dual citizen. born in London of canadian parents. He used to enter the UK all the time on his Canadian passport as it said he was born in London.


they didn't seem to give a toss, but I guess times have changed.

I have to add, I'd never enter the UK without a British passport.
times have changed, but as long as your entering the UK and your passport is valid etc, your allowed to enter as a foreign citizen...just not worth the hassle as you'll have to fill in the landing papers and go through the immigration line at the airport...
Bob is offline  
Old Nov 4th 2005, 10:23 pm
  #42  
Forum Regular
 
Joined: Aug 2002
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 130
Margueriteuk is just really niceMargueriteuk is just really niceMargueriteuk is just really niceMargueriteuk is just really niceMargueriteuk is just really niceMargueriteuk is just really niceMargueriteuk is just really niceMargueriteuk is just really nice
Default Re: Baby Nationality & Passports?

Originally Posted by JAJ
One thing you may have missed would be whether your K1 visa allows you re-entry to the United States *and* if you have an Adjustment of Status petition in place, you may need to apply for and get Advance Parole.

Ask on one of the US immigration forums.

Basically the steps shown are the way to document US citizenship for the child if born in the UK. As well as that, you would get the child a British passport from the UK Passport Service.


If child is born in the US then on the basis of what you post it will be a British citizen by descent automatically. However it's very important to document this properly by getting *both* a consular birth certificate from the British Embassy, and a British passport.

Be aware that as the child will be British 'by descent' as it's born outside the UK, it will not automatically be able to pass on its British citizenship to its own children if they are also born overseas.

Jeremy

Jeremy,

I received my Permanent Resident Card (Green Card) this week so re-entering after 1 month away is not an issue as I have not spent too many weeks out of the USA since arriving. The K1 was mentioned just to show how I initially entered the US (in Nov 02).
Thank you very much for your assistance.

Marguerite

Last edited by Margueriteuk; Nov 4th 2005 at 10:26 pm.
Margueriteuk is offline  
Old Nov 6th 2005, 10:37 am
  #43  
CPW
BE Enthusiast
 
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 622
CPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond reputeCPW has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Baby Nationality & Passports?

Originally Posted by antjen
so if you were to enter the uk as a uk citizen without a uk passport, how do they know you are a uk citizen? - take you word for it - who is likely to carry their naturalisation certificate around with them

Anthony
It's not going to raise any questions if you travel to the UK as a short-term visitor on a US passport, as long as the length and purpose of your stay in the UK is not such that a US citizen would require a visa (e.g. if you were wanting to work or study there or were proposing to stay for more than 6 months). You will, however, be treated at the port of entry as a US citizen, not as a British citizen.

Of course, this applies only to those people who are citizens of countries have visa-free entry to the UK as visitors. Citizens of visa countries would have to apply for a visa or entry clearance - but, in theory and probably in practice, the only endorsement the British authorities will put in a non-British passport of a British citizen is a Certificate of Entltlement to the Right of Abode in the UK (see next paragraph).

If, as a British citizen, you really want to enter the UK on a US or other non-British, non-EEA passport for purposes other than a short visit, you can apply for a Certificate of Entitlement to the Right of Abode in the UK to be placed in your non-British passport. This confirms that you are entirely free of immigration control, enables you to use the British/EEA passport queue at ports of entry, and spares you the need to fill in a landing card and be interviewed by an immigration officer about the purpose of your trip. However, if you apply for the right of abode certificate outside the UK it is, I believe, more expensive than a British passport. (Inside the UK, the fee for a right of abode certificate has remained at £20 for many years.) Transfer of a certificate from an expired passport into a new passport is generally free, either inside or outside the UK.

Children who are dual British-other citizens can also have a right of abode certificate placed in their non-British passport.

But really, it's simpler (and mostly cheaper) just to get a British passport.

Last edited by CPW; Nov 6th 2005 at 10:55 am.
CPW is offline  
Old Nov 7th 2005, 4:30 am
  #44  
Forum Regular
 
bodmin13's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Location: Nottingham
Posts: 41
bodmin13 will become famous soon enough
Default Re: Baby Nationality & Passports?

Ok, so my son is a dual british and american citizen born in japan. We had to register his birth in both countries just so that we could go to either. On our trip to England we applied for and recieved his british passport, it has never been used but it is just nice to have as proof of citizenship. A british passport is not essential cuz the americans require american citizens to only use an american passport.
bodmin13 is offline  
Old Nov 7th 2005, 12:18 pm
  #45  
BE Enthusiast
 
TimFountain's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2003
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 903
TimFountain has a reputation beyond reputeTimFountain has a reputation beyond reputeTimFountain has a reputation beyond reputeTimFountain has a reputation beyond reputeTimFountain has a reputation beyond reputeTimFountain has a reputation beyond reputeTimFountain has a reputation beyond reputeTimFountain has a reputation beyond reputeTimFountain has a reputation beyond reputeTimFountain has a reputation beyond reputeTimFountain has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Baby Nationality & Passports?

Originally Posted by Margueriteuk
Jeremy,

....I am legally married (K1 Fiancée....
Can you be illegally married?

- Tim
TimFountain is offline  

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.