just curious...

Old Jun 2nd 2003, 4:46 am
  #1  
D&M
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Default just curious...

Once someone becomes a permanent resident they don't necessarily have to
apply to become a US citizen, correct? If one chooses to stay a permanent
resident, what if any, are the disadvantages of doing so?
I'm not sure if this is true, but someone once told me that one disadvantage
is you don't get a full retirement pension if you aren't a US citizen. True
or not?
 
Old Jun 2nd 2003, 3:09 pm
  #2  
Linti2002
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Default Re: just curious...

"D&M" wrote in message news:...
    > Once someone becomes a permanent resident they don't necessarily have to
    > apply to become a US citizen, correct? If one chooses to stay a permanent
    > resident, what if any, are the disadvantages of doing so?
    > I'm not sure if this is true, but someone once told me that one disadvantage
    > is you don't get a full retirement pension if you aren't a US citizen. True
    > or not?
Yes, they do not need to apply for US citizenship. I use to be a PR
and some disadvantage for a PR to me are, traveling, voting, and
deportation. When you travel with a PR you'll need to get a Re-entry
permit, that takes somewhere between three months to a year. You
can't stay long in a different country with a PR. You can't vote, no
voice of your own. Depending on what country you are from, if you
commit a crime you can be deported (not saying you should commit a
crime). I know someone with a PR and is collecting his full
retirement pension. You also can't get a government job. There is
alot of good becoming a US citizen, this country is still the best
country out there. America is the land of opportunity, and even with
our crimes and social problems, it is still my country of choice.
 
Old Jun 2nd 2003, 7:12 pm
  #3  
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Linti2002:
Should you have clarified that you only have to get a re-entry permit if you stay away from the US longer than 1 year? I assume that was what you were referring to when you said it was a disadvantage travelling as a permanent resident. Travelling in and out of the US is permitted, and you should only need to present your permanent resident card/ passport on return, as long as your trip duration is less than one year.
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Old Jun 2nd 2003, 7:22 pm
  #4  
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Default Re: just curious...

On a less happy note, the inheritance tax is not the same if you are a PR (much higher) or a US. If you have children to raise or to send to college, this is probably something to consider particularly carefully, as bad things can always happen.

Caroline.
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Old Jun 2nd 2003, 7:31 pm
  #5  
 
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Originally posted by desusa
Travelling in and out of the US is permitted, and you should only need to present your permanent resident card/ passport on return, as long as your trip duration is less than one year.
NB: *Provided* you have maintained a US residence.

PRs should check carefully before leaving the US for extended periods of time (regardless of the 'one year' idea) as there have been many misunderstandings in the past regarding this 'rule' (not even sure if it's a rule or law).
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Old Jun 2nd 2003, 9:43 pm
  #6  
Christa
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Default Re: just curious...

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Social security retirement benefits are based on time worked (minimum 40 =
quarters) and there is no difference between US citizens and permanent =
residents.
Disadvantages of remaining LPR rather than naturalizing:
a.. Can't live or work outside of the US for longer than a year or two =
without giving up your status in the US (with certain exceptions)
b.. Can't vote
c.. The laws can change any time and your permanent status may not be =
so permanent anymore (restrictions applied retroactively)
There are probably more.


"D&M" wrote in message =
news:[email protected]...
    > Once someone becomes a permanent resident they don't necessarily have =
to
    > apply to become a US citizen, correct? If one chooses to stay a =
permanent
    > resident, what if any, are the disadvantages of doing so?
    > I'm not sure if this is true, but someone once told me that one =
disadvantage
    > is you don't get a full retirement pension if you aren't a US citizen. =
True
    > or not?
    >=20
    >=20

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Social security retirement benefits are =
based on=20
time worked (minimum 40 quarters) and there is no difference between US =
citizens=20
and permanent residents.
Disadvantages of remaining LPR rather =
than=20
naturalizing:

Can't live or work outside of the US =
for longer=20
than a year or two without giving up your status in the US (with =
certain=20
exceptions)
Can't vote
The laws can change any time and your =
permanent=20
status may not be so permanent anymore (restrictions applied=20
retroactively)
There are probably more.
Â
Â
"D&M" <[email protected]> =
wrote in=20
message news:[email protected]...> Once someone =
becomes a=20
permanent resident they don't necessarily have to> apply to =
become a US=20
citizen, correct? If one chooses to stay a permanent> =
resident,=20
what if any, are the disadvantages of doing so?> I'm not sure if =
this is=20
true, but someone once told me that one disadvantage> is you =
don't get a=20
full retirement pension if you aren't a US citizen. True> =
or=20
not?> >

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Old Jun 2nd 2003, 10:16 pm
  #7  
Michael D. Young
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: just curious...

