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Any car enthusiasts? Here's the scenario - what would you buy?

Any car enthusiasts? Here's the scenario - what would you buy?

Old May 24th 2017, 1:29 am
  #16  
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Default Re: Any car enthusiasts? Here's the scenario - what would you buy?

Originally Posted by markonline1 View Post
To be fair, he didn't say they weren't reliable, or a good car, just that they depreciate like a stone. Every Kia I've driven, and I've driven a few now, seems to be a decent car, if that's the sort of thing you're looking for.
I had a few Kias in UK. All fine. Ended up with a Kia Carens (RONDO in US) from new, 7 year warranty, admittedly a diesel as we never got the 2.4V6, 7 seater but only used them twice! However, the trade in value of the 7 seater was higher than the 5 seater.Paid £14,000 and got £4500 when I sold it after 4years and 85,000 miles. (don't forget the £14K included 20% VAT!)Previously had a honda Shuttle (ODDESSY) - a superb vehicle but expensive to repair and a gas guzzler.
Here, I currently have a Kia Carens MK2 - previous version to the one I had in UK. 200K KM on clock , goes like a train, comfortable and economical - fuel here is less than half the UK price! Can get spares for it OK. Had it 3 years and it's still worth 85% of what I paid - used cars here cost a relative fortune! Anyway that's my 2 cents worth. Kias are OK if you intend keeping them for a few years, but not so much if you like to trade in every couple of years!
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Old May 24th 2017, 1:17 pm
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Default Re: Any car enthusiasts? Here's the scenario - what would you buy?

Originally Posted by sherbert View Post
Like most things American, they are very nice and sleek and shiny on the outside but a bunch of junk under the surface... Seriously though, look at the top performing/most reliable cars and also look at mpg efficiency and you'll rarely find a US brand there (notable exception in this list of 2016 most reliable cars is Buick):
The 8 most reliable car brands according to Consumer Reports - Business Insider

Also, the OP is buying outright secondhand and will probably want to sell them on at a certain point so will need to consider resale value.
Do you have any actual experience owning an american brand car ?
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Old May 24th 2017, 5:43 pm
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Default Re: Any car enthusiasts? Here's the scenario - what would you buy?

Originally Posted by Pulaski View Post
Try factoring in recalls instead of only "reliability", and that would likely change the picture significantly. In recent years Toyota have had recalls out the wazoo, Honda has had recall after recall, though mostly focused on allegedly faulty airbags.

Granted Chevrolet doesn't have much to brag about either on the recall front, with IIRC, the average Chevy built between 2006 and around 2014 having had more than one recall.

I have two Fords myself, with an aggregate of pushing 200,000 miles. In that time there has been one breakdown, which quite frankly was due to poor inspections (of worn steering parts) than an unexpected mechanical failure. I would have absolutely no reservations about recommending Ford vehicles.
The vast majority of all cars tend not to have issues, and your experience of having had 2 Fords without issues should not be uncommon; but it's hard to argue with statistical evidence, assuming you can trust the source ... and I tend to have a good opinion of CR.

Another thing to consider is that ALL cars have significantly improved, over time, in terms of reliability so 'any' car today is way better than 'any' car from 20 years ago. Further, I believe I read that many of the 'reliability' issues surfacing in today's cars are related to fancy infotainment systems (I think that's Honda's biggest issue right now) rather than the core mechanics, so 'problems' are not likely to strand you by the roadside (but may tie you up at the dealership waiting for fixes).
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Old May 24th 2017, 6:02 pm
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Default Re: Any car enthusiasts? Here's the scenario - what would you buy?

You also have to look at WHY a brand has been marked down and whether it's an important safety issue or not. For example, The Ford Edge was given low scores because of the confusing infotainment system and touch controls, which are not necessarily important. I picked up a 2011 Edge for $8500 under book because the previous owner was unable to work the Sync system! CR marked the Edge low because of it and I got a bargain!

I got it with 35k on the clock and I've put about 50k on it in 4.5 years with just a couple of small warranty issues so far.
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Old May 24th 2017, 6:11 pm
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Default Re: Any car enthusiasts? Here's the scenario - what would you buy?

Originally Posted by Guindalf View Post
You also have to look at WHY a brand has been marked down and whether it's an important safety issue or not. For example, The Ford Edge was given low scores because of the confusing infotainment system and touch controls, which are not necessarily important. I picked up a 2011 Edge for $8500 under book because the previous owner was unable to work the Sync system! CR marked the Edge low because of it and I got a bargain!

I got it with 35k on the clock and I've put about 50k on it in 4.5 years with just a couple of small warranty issues so far.
The point you are making is valid, but to clarify, the ratings I referred to were purely reliability ratings, based on CR following up with people who have owned a car for some time and asking about actual problems. The ratings you are talking about are the CR 'overall' ratings, which take into account usability, space, aesthetics, fuel efficiency, etc.
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Old May 24th 2017, 6:20 pm
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Default Re: Any car enthusiasts? Here's the scenario - what would you buy?

Originally Posted by Steerpike View Post
The vast majority of all cars tend not to have issues, and your experience of having had 2 Fords without issues should not be uncommon; but it's hard to argue with statistical evidence, assuming you can trust the source ... and I tend to have a good opinion of CR.

