mozzie

If you want facts rather than anecdotes, there's an OECD website with lots of stats regarding education: OECD Checking the comparisons for 15-year-olds in the UK, NZ and Oz in 2000, it appears that the standards of education are quite similar, with all being well above the OECD average.

In reading literacy, NZ 529, Oz 528, UK 523.
In maths literacy, NZ 537, Oz 533, UK 529.
In science literacy, UK 532, NZ 528, Oz 528.
Overall average, NZ 531, Oz 530, UK 528.

All scores are standardised to an OECD average of 500.

Linda Max

Yes it does seem very strange, but the law in NZ stops kids returning to college until after the age of 20 if they have left school. I was totally flabergasted when I was told this, and I did not sit back and take one persons word as law, I spent weeks trying to get her into some sort of structured education

Linda Max

I can assure you that coming from a hard working family, my daughter is not sitting around on her butt, she is doing a goverment course on how to write a C.V and is posting out at least 20 job applications a week, she is also being taught road safety, had a couple of days working in the staff canteen, was put on a security guards course for a day, and was taught weaving for another couple of days etc. etc. etc. this is not the education that she wants and needs, but it is the only one that she can get. She recieves no allowances from this.
I have not sat on my butt either but have spent weeks trying to get her on to some sort of course that would be worth while, NOTHING is available. Meantime I will continue to pay for petrol for her to get to her COURSE every day, because she will not sit on her butt, if the only thing she can learn just now is to get up out of bed and do something, then that is what we will teach her, how to keep up her morale and enthusiasm is something else. Maybe it's not a question of education, but opportunities

MikeStanton

Ignore Megalania's comments. I believe he managed to get an Oz visa under the 'insensitive, low brow' category.

Megalania

Courses, course, courses; maybe she's just a horse. Ever heard of a thing called a library?

Linda Max

It is good to know that I can ask a serious question and the majority of people can see a concerned parent, and respond in a caring, educated manner. Thank you for taking the time and trouble

Kath

I would like to offer my support and sympathy. I was recently speaking with a lady from New Zealand and was shocked to hear that you cannot re-take final year examinations. How can the NZ education system justify not giving young people another chance? Does this also happen in Australia?

I was educated in England and was in the top set with all the school's high flyers for every subject at school. I was confident I would pass all my O'levels, in fact I was probably too confident and failed 6 out of 8 O'levels - I was in shock.

The school offered me a place in the 6th form to re-take my exams, failing was probably the best thing that happened to me BUT I had the chance to repair the damage. I re-took my exams the following year and passed, I then went onto college and passed a Business & Finance Diploma and ended up in a great job.

It sounds like you are trying to keep her motivated which is good, I'm sure this set-back will make her a stronger person long term - good luck.

MikeStanton

It's good that you have posted the statistics. Unfortunately, the limited number of posts here don't support the 'numbers'. Perhaps that is because they are in the "returning to the UK" forum?

Anybody have positive NZ education experiences?

Gladrags

Stats are prone to distortion but they do provide some 'evidence'. My experiences suggest to me that NZ education is weak. However I am aware that Kiwis do leave these shores and use their educational experience to good effect.

NCEA shows poor skills in NZ

Business New Zealand has recently reported that when the first annual results of the National Certificate of Educational Achievement (NCEA) were released in late January, poor skills showed up.

“For the first time national school qualifications results include information on the performance of students in identifiable skills, rather than simply an overall grade for a subject. These statistics reveal some concerning levels of performance in key areas such as literacy and numeracy, which are Business NZ priorities,� education and training adviser Jeremy Baker wrote in Business NZ’s February edition of Skills Update.

“For example, 40% of Year 11 (5th form) students were unable to produce formal writing to the minimum standard required, and 49% were unable to ‘estimate and determine probabilities’.

“Other worrying results were the 50% of information management students who could not ‘manage information using spreadsheets, text, and draw/paint applications’, or the 58% who could not ‘communicate information from given materials and by direct composition’.�

Watt Dabney

Anybody have positive NZ education experiences? [/QUOTE]



ME (puts hand up)!