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Christa wrote:

    > Social security retirement benefits are based on time worked (minimum
    > 40 quarters) and there is no difference between US citizens and
    > permanent residents.Disadvantages of remaining LPR rather than
    > naturalizing:
    > * Can't live or work outside of the US for longer than a year or
    > two without giving up your status in the US (with certain
    > exceptions)
    > * Can't vote
    > * The laws can change any time and your permanent status may not be
    > so permanent anymore (restrictions applied retroactively)

Hi All!


Social Security benefits are based on your high 35 years of indexed
earnings from work covered by the Social Security system. 40 credits
is only an eligibility requirement.

SSA has totalization agreements with 20 countries. These let you
combine your U.S. and foreign Social Security credits to be eligible for
benefits:

http://www.ssa.gov/international/agr...criptions.html


Take care,

Mike



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Christa wrote:

Social
security retirement benefits are based on time worked (minimum 40 quarters)
and there is no difference between US citizens and permanent residents.Disadvantages
of remaining LPR rather than naturalizing:


Can't live or work outside of the US for
longer than a year or two without giving up your status in the US (with
certain exceptions)


Can't vote


The laws can change any time and your
permanent status may not be so permanent anymore (restrictions applied
retroactively)



Hi All!
Â
Social Security benefits are based on your high 35 years of indexed
earnings from work covered by the Social Security system.  40
credits is only an eligibility requirement.
SSA has totalization agreements with 20 countries.  These
let you combine your U.S. and foreign Social Security credits to be eligible
for benefits:
http://www.ssa.gov/international/agr...criptions.html
Â
Take care,
Mike
Â
Â

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Old Jun 3rd 2003, 12:36 am
  #8  
Christa
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: just curious...

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0040_01C32946.57048770
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charset="iso-8859-1"
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Michael,

Are you knowledgeable in social security benefits? I thought about this =
the other day ... I seem to remember that the last 10 years of earnings =
before retirement count more than the other years in determining the =
payments. Are those 10 years counted from normal or early retirement =
age? I.e., what if I had enough money to stop working full-time at the =
age of 55, would then the years between 45 and 55 be used as those =
having more weight?

Sorry if this assumption is wrong all along, I just never got much into =
this. Would appreciate a quick and simple answer for the layman.

Christa


"Michael D. Young" wrote in message =
news:[email protected]...
Christa wrote:=20
Social security retirement benefits are based on time worked =
(minimum 40 quarters) and there is no difference between US citizens and =
permanent residents.Disadvantages of remaining LPR rather than =
naturalizing:=20
a.. Can't live or work outside of the US for longer than a year or =
two without giving up your status in the US (with certain exceptions)=20
b.. Can't vote=20
c.. The laws can change any time and your permanent status may not =
be so permanent anymore (restrictions applied retroactively)=20

Hi All!=20
=20

Social Security benefits are based on your high 35 years of indexed =
earnings from work covered by the Social Security system. 40 credits =
is only an eligibility requirement.=20

SSA has totalization agreements with 20 countries. These let you =
combine your U.S. and foreign Social Security credits to be eligible for =
benefits:=20

http://www.ssa.gov/international/agr...ptions.html=20
=20

Take care,=20

Mike =20
=20
=20


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Michael,
Â
Are you knowledgeable in social =
security benefits?=20
I thought about this the other day ... I seem to remember that the last =
10 years=20
of earnings before retirement count more than the other years in =
determining the=20
payments. Are those 10 years counted from normal or early retirement =
age? I.e.,=20
what if I had enough money to stop working full-time at the age of 55, =
would=20
then the years between 45 and 55 be used as those having more=20
weight?
Â
Sorry if this assumption is wrong all =
along, I just=20
never got much into this. Would appreciate a quick and simple answer for =
the=20
layman.
Â
Christa
Â
Â

"Michael D. Young" <[email protected]> wrote in =
message news:[email protected]=
m...Christa=20
wrote:=20


Social security retirement =
benefits are based=20
on time worked (minimum 40 quarters) and there is no difference =
between US=20
citizens and permanent residents.Disadvantages of remaining LPR rather than=20
naturalizing:=20

Can't live or work outside =
of the US=20
for longer than a year or two without giving up your status in the =
US=20
(with certain exceptions)=20
Can't vote=20
The laws can change any =
time and your=20
permanent status may not be so permanent anymore (restrictions =
applied=20
retroactively)
Hi All! Â =20
Social Security benefits are based on your high 35 years of indexed =

earnings from work covered by the Social Security system.  =
40=20
credits is only an eligibility requirement.=20
SSA has totalization agreements with 20 countries.  =
These let=20
you combine your U.S. and foreign Social Security credits to be =
eligible for=20
benefits:=20
htt=
p://www.ssa.gov/international/agreement_descriptions.html=20
 =20
Take care,=20
Mike  Â

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Old Jun 3rd 2003, 6:03 am
  #9  
Michael D. Young
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: just curious...

