Mike Dobony

My d-i-l's visa was denied because my son is in Nigeria with his wife and is
therefore not working. My wife and I are sponsoring her and have almost
double the required income. Per his immigration attorney they cannot deny
her the visa on financial grounds if we have enough income to sponsor her.
His attorney claimed this is a criminal act on the part of the interviewers.
The interviewer claimed they can deny her under section 221G. They "claim"
that if he comes back and gets and holds a job for 3 months they will
approve the visa. Can anybody verify this information? Thanks.

bionomique

You don't mention which visa process they are following.

meauxna

If those are the terms they've offered him, those are the terms. Why do you keep insisting on them doing it your way? Nigeria is a very unique place, immigration-wise. Your job is to do what it takes to get the CO to say 'yes'.

Have you read 221(g)? It can include just about anything.

I'm really sorry you're so upset & I'm not trying to antagonize you.. I think you could benefit form reading the Nigeria thread(s) at visajourney and Mr Folinsky's past comments on Consular processing at this group.

Noorah101

Hi Mike,

I'm sorry to hear your son and d-i-l are having such a hard time. I know it's so frustrating, especially when you believe you are doing everything right and by the book.

I know of someone going through the Cairo consulate right now (another very difficult consulate to work with, who makes up their own rules as they go, so it seems). The USC has done every single thing according to USCIS rules. She earns enough to be her husband's sponsor, but Cairo found something to nitpick on, and told her to get a joint sponsor. She did that, turned it in again, and they found something else about the joint sponsor to deny. Now they're saying provide another joint sponsor...it's nerve-wracking to say the least.

Just wanted to let you know you're not alone, and wishing you and your son good luck with everything. At least the consulate told him what he needs to do instead of making him try different things and hopefully get one right that they'll approve.

Best Wishes,
Rene

Folinskyinla

Hi:

What "criminal act" is he referring to? I don't see one.

BTW, take a look at section 212(a)(4) of the Immigration & Nationality Act -- for family based immigrants there are TWO requirements -- the general public charge provision [which has been there since time immemorial] AND the specific "213A" provision for the unbeloved I-864. It is quite possible to have a legally sufficient I-864 and NOT meet the general requirement.

The consul made a 221(g) "soft" denial and told him how to fix it. You are given good news and that is not sufficient for you? They told you what the problem is and how to fix it. What is stopping him from doing that.

Again, what is the "criminal act" your attorney was talking about? It sure wasn't the visa denial.

Mike Dobony

"Folinskyinla" <member4043@british_expats.com> wrote in message
news:[email protected] m...
    > > My d-i-l's visa was denied because my son is in Nigeria with his wife
    > > and is
    > > therefore not working. My wife and I are sponsoring her and have
    > > almost
    > > double the required income. Per his immigration attorney they cannot
    > > deny
    > > her the visa on financial grounds if we have enough income to sponsor
    > > her.
    > > His attorney claimed this is a criminal act on the part of the
    > > interviewers.
    > > The interviewer claimed they can deny her under section 221G. They
    > > "claim"
    > > that if he comes back and gets and holds a job for 3 months they will
    > > approve the visa. Can anybody verify this information? Thanks.
    > Hi:
    > What "criminal act" is he referring to? I don't see one.
    > BTW, take a look at section 212(a)(4) of the Immigration & Nationality
    > Act -- for family based immigrants there are TWO requirements -- the
    > general public charge provision [which has been there since time
    > immemorial] AND the specific "213A" provision for the unbeloved I-864.
    > It is quite possible to have a legally sufficient I-864 and NOT meet the
    > general requirement.
    > The consul made a 221(g) "soft" denial and told him how to fix it.
    > You are given good news and that is not sufficient for you? They told
    > you what the problem is and how to fix it. What is stopping him from
    > doing that.

How about severe emotional distress!!!!!! He was separated for 2.5 months
and it was destroying him. EVERY time he heard a love song on the radio or
saw my wife and I hug or kiss he broke down because he was separated from
his wife. In an email from the consulate they specifically told him that
this is NOT an issue, but now it is. There is NO reason to deny the visa.
They REFUSED to look at the evidence. He could have had $1,000,000 in the
bank and they didn't care to look at anything. This rejection is
abloslutely unnecessary.


    > Again, what is the "criminal act" your attorney was talking about? It
    > sure wasn't the visa denial.