Very happy with my kids (8 & 6) education. Have posted my experiences before, am reluctant to do so again as I am sick of people having a go! If you or anyne else wants to know more PM me.

Paula

jandjuk

good grief, I didn't realise this. This is utterly bizarre.

It's so bizarre I can't really believe it, but believe it I will as you've obviously investigated it fully.

I'm sure it didn't used to be like this..... what a weird law...

what about open polytechnic or something? I suppose they have the same entry criteria as anybody else....

dugongs

whilst the previous expat kiwi picks himself off the floor and no doubt considers apologising for attacking the poor person that posted their genuine experiences. thought this post was rather good from an expat oz teacher based in scotland. i think he may be the one that has previously argued with people on here.

I think I tend to agree with him. The other point made on here recently was both systems are fine if your child stays in either of them to the end. Get a degree from a UK or Oz/Nz uni and no worries. But chopping and changing seems to be where the most problems are found.

The post I cut from another thread is below :


The perennial education debate and which system is superior!

Some (eg Mrs D) have posted figures from OECD or Times Ed supplement (or somewhere else) which purport to show that the Australian system outperforms the UK system NOW (not when 'we' went to school) in that it was higher up a 'league table'.

I remember having a number of exchanged posts with someone who compared Australian secondaries now with English secondaries 15-20 years ago and used this as evidence that the latter system is (was?) superior! I still hear 'you can't beat a good Scots education, best in the world' (was, possibly?)

Some have posted anecdotal evidence by comparing their children's recent experience in UK schools compared to Australian schools and they come down on either side as being superior.

I don't have very recent first-hand experience of Australian education. I can only go by the experiences of my brother's 3 children (1 at primary, 2 at secondary); my brother himself who is a university lecturer and head examiner of a secondary subject in Victoria and some of my friends who I see each year who teach in secondaries and primaries.

I'm going to disappoint everyone by saying it is impossible for me to come down in favour of either system (because I haven't taught in Oz schools in recent years). Of course it also depends what you are looking for - 3 'R's', social skills, broad based education, specialising in subjects, small class sizes, use of I.T, etc, etc, etc,

This one will run on and on if feel.

One thing I will say is that I feel standards are slipping in both systems - how else can you accommodate a much higher % of youngsters attending tertiary institutions if it isn't by lowering pass marks, more lenient marking etc? My 'gut feeling' too is that the standard of behaviour is declining in both systems. On a positive note we seem to be much better at identifying and helping those with learning and behavioural difficulties (no one was dyslexic when I went to school - I think not!) and class sizes are falling slightly and classrooms are better equipped.

dotty

[QUOTE]Originally posted by dugongs
.

I think I tend to agree with him. The other point made on here recently was both systems are fine if your child stays in either of them to the end. Get a degree from a UK or Oz/Nz uni and no worries. But chopping and changing seems to be where the most problems are found.

{QUOTE}


That is exactly the point.

The systems are very different and kids returning to the UK will not have covered the scope of work required. Sad fact but true.

Goodpubmisser

What seems to be a general problem is that in England we do (or used to anyway) "O" Levels at 16 and "A" levels at 18. You then go on to University and usually to do a three year degree.

However most of the rest of the world (Scotland included), seem to do the equivalent of "O" levels at 17 and then go on to University to do a four year degree.

Thus we cover at school what a lot of these guys do not cover until they get to University. Of course if you study History at University you do not cover such things as calculus.

In Australia they also seem to only do around six subjects at school as opposed to my nine "O" levels. My girlfriend studied Science as one subject at school where as I studied Physics, Chemistry and Biology. The depth that I went to was thus far greater.


I am no expert at education systems and indeed I am glad to be out of them for life, but it is a worry to me that someone is not aware of something that I find to be basic. For example I was asked on a bus on the way to Perth by a 16 - 18 year old girl "Where is Sweden"? I replied "Next to Norway" and got a blank look.

bondipom

I found the 3 subject A-levels very restricting and narrow. Very good for those subjects but useless if you change your mind on your career or degree at 18. I think going for IBs should be considered if possible.