Simon

I have a problem. I have booked a holiday in the US next month and do
not seem eligible for the US visa waiver program since I was arrested
last year. No charges were ever brought and have received a letter to
that extent from the police including a veiled apology.

I phoned the Foreign and Commonwealth Office and they say that whether
I needed a Visa depended on the nature of the arrest. When phoning
the US consulate premium rate phone number they said I did need a
Visa.

What is the timescales for getting a Visa? I was told 12 weeks.

Do I have a criminal record as kept by the criminal records office?

Are arrest records held nationally and / or made available to the US
immigration dept.

I am frustrated that a simple vindictive accusation can result in an
arrest and cause these problems.

I would be grateful for any information.

Adrian Boliston

"Simon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

    > Are arrest records held nationally and / or made available to the US
    > immigration dept.

I seem to remember this same question cropping up on uk.legal a couple of months
back.

Unless all historical UK arrest data is made avaliable to the US immigration
computer systems, so they get flagged when a passport barcode is swiped, it would
seem pretty silly to include arrests in the tickboxes on those green cards, as it
would be impossible to enforce the rule.

Harry The Horse

Adrian Boliston wrote:
    > "Simon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    >> Are arrest records held nationally and / or made available to the US
    >> immigration dept.
    > I seem to remember this same question cropping up on uk.legal a
    > couple of months back.
    > Unless all historical UK arrest data is made avaliable to the US
    > immigration computer systems, so they get flagged when a passport
    > barcode is swiped, it would seem pretty silly to include arrests in
    > the tickboxes on those green cards, as it would be impossible to
    > enforce the rule.
The risk of not disclosing an arrest now is that if ever comes to light in
the future the OP risks being permanently banned from entering the US. Even
if the arrest is one of mistaken identity that the US Embassy might have
told him could have omitted from future immigration disclosures. The
offence of non disclosure being treated far more seriously than the arrest
itself.

Hades

Simon wrote:
    > I have a problem. I have booked a holiday in the US next month and do
    > not seem eligible for the US visa waiver program since I was arrested
    > last year. No charges were ever brought and have received a letter to
    > that extent from the police including a veiled apology.
    > I phoned the Foreign and Commonwealth Office and they say that whether
    > I needed a Visa depended on the nature of the arrest. When phoning
    > the US consulate premium rate phone number they said I did need a
    > Visa.
    > What is the timescales for getting a Visa? I was told 12 weeks.
    > Do I have a criminal record as kept by the criminal records office?
    > Are arrest records held nationally and / or made available to the US
    > immigration dept.
    > I am frustrated that a simple vindictive accusation can result in an
    > arrest and cause these problems.
    > I would be grateful for any information.

http://www.usembassy.org.uk/cons_web/visa/niv/vwp.htm

Simon

"Adrian Boliston" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > "Simon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    >
    > > Are arrest records held nationally and / or made available to the US
    > > immigration dept.
    >
    > I seem to remember this same question cropping up on uk.legal a couple of months
    > back.
    >
    > Unless all historical UK arrest data is made avaliable to the US immigration
    > computer systems, so they get flagged when a passport barcode is swiped, it would
    > seem pretty silly to include arrests in the tickboxes on those green cards, as it
    > would be impossible to enforce the rule.

But don't they also ask if you intend to engage in subversive and
terroist activities. How can they check that and enforce it?

Simon

"Harry The Horse" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > Adrian Boliston wrote:
    > > "Simon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > news:[email protected]...
    > >
    > >> Are arrest records held nationally and / or made available to the US
    > >> immigration dept.
    > >
    > > I seem to remember this same question cropping up on uk.legal a
    > > couple of months back.
    > >
    > > Unless all historical UK arrest data is made avaliable to the US
    > > immigration computer systems, so they get flagged when a passport
    > > barcode is swiped, it would seem pretty silly to include arrests in
    > > the tickboxes on those green cards, as it would be impossible to
    > > enforce the rule.
    > >
    > The risk of not disclosing an arrest now is that if ever comes to light in
    > the future the OP risks being permanently banned from entering the US. Even
    > if the arrest is one of mistaken identity that the US Embassy might have
    > told him could have omitted from future immigration disclosures. The
    > offence of non disclosure being treated far more seriously than the arrest
    > itself.

Yes you're right.

Just that the holiday had been booked and only when we had received
the booking forms did it mention anything enquiring about the
requirement of a Visa where an arrest had been made. The holiday is
now cancelled and we will endeavour to get our money back. Will keep
the groups posted. When we booked we even asked about Visas and were
told they weren't required. I am especially narked that the arrest
was due to a malicious complaint and received a grovelling letter from
the police going on how they acted in accordance with procedures.