When we get to talk to his attorney we will find out. As someone else said,
they jsut make up their own rules as they go. They CLAIM to sechedule
interview on a first come first serve basis, but she had to wait 4 months
while everybody else waited 2 WEEKS. They took EVERYBODY for an interview
on Tuesday in the order they were in line. She was in the middle of the
line and they called her LAST! What reason will they give next time? This
is totally unnecessary! In order to quickly fulfill the fickle, abusive
requirement he is forced to take any job that comes along jsut to get his
wivfe to be with him where she belongs! There is absolutely NO reason they
BOTH can not be here next week.

This was for a I-129F-K3 visa. He will probably go ahead and process the
I130 to bypass this harassment/discrimination.

    > --
    > Certified Specialist
    > Immigration & Nat. Law
    > Cal. Bar Board of Legal Specialization
    > Posted via http://britishexpats.com

snowbunny

OP:

"In order to quickly fulfill the fickle, abusive requirement he is forced to take any job that comes along jsut to get his wivfe to be with him where she belongs! There is absolutely NO reason they BOTH can not be here next week."

If you take that attitude with USCIS anywhere, or indeed, with anyone, I don't think they're going to feel for you. There are plenty of people "forced to take any job that comes alone" and not just for three months, either. Nor do they get want they want out of it, necessarily. While you may feel that your American son "has rights" .... a non-American does not, and in order to get that person into the country, the American sponsor(s) have to follow the USCIS' recommendations. You can choose to fight this, which is probably going to take longer than three months, or your son can work for three months. How hard is that?

Every day of that three months he works is one more day closer to being reunited with his wife. There are spouses and parents separated from spouses and children for YEARS waiting for the process to work.

If you want to pursue I-130, go for it, but it'd sure look a lot better if your son would begin a job. Tomorrow.

jeffreyhy

Mike,

Your son is living in Nigeria? One possibility is that they're telling your son he has to re-establish domicile in the USA. He is, by law, his wife's sponsor - you are a joint sponsor - and in order to be her sponsor he has to be domiciled in the USA. You're right - he could have $1 million in the bank, and without US domicile it doesn't mean squat.

"How about severe emotional distress!!!!!! He was separated for 2.5 months
and it was destroying him. EVERY time he heard a love song on the radio or
saw my wife and I hug or kiss he broke down because he was separated from
his wife." If this is true I think he needs psychiatric help, but I suspect that you're exagerating. So let's address Mr.F's question honestly - why doesn't he do what the consulate told him to do so that his wife can be issued her visa?

Regards, JEff

Simon&Vik

Most of us here have endured this. Why? Because that's part of the process in many cases. Over 5 months passed btwn when my husband had to go back to the UK while the Visa processed & when he was finally able to come home. Yes, it is very emotional & painful, but most of us have had to do it...

Noorah101

Hi Mike,

I know you're just verbalizing your son's pain, but let me tell you...in my case, we endured a 14-month separation during the visa processing. Our only contact was by regular telephone. Of course it was difficult, of course it wasn't perfect, of course we had some down, depressing days. That's normal. But look, we're still around to talk about it. We didn't let it destroy us. We just went about our own work and daily routine until such time that we could be united in the USA....that's the healthy thing to do. In the grand scheme of USCIS time frames, 2.5 months is a very very short time!

Also, you mentioned something about "his wife should be here with him where she belongs". Unfortunately, USCIS doesn't see it that way. As a non-USC, she has no rights to belong in the USA, married or not. That's just the way it is.

I hope your son can straighten things out and get going on what it takes to fulfill the Consulate's recommendations.

Best Wishes,
Rene

Matthew Udall

In the "waiver" context when the USCIS or Consulate is determining if extreme hardship exists, they don't usually consider the emotional hardship the U.S. Citizen spouse will suffer if the international spouse is kept out of the U.S. They assume that "every" couple will experience this, so that is an everyday, run of the mill type of hardship; not extreme hardship. I know that is a little off point from your particular situation, however your comment about severe emotional distress caused me to think of this.

Not meeting the public charge requirement is one reason to deny the visa (which they haven't done in your son's case), and I've had a client who had this happen before. He wanted to rely just on his Dad's co-sponsorship (Dad made "well" above the minimum required), and go hang out with his girlfriend in the Philippines over the summer (while the petition was being processed at the Service Center). In other words, he didn't have a job and thus had "zero" income. I told him the Consul might not buy it, and that I thought he should stay in the U.S., get a job and start saving money for his new marriage. He decided to go against that advice. His fiancée went to the interview and they told her the same thing your son was told…. For the young man to go home, get a job, send them a couple of pay stubs and employment letter and they would then issue the visa. He did just that, and they issued the visa.

