Visiting my girlfriend in the US with a UK criminal record.
Oct 25th 2019, 4:58 pm
#91
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Re: Visiting my girlfriend in the US with a UK criminal record.
You might be up shit creek here. Your two common assault offences are not an issue but the theft thing definitely is one:
The problem now is that USICS has a credible argument that you misrepresented yourself by using ESTA when you were in fact potentially not eligible.
A misrep claim makes your case infinitely more difficult. Do not return to the attorney you saw previously, you need one that is familiar with UK Court proceedings in addition to the details of the INA. Members of this forum, myself included, can give you recommendations of competent counsel. That counsel will have to successfully argue that you did not mean to permanently deprive the victim in your theft case, which is additionally more complex given your relationship. The INA does not care about eye for an eye type cases, and it's likely the background context will be ignored. You need a good attorney for this and I am still not entirely convinced that you'll get away with it.
I hate to rub it in, but this is a prime case of ignoring the advice you were given here, and doing something that might have royally screwed up your next steps. If you'd gone for a B-2 with waiver of inadmissibility, you would have no problems going forward.
The problem now is that USICS has a credible argument that you misrepresented yourself by using ESTA when you were in fact potentially not eligible.
A misrep claim makes your case infinitely more difficult. Do not return to the attorney you saw previously, you need one that is familiar with UK Court proceedings in addition to the details of the INA. Members of this forum, myself included, can give you recommendations of competent counsel. That counsel will have to successfully argue that you did not mean to permanently deprive the victim in your theft case, which is additionally more complex given your relationship. The INA does not care about eye for an eye type cases, and it's likely the background context will be ignored. You need a good attorney for this and I am still not entirely convinced that you'll get away with it.
I hate to rub it in, but this is a prime case of ignoring the advice you were given here, and doing something that might have royally screwed up your next steps. If you'd gone for a B-2 with waiver of inadmissibility, you would have no problems going forward.
The US attorney did mention the theft one was the most serious, and when I asked her where I stand with the ESTA, she went and checked.
When she returned, she told both me and my girlfriend that with the ESTA I had answered the questions correctly, as they had changed the wording and moral terpitude was no longer one of the questions.
So I was on with that one.
But the thing to worry about would be getting the k1 visa, and that was when she requested the police certificate.
Due to the advice we were given, we honestly thought we had gone about things the right way, seeking a lawyer to help etc
Oct 25th 2019, 7:00 pm
#92
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Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 520
Re: Visiting my girlfriend in the US with a UK criminal record.
Thanks for your reply.
The US attorney did mention the theft one was the most serious, and when I asked her where I stand with the ESTA, she went and checked.
When she returned, she told both me and my girlfriend that with the ESTA I had answered the questions correctly, as they had changed the wording and moral terpitude was no longer one of the questions.
So I was on with that one.
But the thing to worry about would be getting the k1 visa, and that was when she requested the police certificate.
Due to the advice we were given, we honestly thought we had gone about things the right way, seeking a lawyer to help etc
The US attorney did mention the theft one was the most serious, and when I asked her where I stand with the ESTA, she went and checked.
When she returned, she told both me and my girlfriend that with the ESTA I had answered the questions correctly, as they had changed the wording and moral terpitude was no longer one of the questions.
So I was on with that one.
But the thing to worry about would be getting the k1 visa, and that was when she requested the police certificate.
Due to the advice we were given, we honestly thought we had gone about things the right way, seeking a lawyer to help etc
The CIMT can be waived for the K-1 with relative ease, but if you are found to have misrepresented yourself during your ESTA application, which I and others on this board think you probably have, you then may need to get another waiver for misrep if the consular officer feels the same way, which means achieving this:
An applicant inadmissible for fraud or willful misrepresentation may be eligible for a waiver. Before adjudicating the waiver, the officer should determine if the applicant is inadmissible for fraud or willful misrepresentation.
If inadmissible, the applicant must meet the following requirements before a waiver can be granted:
If inadmissible, the applicant must meet the following requirements before a waiver can be granted:
- The applicant must show that denial of admission to or removal from the United States would result in extreme hardship to his or her qualifying relative (or if the applicant is a VAWA self-petitioner, to himself or herself); and
- The applicant must show that a favorable exercise of discretion is warranted
I repeat, do not use this attorney in your K-1 application. You need an attorney that will ensure they address the misrepresentation possibility over your application for an ESTA and in doing so will prevent the consular officer concluding that you misrepresented yourself. Ignorance of the law is unfortunately not an acceptable excuse. The ambiguity of the questions may be enough, it may not be, but the attorney you used clearly does not understand how the INA interacts with the VWP.
Oct 25th 2019, 7:06 pm
#93
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Joined: Jun 2011
Location: UK
Posts: 4,891
Re: Visiting my girlfriend in the US with a UK criminal record.