Harry The Horse

Simon wrote:
    > "Harry The Horse" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:<[email protected]>...
    >> Adrian Boliston wrote:
    >>> "Simon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >>> news:[email protected]...
    >>>> Are arrest records held nationally and / or made available to the
    >>>> US immigration dept.
    >>> I seem to remember this same question cropping up on uk.legal a
    >>> couple of months back.
    >>> Unless all historical UK arrest data is made avaliable to the US
    >>> immigration computer systems, so they get flagged when a passport
    >>> barcode is swiped, it would seem pretty silly to include arrests in
    >>> the tickboxes on those green cards, as it would be impossible to
    >>> enforce the rule.
    >> The risk of not disclosing an arrest now is that if ever comes to
    >> light in the future the OP risks being permanently banned from
    >> entering the US. Even if the arrest is one of mistaken identity
    >> that the US Embassy might have told him could have omitted from
    >> future immigration disclosures. The offence of non disclosure being
    >> treated far more seriously than the arrest itself.
    > Yes you're right.
    > Just that the holiday had been booked and only when we had received
    > the booking forms did it mention anything enquiring about the
    > requirement of a Visa where an arrest had been made. The holiday is
    > now cancelled and we will endeavour to get our money back. Will keep
    > the groups posted. When we booked we even asked about Visas and were
    > told they weren't required. I am especially narked that the arrest
    > was due to a malicious complaint and received a grovelling letter from
    > the police going on how they acted in accordance with procedures.
Approach the US Embassy formally rather than just through their advice
channel. They might well say that in the circumstances you don't need a
visa and that you don't need to disclose the arrest on future entries into
the United States. About a year ago some chap went into a police station to
report a crime, the twat on the counter thought that he was a wanted villain
and promptly arrested him. He was released when he came to court. Don't
know how much compensation he got but I'd hope the US Embassy would waive
the need for a visa in his case!

Pluto

Simon wrote:
<snip>
Sorry to piggy-back Simon, but can I just staple a question on to yours?
I do have a criminal record, burglary and theft (non dwelling) which was
dealt with at magistrates - £150 fine and £383 compensation. This happened
15 years ago. I am now a family man, running a very successful business and
am in fact a walking advert on what the justice system in this country sets
out to acheive.
I know the US does not recognise the RoOA so what are my chances in the
future of getting a visa?
Thanks
Rick

Bigbrian

On Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:25:04 -0000, "Pluto" <[email protected]> wrote:

    >Simon wrote:
    ><snip>
    >Sorry to piggy-back Simon, but can I just staple a question on to yours?
    >I do have a criminal record, burglary and theft (non dwelling) which was
    >dealt with at magistrates - £150 fine and £383 compensation. This happened
    >15 years ago. I am now a family man, running a very successful business and
    >am in fact a walking advert on what the justice system in this country sets
    >out to acheive.
    >I know the US does not recognise the RoOA so what are my chances in the
    >future of getting a visa?


That may depend on how you go about it. If its important to you to be
able to visit the US, then it may be worth retaining the services of a
specialist to help you. If you DIY it and get your visa application
rejected, then you can almost certainly kiss goodbye to any future
successful application.

There are law firms in London, with specialist US qualified
immigration lawyers, who specialise in obtaining waivers of
ineligibility for people who are otherwise ineligible to travel to the
US (this includes you), As you might expect, they're probably not
cheap, but, as I said, if its important enough to you....

Brian

Peter Crosland

Take a look at the US visa site. You MAY get one.

--
[email protected]

Alasdair Baxter

On 1 Mar 2004 03:45:23 -0800, [email protected] (Simon)
wrote:

    >Are arrest records held nationally and / or made available to the US
    >immigration dept.

As far as I know (but I'm not an expert) arrest records are not held
nationally in the UK nor are they made available to the US immigration
department.

The position may change, however, in the light of the failure of
Humberside Constabulary's failure to keep records of Ian Huntley's
*alleged* previous arrests/offences.

It would be helpful if someone could provide a definitive answer to
the above, however.

