simongb

Ask any African American (and I have African American friends who I have spoken to about this, so I quote them) about how they are treated as second class citizens in their own country. It is true, I am not familiar with all the details of what happened to the slaves and I have made it my task to become more informed about this issue, but I do see how racism is a major part of this society. I was shocked when I first came here by the way people of color were treated. This is the last comment I will make on the issue as I do not wish to educate you about your own country. Maybe some time spent in the UK will enlighten you as to how the US treats its citizens of color.

cindyabs

I have been visiting the UK since 1984 so I am somewhat familiar with life there. I also lived in Europe for seven years, so I have seen life outside of the realms of the US.

I appreciate the fact that you are not going to educate me about my country. If however you could enlighten me about algebra let me know. appreciate that.

geeandtee

Best book to read to get the background on the conflict between native Americans and the European settlers, etc. is definitely "Bury my Heart at Wounded Knee" by Dee Brown. The book has been kicking around for years, but it's excellent and, IMO, every high school kid in this country (especially those living near Reservations) should read it.

The Bard of Wigan

Some informative replies to what was a tongue in cheek comment.

Get yourselves on my homepage and by all means leave a comment or two, good or bad.

Thanks

The Bard of Wigan.

The Bard of Wigan

Much older.

simongb

Thanks! I will check out that book.

robin1234

You make an interesting point in your last paragraph, about our responsibility for historical events.
On the one hand, I could say that Americans are responsible for everything that the white European community did - after all, the colonists were self-governing and cannot really claim (like concentration camp guards) -- "we were just following orders from London." Is "Independence," 1776 or 1783, depending on your point of view, really a definitive cut-off point? I imagine there was a lot of continuity in personnel and policies in state and county and town government before & after independence.
At the other end of the scale, you could argue that people have no responsibility for historical events that happened before they were born, or before they attained voting age. If I were German, for instance, I would get pretty tired of having to feel apologetic about the Holocaust (and I speak as someone whose family is Jewish.) Big proviso to that argument; as a German born after the war, I MIGHT still be deemed to have responsibility for the Holocaust if my family wealth was based on Jewish expropriation, or I worked at a firm that profited from Jewish or other slave labour & hadn't given full compensation, etc. This last argument is similar to the argument that all members of the majority community in America, including recent immigrants, still profit from the expropriation of Native Americans and the exploitation of African Americans.

cindyabs

[QUOTE=robin1234;6271935]You make an interesting point in your last paragraph, about our responsibility for historical events.
On the one hand, I could say that Americans are responsible for everything that the white European community did - after all, the colonists were self-governing and cannot really claim (like concentration camp guards) -- "we were just following orders from London." Is "Independence," 1776 or 1783, depending on your point of view, really a definitive cut-off point? I imagine there was a lot of continuity in personnel and policies in state and county and town government before & after independence. [QUOTE]


Self governing? The Governors of the Colonies were Royal Governors, not elected, but appointed by the Crown and therefore under the Crown's jurisdiction.

I would say that on the highest level, personnel AND policies in state or territorial government were NOT the same after independence.

1624 - The Virginia Company charter is revoked in London and Virginia is declared a Royal colony.

1686 - King James II begins consolidating the colonies of New England into a single Dominion depriving colonists of their local political rights and independence. Legislatures are dissolved and the King's representatives assume all of the judicial and legislative power.

1691 - In New York, the newly appointed Governor of New England, Henry Sloughter, arrives from England and institutes royally sanctioned representative government. In October, Massachusetts gets a new royal charter which includes government by a royal governor and a governor's council.


1750 - The Iron Act is passed by the English Parliament, limiting the growth of the iron industry in the American colonies to protect the English Iron industry.

1751 - The Currency Act is passed by the English Parliament, banning the issuing of paper money by the New England colonies

1764 - The Sugar Act is passed by the English Parliament to offset the war debt brought on by the French and Indian War and to help pay for the expenses of running the colonies and newly acquired territories. This act increases the duties on imported sugar and other items such as textiles, coffee, wines and indigo (dye). It doubles the duties on foreign goods reshipped from England to the colonies and also forbids the import of foreign rum and French wines.

1764 - The English Parliament passes a measure to reorganize the American customs system to better enforce British trade laws, which have often been ignored in the past. A court is established in Halifax, Nova Scotia, that will have jurisdiction over all of the American colonies in trade matters.

1764 - The Currency Act prohibits the colonists from issuing any legal tender paper money. This act threatens to destabilize the entire colonial economy of both the industrial North and agricultural South, thus uniting the colonists against it.

1766 - On the same day it repealed the Stamp Act, the English Parliament passes the Declaratory Act stating that the British government has total power to legislate any laws governing the American colonies in all cases whatsoever.

1767 - In June, The English Parliament passes the Townshend Revenue Acts, imposing a new series of taxes on the colonists to offset the costs of administering and protecting the American colonies. Items taxed include imports such as paper, tea, glass, lead and paints. The Act also establishes a colonial board of customs commissioners in Boston. In October, Bostonians decide to reinstate a boycott of English luxury items.