Did your son have 1 Million in the bank? If so, he could have relied on that "asset" and would not have needed you as a cosponsor.

bionomique

I can understand your agitation, as a parent, witnessing a son who is having a difficult time. This is usually due to a feeling of helplessness, but in this case your best approach would be to comfort your son by encouraging him to do what was recommended and be of support to him while he does. In the long run, although it might mean he has to leave his wife for a period of 3 or more months, it will prove helpful that he has time to put down roots, and be somewhat adjusted when she arrives. After all, she will not have employment right away, and your son will be saving a lot of stress which might impact both of them from being unsettled, once they are together.

Folinskyinla

Hi:

"Severe emotional distress"??? Sad to say, your son's distress is NORMAL distress at being separated from his beloved. There is a lot of case law on "hardship" in the context of being separated -- and where the law requires "extreme" or higher degrees -- the normal problems in being separated do not begin to approach that level. Not even close.

"Harassment" and "discrimination"? Use of the I-130 to avoid that? You are dealing with LAGOS, not London -- don't ever forget that. Even with the I-130 approved, she will STILL have to deal with Lagos. Also, with the K-3, the standard is quite subjective -- and the old style I-134 affidavits from relatives are traditionally given little weight.

One of the most aggressive immigration lawyers I know is AILA's consular processing "maven" [spelled "mentor" in AILA-speak for some reason] and Jan often states that the key to success with consulates is "the art of groveling."

Remember that the Immigration Laws are stacked against you -- and your son is already with his wife -- which is just fine and dandy. But they are asking for an additional benefit -- that she be in the United States. And "no" is the default mode in the law and ConOffs have a lot of independence. Lets put it this way -- a Consul can receive a cable saying "Grant visa. Signed W" and she would be within her rights to say "no."

The consulate has told her what needs to be done. Do it.

p.s. On the time of separation -- tell that to spouses of soldiers on deployment to Iraq or Afghanistan. Your complaints will sound hollow. As a further BTW, I'm somewhat of a fan of U.S. Grant [his place on the Fifty is richly deserved IMHO]. It seems that in his life, he was a much more effective person when Julia was around. His sojourn in California without Julia was not good for him and occasioned his leaving the Army. And it seems that he and Julia would visit often during the Civil War -- even when he was in the field.

ian-mstm

I don't believe this demonstrates a criminal act.


So you say!


Umm... but his wife *is* with him. She doesn't have a right to live in the US.

Ian

Mike Dobony

"Noorah101" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected] m...
    > > If those are the terms they've offered him, those are the terms. Why
    > > do you keep insisting on them doing it your way? Nigeria is a very
    > > unique place, immigration-wise. Your job is to do what it takes to get
    > > the CO to say 'yes'.
    > >
    > > Have you read 221(g)? It can include just about anything.
    > >
    > > I'm really sorry you're so upset & I'm not trying to antagonize you..
    > > I think you could benefit form reading the Nigeria thread(s) at
    > > visajourney and Mr Folinsky's past comments on Consular processing at
    > > this group.
    > Hi Mike,
    > I'm sorry to hear your son and d-i-l are having such a hard time. I
    > know it's so frustrating, especially when you believe you are doing
    > everything right and by the book.
    > I know of someone going through the Cairo consulate right now (another
    > very difficult consulate to work with, who makes up their own rules as
    > they go, so it seems). The USC has done every single thing according to
    > USCIS rules. She earns enough to be her husband's sponsor, but Cairo
    > found something to nitpick on, and told her to get a joint sponsor. She
    > did that, turned it in again, and they found something else about the
    > joint sponsor to deny. Now they're saying provide another joint
    > sponsor...it's nerve-wracking to say the least.
    > Just wanted to let you know you're not alone, and wishing you and your
    > son good luck with everything. At least the consulate told him what he
    > needs to do instead of making him try different things and hopefully get
    > one right that they'll approve.

Would they be interested in joining my son in a class-action law suit? What
is to sto them from inventing another imagined guideline after he is back
and working for the 3 months and then thye don't like something else and add
another new rule to follow? They need ot follow the law and not invent new
laws on the fly. They are NOT congress and do NOT have the power to create
new guidelines for every applicant!

    > Best Wishes,
    > Rene
    > --
    > Posted via http://britishexpats.com