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Christa wrote:

    > Michael, Are you knowledgeable in social security benefits? I thought
    > about this the other day ... I seem to remember that the last 10 years
    > of earnings before retirement count more than the other years in
    > determining the payments. Are those 10 years counted from normal or
    > early retirement age? I.e., what if I had enough money to stop working
    > full-time at the age of 55, would then the years between 45 and 55 be
    > used as those having more weight? Sorry if this assumption is wrong
    > all along, I just never got much into this. Would appreciate a quick
    > and simple answer for the layman.
    > HI All!
    > No. That simple enough. LOL It's your high 35 years of indexed
    > earnings. Then the total of those are divided by 420 (# of months in
    > 35 years). Then that total is multiplied by bend points. 90 percent
    > of the first $606, 32 percent over $606 and through $3,653 and 15
    > percent over $3,653. The total of those three calculations give you
    > your primary insurance amount (PIA), which is the amount you would
    > receive by waiting until full retirement age (FRA) to apply. TheFRA
    > is being raised, so that everyone born after 1960 will have a FRA of
    > 67. It's being phsed in. It's currently 65 and 2 months for people
    > that turn 65 this year.
    > http://www.ssa.gov/OACT/ProgData/nra.html
    > Your PIA is reduced by each month before FRA that you apply for
    > benefits. Benefit are reduced 5/9 of one percent for each month
    > before FRA, up to 36 months. Then the benefit is reduced 5/12 of one
    > percent for each month over 36.
    > The earliest you can recevie benefits is the first full month you are
    > age 62. For Social Security puposes you attain your age the before
    > your birthday, so people born on the 1st or second of the month attain
    > age 62 the month of their 62nd birthday. Everyone else has to wait
    > until the following month,
    > There is a good step by step explaination of have benefits are
    > calculated on the SSA Website at:
    > http://www.ssa.gov/OACT/ProgData/retirebenefit1.html

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Christa wrote:
 Michael, Are
you knowledgeable in social security benefits? I thought about this the
other day ... I seem to remember that the last 10 years of earnings before
retirement count more than the other years in determining the payments.
Are those 10 years counted from normal or early retirement age? I.e., what
if I had enough money to stop working full-time at the age of 55, would
then the years between 45 and 55 be used as those having more weight? Sorry
if this assumption is wrong all along, I just never got much into this.
Would appreciate a quick and simple answer for the layman.Â
HI All!
No.    That simple
enough. LOL  It's your high 35 years of indexed earnings.Â
Then the total of those are divided by 420 (# of months in 35 years). Â
Then that total is multiplied by bend points. 90 percent of the first
$606, 32 percent over $606 and through $3,653 and 15 percent over
$3,653. The total of those three calculations give you your primary
insurance amount (PIA), which is the amount you would receive by waiting
until full retirement age (FRA) to apply. TheFRA is being raised,
so that everyone born after 1960 will have a FRA of 67.  It's
being phsed in. It's currently 65 and 2 months for people that turn
65 this year.
http://www.ssa.gov/OACT/ProgData/nra.html
Your PIA is reduced by each month before
FRA that you apply for benefits. Benefit are reduced 5/9 of one percent
for each month before FRA, up to 36 months. Then the benefit is reduced
5/12 of one percent for each month over 36.
The earliest you can recevie benefits
is the first full month you are age 62. For Social Security puposes
you attain your age the before your birthday, so people born on the 1st
or second of the month attain age 62 the month of their 62nd birthday.Â
Everyone else has to wait until the following month,
Â
There is a good step by step explaination
of have benefits are calculated on the SSA Website at:
http://www.ssa.gov/OACT/ProgData/retirebenefit1.html




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Old Jun 3rd 2003, 11:23 am
  #10  
Andy Platt
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: just curious...

"Christa" wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > Social security retirement benefits are based on time worked (minimum 40
quarters) and there is no difference
    > between US citizens and permanent residents.
    > Disadvantages of remaining LPR rather than naturalizing:
    > Can't live or work outside of the US for longer than a year or two without
giving up your status in the US (with certain
> exceptions)
    > Can't vote
    > The laws can change any time and your permanent status may not be so
permanent anymore (restrictions applied
    > retroactively)

    > There are probably more.

A few others:

a) You get screwed with taxes if your spouse dies because congress decided
that any GC holder would immediately flee the country upon the death of
their spouse so they couldn't possibly have the same estate laws for them.

b) My wife is always terrified that I'll get in a car crash and be convicted
of manslaughter and then deported; since I'm a very careful driver I'm not
so concerned but you get the point: You will be deported if convicted of
certain crimes.

c) Many people see this as a plus!: You can't be on a jury.

d) If you are in my field (software engineering) not being a US citizen can
cause problems if you have to do DoD work - there are visits I've supposed
to do to army bases that I haven't been able to do. Plus you won't get
security clearance if that's necessary. (On the other hand apparently you
won't get security clearance if you are a dual national either so just
becoming a US citizen won't help be there since I'm not planning on giving
up my British citizenship).

Andy.

--
I'm not really here - it's just your warped imagination.
 

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