1768 - In February, Samuel Adams of Massachusetts writes a Circular Letter opposing taxation without representation and calling for the colonists to unite in their actions against the British government. The letter is sent to assemblies throughout the colonies and also instructs them on the methods the Massachusetts general court is using to oppose the Townshend Acts.

1768 - In April, England's Secretary of State for the Colonies, Lord Hillsborough, orders colonial governors to stop their own assemblies from endorsing Adams' circular letter. Hillsborough also orders the governor of Massachusetts to dissolve the general court if the Massachusetts assembly does not revoke the letter. By month's end, the assemblies of New Hampshire, Connecticut and New Jersey have endorsed the letter.

1768 - In July, the governor of Massachusetts dissolves the general court after the legislature defies his order to revoke Adams' circular letter. In August, in Boston and New York, merchants agree to boycott most British goods until the Townshend Acts are repealed. In September, at a town meeting in Boston, residents are urged to arm themselves. Later in September, English warships sail into Boston Harbor, then two regiments of English infantry land in Boston and set up permanent residence to keep order.

1769 - In March, merchants in Philadelphia join the boycott of British trade goods. In May, a set of resolutions written by George Mason is presented by George Washington to the Virginia House of Burgesses. The Virginia Resolves oppose taxation without representation, the British opposition to the circular letters, and British plans to possibly send American agitators to England for trial. Ten days later, the Royal governor of Virginia dissolves the House of Burgesses. However, its members meet the next day in a Williamsburg tavern and agree to a boycott of British trade goods, luxury items and slaves

1774 - In March, an angry English Parliament passes the first of a series of Coercive Acts (called Intolerable Acts by Americans) in response to the rebellion in Massachusetts. The Boston Port Bill effectively shuts down all commercial shipping in Boston harbor until Massachusetts pays the taxes owed on the tea dumped in the harbor and also reimburses the East India Company for the loss of the tea.

1774 - May 12, Bostonians at a town meeting call for a boycott of British imports in response to the Boston Port Bill. May 13, General Thomas Gage, commander of all British military forces in the colonies, arrives in Boston and replaces Hutchinson as Royal governor, putting Massachusetts under military rule. He is followed by the arrival of four regiments of British troops.

1774 - May 17-23, colonists in Providence, New York and Philadelphia begin calling for an intercolonial congress to overcome the Coercive Acts and discuss a common course of action against the British.

1774 - May 20, The English Parliament enacts the next series of Coercive Acts, which include the Massachusetts Regulating Act and the Government Act virtually ending any self-rule by the colonists there. Instead, the English Crown and the Royal governor assume political power formerly exercised by colonists. Also enacted; the Administration of Justice Act which protects royal officials in Massachusetts from being sued in colonial courts, and the Quebec Act establishing a centralized government in Canada controlled by the Crown and English Parliament. The Quebec Act greatly upsets American colonists by extending the southern boundary of Canada into territories claimed by Massachusetts, Connecticut and Virginia.

1774 - In June, a new version of the 1765 Quartering Act is enacted by the English Parliament requiring all of the American colonies to provide housing for British troops in occupied houses and taverns and in unoccupied buildings. In September, Massachusetts Governor Gage seizes that colony's arsenal of weapons at Charlestown.

and so it escalated-


If we are discussing a sense of inherited responsibility for acts perpetrated by the settlement of North America be it the diaspora of the Native Americans (and I speak as having a Native American ancestress born before the Revolution) or the institution of slavery, then that would extend beyond this side of the Atlantic back to Europe.

Wrong is wrong and the best we can do is to learn from it and I think you would agree with me on that point.

ugacrew

I saw that Optimus Prime....teehehehehe. Brazil...come on.

JULIEROSE

Try the online citizenship test.

melody32

*humbly bows AND curtseys (spelling i know :P) with respect and admiration*
i will never ever play jeopardy with you my friend.

however, i will *chuckle* explain this: algebra is "the branch of mathematics that deals with general statements of relations, utilizing letters and other symbols to represent specific sets of numbers, values, vectors, etc., in the description of such relations" such as: r + s = r -s -2

1. subtract r from both sides to get s = -s -2
2. add s to both sides to get 2s = 2
3. divide by 2 to both sides to get s - 1.

cindyabs

As for the algebra-hahahahahaha easy for you to say,

melody32

more like copy & paste

cindyabs

I wish they'd havd copy and paste when I was in high school.

zargof

Hmm... an interesting thread, so I think I'll stick my oar in....

From an American viewpoint you would have to be very naive or a blinkered fool to not accept that there is a lot in American history that is negative. However, as a European we cannot really be sanctamonious about this considering our imperialistic and hegemonic past in say... Africa, South America, the Middle East and well pretty much everywhere really.

As to the OP, I would like to recommend reading "A People's History of the United States: 1492-Present" by Howard Zinn, as this explains things like how Christopher Columbus was something of a bastard, and more of the reasons for the War of Independence, but unfortunately this isn't the history that is taught in American schools.