Thanks for your reply.
The US attorney did mention the theft one was the most serious, and when I asked her where I stand with the ESTA, she went and checked.
When she returned, she told both me and my girlfriend that with the ESTA I had answered the questions correctly, as they had changed the wording and moral terpitude was no longer one of the questions.
So I was on with that one.
But the thing to worry about would be getting the k1 visa, and that was when she requested the police certificate.
Due to the advice we were given, we honestly thought we had gone about things the right way, seeking a lawyer to help etc
The US attorney did mention the theft one was the most serious, and when I asked her where I stand with the ESTA, she went and checked.
When she returned, she told both me and my girlfriend that with the ESTA I had answered the questions correctly, as they had changed the wording and moral terpitude was no longer one of the questions.
So I was on with that one.
But the thing to worry about would be getting the k1 visa, and that was when she requested the police certificate.
Due to the advice we were given, we honestly thought we had gone about things the right way, seeking a lawyer to help etc
A decent attorney with relevant experience in US immigration issues would have known this and advised you correctly.
Oct 25th 2019, 7:10 pm
#94
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Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 39
Re: Visiting my girlfriend in the US with a UK criminal record.
Yes, I understand what you've said previously about this attorney. As has been mentioned, the change in the wording of the ESTA questions does not mean you are not ineligible according to the Immigration and Nationality Act. Your attorney was and is wrong.
The CIMT can be waived for the K-1 with relative ease, but if you are found to have misrepresented yourself during your ESTA application, which I and others on this board think you probably have, you then may need to get another waiver for misrep if the consular officer feels the same way, which means achieving this:
The extreme hardship waivers are exceptionally difficult to get.
I repeat, do not use this attorney in your K-1 application. You need an attorney that will ensure they address the misrepresentation possibility over your application for an ESTA and in doing so will prevent the consular officer concluding that you misrepresented yourself. Ignorance of the law is unfortunately not an acceptable excuse. The ambiguity of the questions may be enough, it may not be, but the attorney you used clearly does not understand how the INA interacts with the VWP.
The CIMT can be waived for the K-1 with relative ease, but if you are found to have misrepresented yourself during your ESTA application, which I and others on this board think you probably have, you then may need to get another waiver for misrep if the consular officer feels the same way, which means achieving this:
The extreme hardship waivers are exceptionally difficult to get.
I repeat, do not use this attorney in your K-1 application. You need an attorney that will ensure they address the misrepresentation possibility over your application for an ESTA and in doing so will prevent the consular officer concluding that you misrepresented yourself. Ignorance of the law is unfortunately not an acceptable excuse. The ambiguity of the questions may be enough, it may not be, but the attorney you used clearly does not understand how the INA interacts with the VWP.
Thanks again for your post.
Am I right in thinking that my chances of getting the k1 have just dropped from slim to none?
Yes I know I made some stupid mistakes years ago, I admit I took the law into my own hands which was definitely not the right way to go about things, nothing I can do about they now. But I have kept out of trouble since then even when the hotel stole my Drill and other tools in retaliation for the bulbs. I just walked away after being charged for that.
She really is a good woman, I just want to do everything right and move on from all this.
Also somebody said to me, to skip the k1 and just go for the spousal. We do plan on getting married anyway, just not sure when. Is there really much difference apart from being engaged and married?
Oct 25th 2019, 7:12 pm
#95
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Re: Visiting my girlfriend in the US with a UK criminal record.
The wording on ESTA had changed, but the meaning of the question still refers to moral turpitude. This was well publicised and widely discussed at the time the change was made.
A decent attorney with relevant experience in US immigration issues would have known this and advised you correctly.
A decent attorney with relevant experience in US immigration issues would have known this and advised you correctly.
Oct 25th 2019, 7:13 pm
#96
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Joined: Jun 2011
Location: UK
Posts: 4,891
Re: Visiting my girlfriend in the US with a UK criminal record.
Yes, I understand what you've said previously about this attorney. As has been mentioned, the change in the wording of the ESTA questions does not mean you are not ineligible according to the Immigration and Nationality Act. Your attorney was and is wrong.
The CIMT can be waived for the K-1 with relative ease, but if you are found to have misrepresented yourself during your ESTA application, which I and others on this board think you probably have, you then may need to get another waiver for misrep if the consular officer feels the same way, which means achieving this:
The extreme hardship waivers are exceptionally difficult to get.
I repeat, do not use this attorney in your K-1 application. You need an attorney that will ensure they address the misrepresentation possibility over your application for an ESTA and in doing so will prevent the consular officer concluding that you misrepresented yourself. Ignorance of the law is unfortunately not an acceptable excuse. The ambiguity of the questions may be enough, it may not be, but the attorney you used clearly does not understand how the INA interacts with the VWP.