Another thing to consider is that ALL cars have significantly improved, over time, in terms of reliability so 'any' car today is way better than 'any' car from 20 years ago. Further, I believe I read that many of the 'reliability' issues surfacing in today's cars are related to fancy infotainment systems (I think that's Honda's biggest issue right now) rather than the core mechanics, so 'problems' are not likely to strand you by the roadside (but may tie you up at the dealership waiting for fixes).
That's exactly right on the reported reliability issues nowadays. Most seem to be concerning the electronics and sometimes that's due to misunderstanding of how the stuff actually works. Virtually every manufacturer produces reliable cars.

I don't think reliability comes into play as long as you can assure yourself the car has been looked after correctly. That is serviced according to what the manufacturer requires. No problem if this is a brand new car but buying second hand makes this much harder to ensure.

In the 25 years I've lived here I've owned a

Nissan
Acura
Subaru
3 Honda's
1 Volvo
2 VW's
1 Chevrolet

Aside from the Nissan (which I found out later had had a rough life and distinct lack of servicing) every single one of them has been reliable. Alot of that is due to them being bought brand new and me ensuring the required servicing is done. They have all had parts replaced under warranty and outside of warranty and I can say that none of the Japanese ones have been any better than the others.

IMO another important thing to consider when picking a brand is how good the dealerships (or independents you choose to use) are around you. No point picking a brand and have to drive significant distance to get to a dealer for service. Case in point for me is I like Mazda's however there is no decent dealership close by so I won't consider buying one.
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Old May 24th 2017, 8:20 pm
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Default Re: Any car enthusiasts? Here's the scenario - what would you buy?

Originally Posted by markonline1 View Post
We have a Forester. I find it quite restrictive in size, even for a family of 4
A recent one? My family fits in easily, a fifth person isn't too bad either even with booster seats for the kids. They have the most amount of trunk space for the money/mpg right now. They aren't a full SUV though, probably why they are so much cheaper than one.
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Old May 24th 2017, 9:44 pm
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Default Re: Any car enthusiasts? Here's the scenario - what would you buy?

Originally Posted by rbackhouse View Post
In the 25 years I've lived here I've owned a
Originally Posted by rbackhouse View Post

Nissan
Acura
Subaru
3 Honda's
1 Volvo
2 VW's
1 Chevrolet
In the past 40+ years, I've owned only 5 cars:

1969 Simca 1204
1980 Chevy Monza
1988 Chevy Cavalier Z24
2000 Pontiac Grand Am GT
2007 Ford Mustang GT

With the exception of the Simca which I bought used, the rest were all new. All were daily drivers. I've never had an issue with any of them.

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Old May 24th 2017, 10:00 pm
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Default Re: Any car enthusiasts? Here's the scenario - what would you buy?

Originally Posted by Steerpike View Post
The vast majority of all cars tend not to have issues, and your experience of having had 2 Fords without issues should not be uncommon; but it's hard to argue with statistical evidence, assuming you can trust the source ... and I tend to have a good opinion of CR.

Another thing to consider is that ALL cars have significantly improved, over time, in terms of reliability so 'any' car today is way better than 'any' car from 20 years ago. Further, I believe I read that many of the 'reliability' issues surfacing in today's cars are related to fancy infotainment systems (I think that's Honda's biggest issue right now) rather than the core mechanics, so 'problems' are not likely to strand you by the roadside (but may tie you up at the dealership waiting for fixes).


Personally I don't trust Consumer Reports as it seems to invite complaints more than objectivity.

I am pleased to see that you acknowledge that it is iffy electronics that are causing many vehicles to be criticized. Our next door neighbor eventually handed his BMW 550 back to the dealer after several months of it being back at the dealer for repairs to its electronic entertainment and navigation systems. I hope the M4 he traded it for was more reliable (he moved shortly after the swap).

We bought a new Honda Accord a few weeks ago - specifically because Ford doesn't sell a comparable vehicle with a manual transmission, and the "finance guy" tried to use the iffy entertainment and navigation electricals to up-sell us additional warranty coverage costing hundreds of dollars a year!

I apparently have more confidence in the vehicle we bought than he did, but I have turned down dozens of extended warranties in my life, mostly on appliances and it took until last year before a purchase failed that would have been covered by the warranty. I believe I am somewhere around $5,000 "up" by not buying extended warranties.

Last edited by Pulaski; May 24th 2017 at 10:10 pm.
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Old May 25th 2017, 11:32 am
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Default Re: Any car enthusiasts? Here's the scenario - what would you buy?

Originally Posted by Pulaski View Post
Personally I don't trust Consumer Reports as it seems to invite complaints more than objectivity.
You clearly have not experienced a CR survey. They do not in any way invite good or bad comments. For cars, and all other products, they have an extensive series of questions on which you rate a range of features.

It certainly isn't perfect but I would rather rely on extensive surveys than individual experiences of particular brands/models.
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Old May 25th 2017, 1:11 pm
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Default Re: Any car enthusiasts? Here's the scenario - what would you buy?

Originally Posted by MidAtlantic View Post
You clearly have not experienced a CR survey. They do not in any way invite good or bad comments. For cars, and all other products, they have an extensive series of questions on which you rate a range of features. .....
That's not quite what I meant. People who have complaints are more motivated to fill in surveys, it's just human nature.
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