Returner1

Hello all,

I really appreciate anyone's advice on what is perhaps an unusual question to what is clearly an experienced and knowledgeable forum...

I'm about to surrender my green card and move back to the UK- this is definite and non-negotiable- but I still would like to visit my son every other week in the USA who is a permanent resident and remaining so with his mother. (I know I can get an approval to be away but not surrender my green card but I don't want that).

Total stay per year only 120 days, 7 days at a time (during school holidays I would take him out of USA for my weeks).

I have business interests on both side of Atlantic that could be used to assist whatever way (business visit etc).

Strictly speaking, the VWP provides for this and the B1 is not suited as stays are not exceeding 6 months. Indeed, I've heard the embassy would deny B1 on this basis alone.

I fully expect to get hassle each time at POE as a frequent enterer on VWP, but if I can prove ties to UK (property, business, other family and a copy of my surrendered green card etc.), why should I be denied entry? USA courts REQUIRE that I visit my son for this time.

Any tips on friendlier POEs?

I know they're working on the assumption that visitors will go AWOL but surely the fact that I just gave up a green card means I won't go AWOL in the US or I'd have kept it?

Thanks so much in advance...

Noorah101

Yes, eventually you'll get the hassle of being questioned and sent to secondary, etc. Make sure you bring your court order that shows you are REQUIRED to be in the USA at that particular time, for that amount of time.

Rene

Bill_S

Don't fly into Detroit.

Returner1

Thanks for the fast response! So you think visiting my son is the clincher? I wondered if that would go against me.

I'll have an attorney letter and copy of court ruling.

fatbrit

Kid in the US and you've got a green card? I'd be thinking naturalization as it's the ONLY guarantee of continual long-term visits whilst living elsewhere.

fatbrit

A court summons is pretty well going to guarantee you entry -- even if CBP decide to escort you to the court and then back to the border afterwards. But a court ruling on child custody is, IMO, not.

penguinsix

I had similar in the UK. I was in passing through on a US passport literally every three weeks for about a year or so, and I got pulled aside on more than one occasion to prove I wasn't actually living in the UK. But I had hotel reservations and other tickets and travel stamps with me. At first the officers were a bit rough, but as time went by and they saw I was prepared for the questions they started to realize that I honestly was someone who had to criss cross across LHR every few weeks.

I think what you're going to have to do is prepare for the hassle, to be honest. I would prepare some documentation in a folder and bring it with you on each trip. The court order is a must, also some housing information for the UK, bank account, utility bills even. You can have a copy of your green card (Xerox it before you get rid of it).

While it might grow frustrating to you having to re-explain, I think you'll also have to hold back any 'attitude'-like responses as you get tired of explaining and re-explaining (the last thing you want is one of them to get an attitude in response and throw you out because they are on a power trip). Just be professional and deal and it should work out.

fwiw: please note there is a tiny hitch in surrendering your Green Card as it relates to US taxes. If your income is over a certain amount (basically 6 figures or so) than you may still have to pay US taxes eventhough you have 'surrendered' your Green Card. The IRS assumes you are a tax dodger and getting rid of your Green Card is just a tax dodge, even though you may be getting rid of it for valid immigration reasons (i.e. moved).

I just mention it because if you qualify AND your reason for surrendering was partially based on the tax liability issue you might want to examine this in more detail. We have some data on the bottom of this WIKI entry here:

http://britishexpats.com/wiki/Green_Card_Abandonment

Returner1

Thanks but remember, I don't WANT naturalization or green card. There is nothing in the VWP to say I can't use that.

Folinskyinla

Hi:

Ah, "I have heard ..." line. Are you going to be doing business in the US or just visiting? Is the "business" with US companies and the nature. Maybe a professional consultation with an attorney in London is in order.

Noorah101

True, as long as you're aware that there is also always the possibility of being turned away at the POE when using the VWP. Entry on the VWP is never a guaranteed thing, no matter how much documentation you have with you.

Rene

Folinskyinla

Hi:

Really? When was the law amended? I think I would have heard about it.

fatbrit

And there's nothing to say they have to let you in. Spend a 3-week vacation here every year with your kid and chances are you'll be fine. Plan on a third of the year and it's going to end in tears eventually. There's no legal appeal once they shut the door on you BTW.

If you want to come and go as you please, that right is reserved for US citizens.

Oh...and please don't blame the messenger because you don't like the answer.

Returner1

Thanks Penguin six- that's how I figured it.

However, regarding the 8854, I believe there's a detail missing on that post: this only applies to LONG TERM permanent residents (8 years as a green card holder) and I'm only 4 years. Taken from the IRS website directly on tax responsibilities for green card holders.

penguinsix

This is something that might bear re-examination. While custody and visitation is set now, you do run the risk of 'something' happening in the next XX years that would affect your ability to enter the US. If you had a car accident in the UK and were found guilty of say vehicular manslaughter or something you might have a real problem getting into the US to visit your son, court order or not. Or if you ex- files some bogus case against you for abuse or something weird and causes problems with the legal authorities.

Things happen, attitudes change, people can be ugly. It's just something to consider as you plan out the next decade or two.

I know you don't want a GC or to be a USC, but I hope you think about this with the understanding there is no guarantee to a VWP entry, eventhough it looks clear and others have some success doing similar.

penguinsix

Cool. I should probably add that to the wiki. When I wrote it a few years ago they had just started the process and it was annoying quite a few GC holders.