The CIMT can be waived for the K-1 with relative ease, but if you are found to have misrepresented yourself during your ESTA application, which I and others on this board think you probably have, you then may need to get another waiver for misrep if the consular officer feels the same way, which means achieving this:
The extreme hardship waivers are exceptionally difficult to get.
I repeat, do not use this attorney in your K-1 application. You need an attorney that will ensure they address the misrepresentation possibility over your application for an ESTA and in doing so will prevent the consular officer concluding that you misrepresented yourself. Ignorance of the law is unfortunately not an acceptable excuse. The ambiguity of the questions may be enough, it may not be, but the attorney you used clearly does not understand how the INA interacts with the VWP.
A conoff may see it differently of course, and it may cause extra issues for their subsequent visa application. Time will tell.
Oct 25th 2019, 8:22 pm
#97
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Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 520
Re: Visiting my girlfriend in the US with a UK criminal record.
Thanks again for your post.
Am I right in thinking that my chances of getting the k1 have just dropped from slim to none?
Yes I know I made some stupid mistakes years ago, I admit I took the law into my own hands which was definitely not the right way to go about things, nothing I can do about they now. But I have kept out of trouble since then even when the hotel stole my Drill and other tools in retaliation for the bulbs. I just walked away after being charged for that.
She really is a good woman, I just want to do everything right and move on from all this.
Also somebody said to me, to skip the k1 and just go for the spousal. We do plan on getting married anyway, just not sure when. Is there really much difference apart from being engaged and married?
Am I right in thinking that my chances of getting the k1 have just dropped from slim to none?
Yes I know I made some stupid mistakes years ago, I admit I took the law into my own hands which was definitely not the right way to go about things, nothing I can do about they now. But I have kept out of trouble since then even when the hotel stole my Drill and other tools in retaliation for the bulbs. I just walked away after being charged for that.
She really is a good woman, I just want to do everything right and move on from all this.
Also somebody said to me, to skip the k1 and just go for the spousal. We do plan on getting married anyway, just not sure when. Is there really much difference apart from being engaged and married?
A good attorney will address this in your K-1 application. You've not gone to none from slim, you've gone from pretty much no issues to a slim chance you're really screwed.
I had a potential misrep as I did exactly the same thing as you but with a drug conviction (so potentially worse actually), and my attorney addressed the misrep over the ambiguity of the questions. ESTA was different when I applied though.
I do not know about going straight for a spousal status with respect to your criminal status - not my area of knowledge. I am sure I have read that it makes things easier. Your timeline getting into work etc will definitely be much shorter. The general advice on this forum seems to be skip the K-1 if you can, it's an unnecessary hurdle a lot of the time.
Oct 26th 2019, 10:24 am
#98
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Joined: Apr 2010
Location: The Boonies, GA
Posts: 9,561
Re: Visiting my girlfriend in the US with a UK criminal record.
The CR1 is significantly cheaper than the K1 when you consider that thereis only one application to get the immigrant visa/green card, rather than 2 with the K1.
Personally I think, bearing in mind your situation, that you should get married and go from there. That is easier said then done though, since you really know now that you should not use the ESTA again to enter the US, and the UK has some pretty burdensome regulations when it comes to giving notice of marriage.
Personally I think, bearing in mind your situation, that you should get married and go from there. That is easier said then done though, since you really know now that you should not use the ESTA again to enter the US, and the UK has some pretty burdensome regulations when it comes to giving notice of marriage.
Oct 26th 2019, 10:33 am
#99
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Joined: Aug 2019
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Re: Visiting my girlfriend in the US with a UK criminal record.
You may get a really mean consular officer who suspects willful misrep and then you're screwed. You may not.
A good attorney will address this in your K-1 application. You've not gone to none from slim, you've gone from pretty much no issues to a slim chance you're really screwed.
I had a potential misrep as I did exactly the same thing as you but with a drug conviction (so potentially worse actually), and my attorney addressed the misrep over the ambiguity of the questions. ESTA was different when I applied though.
I do not know about going straight for a spousal status with respect to your criminal status - not my area of knowledge. I am sure I have read that it makes things easier. Your timeline getting into work etc will definitely be much shorter. The general advice on this forum seems to be skip the K-1 if you can, it's an unnecessary hurdle a lot of the time.
A good attorney will address this in your K-1 application. You've not gone to none from slim, you've gone from pretty much no issues to a slim chance you're really screwed.
I had a potential misrep as I did exactly the same thing as you but with a drug conviction (so potentially worse actually), and my attorney addressed the misrep over the ambiguity of the questions. ESTA was different when I applied though.