Simon

"Hades" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected] >...
    > Simon wrote:
    > > I have a problem. I have booked a holiday in the US next month and do
    > > not seem eligible for the US visa waiver program since I was arrested
    > > last year. No charges were ever brought and have received a letter to
    > > that extent from the police including a veiled apology.
    > >
    > > I phoned the Foreign and Commonwealth Office and they say that whether
    > > I needed a Visa depended on the nature of the arrest. When phoning
    > > the US consulate premium rate phone number they said I did need a
    > > Visa.
    > >
    > > What is the timescales for getting a Visa? I was told 12 weeks.
    > >
    > > Do I have a criminal record as kept by the criminal records office?
    > >
    > > Are arrest records held nationally and / or made available to the US
    > > immigration dept.
    > >
    > > I am frustrated that a simple vindictive accusation can result in an
    > > arrest and cause these problems.
    > >
    > > I would be grateful for any information.
    >
    > http://www.usembassy.org.uk/cons_web/visa/niv/vwp.htm

Thanks for the link.

It gives the conditions:
"Some travelers may not be eligible to enter the United States visa
free under the VWP. These include people who have been arrested, even
if the arrest did not result in a criminal conviction, those with
criminal records, (the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act does not apply
to U.S. visa law)"

It uses the words "may not" as opposed to just "not"?


The next paragraph says:
"Travelers with minor traffic offenses which did not result in an
arrest and/or conviction for the offense may travel visa free,
provided they are otherwise qualified."
This implies that if you have a motoring conviction you may also need
a visa. The wording is not entirely clear or is my English not up to
American standards?

R. Mark Clayton

"Simon" <[email protected]> wrote in message

Snip

    > The next paragraph says:
    > "Travelers with minor traffic offenses which did not result in an
    > arrest and/or conviction for the offense may travel visa free,
    > provided they are otherwise qualified."
    > This implies that if you have a motoring conviction you may also need
    > a visa. The wording is not entirely clear or is my English not up to
    > American standards?

Funny how the US applies different standards of justice to people other than
its own citizens!

I have been arrested twice, both times released without any charge - most
recently (1987) for alleged drink driving when I was actually sober. I
complained but dropped it when it went bureaucratic, since a trip in the van
to the nick was a bit of an adventure. As far as the UK justice system is
concerned I am "of good character, with no criminal convictions etc.", so
why do I have to go through extra hoops and presumably try and prove my
innocence for an event that took place 17 years ago?

OTOH if you do not disclose (or lie) on their forms then they will never let
you in. I have seen card carrying communists and Iranians (in the 80's) get
visas, BUT they filled in the forms accurately - providing you do and you
don't answer yes to the "planning violent overthrow of the government" or
"intending to trade in illegal narcotics" then they will let you in!

I have a multiple indefinite bearer visa for the USA, but I happen to know
that they dishonoured them all.

Guess I will cross the USA of my holiday list for a bit though.

Gareth A .

On 1 Mar 2004 16:09:56 -0800, [email protected] (Simon)
wrote:

    >> http://www.usembassy.org.uk/cons_web/visa/niv/vwp.htm
    >Thanks for the link.
    >It gives the conditions:
    >"Some travelers may not be eligible to enter the United States visa
    >free under the VWP. These include people who have been arrested, even
    >if the arrest did not result in a criminal conviction, those with
    >criminal records, (the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act does not apply
    >to U.S. visa law)"
    >It uses the words "may not" as opposed to just "not"?
    >The next paragraph says:
    >"Travelers with minor traffic offenses which did not result in an
    >arrest and/or conviction for the offense may travel visa free,
    >provided they are otherwise qualified."
    >This implies that if you have a motoring conviction you may also need
    >a visa. The wording is not entirely clear or is my English not up to
    >American standards?

It is a bit of a nightmare. When they use the word "may" simply
replace it with "can" and you will read it correctly.

If you have an arrest which did not result in a conviction (including
cautions) you need to apply for a visa as normal AND fill in the same
form as people who do have convictions but tick the boxes as relevant
and use the notes section to record the details. You might find a
covering letter explaining exactly why you need to apply will make it
easier for *them* to figure everything out!

As mentioned, you are likely to get a "permanent waiver of
ineligibility" which means you can travel as normal.

Gareth

Simon

Alasdair Baxter <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>. ..
    > On 1 Mar 2004 03:45:23 -0800, [email protected] (Simon)
    > wrote:
    >
    > >Are arrest records held nationally and / or made available to the US
    > >immigration dept.
    >
    > As far as I know (but I'm not an expert) arrest records are not held
    > nationally in the UK nor are they made available to the US immigration
    > department.
    >
    > The position may change, however, in the light of the failure of
    > Humberside Constabulary's failure to keep records of Ian Huntley's
    > *alleged* previous arrests/offences.
    >

I find the idea of guilt by suspicion or accusation the most worrying of all.

What it has left is a bitter taste in my mouth and a cancelled holiday!

BTW we got a full refund of monies paid for the holiday as well.

Many thanks for the help and discussions on this thread.