I do not know about going straight for a spousal status with respect to your criminal status - not my area of knowledge. I am sure I have read that it makes things easier. Your timeline getting into work etc will definitely be much shorter. The general advice on this forum seems to be skip the K-1 if you can, it's an unnecessary hurdle a lot of the time.
Hello again, thanks for getting back to me.
My girlfriend also mentioned getting married too rather than the k1. But she believes the k1 is the quicker visa to get? Is that right?
Also, once all this mess is cleared up with the ESTA, am I allowed to visit her there whisky the k1 or the cr1 is going through?
Oct 26th 2019, 10:39 am
#100
Often not so civil...
Joined: Apr 2010
Location: The Boonies, GA
Posts: 9,561
Re: Visiting my girlfriend in the US with a UK criminal record.
My girlfriend also mentioned getting married too rather than the k1. But she believes the k1 is the quicker visa to get? Is that right?
Also, once all this mess is cleared up with the ESTA, am I allowed to visit her there whisky the k1 or the cr1 is going through?
Any further use will only exacerbate your potential misrep issues.
You could apply for a B2, but will likely not get it since you cannot have immigrant intent.
Oct 26th 2019, 10:42 am
#101
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Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 39
Re: Visiting my girlfriend in the US with a UK criminal record.
The CR1 is significantly cheaper than the K1 when you consider that thereis only one application to get the immigrant visa/green card, rather than 2 with the K1.
Personally I think, bearing in mind your situation, that you should get married and go from there. That is easier said then done though, since you really know now that you should not use the ESTA again to enter the US, and the UK has some pretty burdensome regulations when it comes to giving notice of marriage.
Personally I think, bearing in mind your situation, that you should get married and go from there. That is easier said then done though, since you really know now that you should not use the ESTA again to enter the US, and the UK has some pretty burdensome regulations when it comes to giving notice of marriage.
Thanks for your input again. All help and advice is appreciated.
Just a few questions please, if that's OK?
Is the Cr1 quicker than the k1?
Which would be easiest / quicker, due to my situation?
Unsure of the marriage regulations of the UK, I've never been down that road before and this is the first girl I've been engaged too. But we would love to get married, neither of us are getting any younger and would one day like to start a family. It just worries us both that if we were to get married, and one day she were to become pregnant, she could end up bringing up the child alone if my visa is denied. This is really worrying her (and me) as she would love to have children but not bring them up by herself.
We're at a loss now as what to do to correct things and well, be with each other. She has a good job, has said she will sponsor me, and her family gave said the same thing.
She did write everything down during our chat with the attorney and we gave double checked, what the lady said regarding the ESTA. Surely that information we were given would go on our defense?
Oct 26th 2019, 10:48 am
#102
Often not so civil...
Joined: Apr 2010
Location: The Boonies, GA
Posts: 9,561
Re: Visiting my girlfriend in the US with a UK criminal record.
Is the Cr1 quicker than the k1?
Which would be easiest / quicker, due to my situation?
The partner would have to get a specific marriage visa to get married in the UK, and then you would have to give several weeks notice before you can actually marry.
The situation that you mention above is always a possibility, so I guess the obvious question is- if you can't get a visa to live in the US (which I think you can, but let's assume otherwise) would she be prepared to live in the UK? If the answer is no, then you shouldn't get married before having a visa in hand.
She did write everything down during our chat with the attorney and we gave double checked, what the lady said regarding the ESTA. Surely that information we were given would go on our defense?
Oct 26th 2019, 10:48 am
#103
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Re: Visiting my girlfriend in the US with a UK criminal record.
It used to be, but not so much anymore.
Seriously? As you have been told again and again. You are not eligible to use the VWP. Period.
Any further use will only exacerbate your potential misrep issues.
You could apply for a B2, but will likely not get it since you cannot have immigrant intent.
Seriously? As you have been told again and again. You are not eligible to use the VWP. Period.
Any further use will only exacerbate your potential misrep issues.
You could apply for a B2, but will likely not get it since you cannot have immigrant intent.
Oct 26th 2019, 10:50 am
#104
Often not so civil...
Joined: Apr 2010
Location: The Boonies, GA
Posts: 9,561
Re: Visiting my girlfriend in the US with a UK criminal record.
One thing that I should mention that has not been thus far. We know, from experience, that US immigration officials read these boards.
Oct 26th 2019, 1:53 pm
#105
Deep in the woods of CT
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 7,002
Re: Visiting my girlfriend in the US with a UK criminal record.
The OP should also take into his "quicker/easier" calculations the fact that although both options will have a longish wait in the UK, if he enters the US on the fiance visa there will then be another long wait before he can work. Entering on a spouse visa, he is work authorized immediately -- an important factor as it would seem he will need to start earning asap.
