E2 Visa for USA - Help

Old Mar 5th 2017, 11:17 pm
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Default Re: E2 Visa for USA - Help

You seem to have quoted everybody but me?
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Old Mar 5th 2017, 11:23 pm
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Default Re: E2 Visa for USA - Help

Originally Posted by The Moose
It’s often much better to run the business from the market you’re selling to. My products are too ‘custom’ to just stick in a fulfilment warehouse and keep odd hours in the UK. That’s not to say that it’s not possible at all, however my wife and I wanted to make the move to the USA.
So like I said, the US market is already accessible.

I'll concede that shipping goods transatlantic is perhaps not the optimal solution, but it's hardly misinformation on my part!

Sounds like you need a timeout. Perhaps the American dream is taking its toll.
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Old Mar 5th 2017, 11:24 pm
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Default Re: E2 Visa for USA - Help

Originally Posted by Boiler
GBP100k of stock would take up a lot of space. I assume that most of the value is the stock, does not sound like there is much else.

Most Residential locations do not allow such business activities.

My first thought was that the legal fee sounds reasonable and my second is that you do not have much if anything to see you through, and I assume the Consulate will think the same.

I am sure there are E Commerce businesses that would match an E2, this does not sound one of them.
On the phone, but to address your points in order:

1. No idea how much space the stock takes up - depends on the industry. That could be one diamond or a hell of a lot of furniture foam

2. I looked at moving to multiple residential locations and not a single one had any issue for working from home for a solely e-commerce business and the way it would operate - I.e. As long as you don't have customers coming to the house and it doesn't add more than x vehicle movements a day. Obviously I didn't look at EVERY location in Florida but that was what I found.

3. It sounds like a reasonable fee for a company that has a US and a U.K. presence where you can go into an office in London and speak to someone face to face. That, however, is not necessary. My concern would be the only £10k for this exercise.

4. No idea on this - would need to see full business plan and personal finances before I'd venture advice on whether this particular business is 'E2 compatible'

Does that make you feel better?!
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Old Mar 5th 2017, 11:26 pm
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Default Re: E2 Visa for USA - Help

Originally Posted by tom169
So like I said, the US market is already accessible.

I'll concede that shipping goods transatlantic is perhaps not the optimal solution, but it's hardly misinformation on my part!

Sounds like you need a timeout. Perhaps the American dream is taking its toll.
I didn't say your post was misinformation.
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Old Mar 5th 2017, 11:28 pm
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Default Re: E2 Visa for USA - Help

Originally Posted by The Moose
I didn't say your post was misinformation.
"Wow - so much mis-information in this thread!!!" and then quoting my post in its entirety sure reads that way. Oh well.
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Old Mar 5th 2017, 11:42 pm
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Default Re: E2 Visa for USA - Help

Originally Posted by tom169
"Wow - so much mis-information in this thread!!!" and then quoting my post in its entirety sure reads that way. Oh well.
I think there's some crossed wires going on here - as I'm confused about your reply.

As far as I can see, I only quoted one line - 10 words of your post and commented accordingly? Am I missing something like you having 2 accounts or something?

The only thing I can see that I quoted of yours was:

Originally Posted by tom169
As an online business isn't the US market already accessible?
Which was then proceeded by:

Originally Posted by tom169
For trade shows i'm fairly sure you can attend these on the VWP.
My response to your comment that I quoted (about the US market already being accessible) was to mean that of course the US market is accessible from the UK or anywhere else in the world for that matter, however it's not always practical. It wouldn't be practical for my business to operate in that manor from the UK. The options would be:

1. Have all my products in a fulfillment warehouse in the USA and have them dispatch my orders. The problem with this route is that some of my products are customizable which can't be done by a fulfillment warehouse. Not only that, but the products that I sell are electronics and I test everything together to ensure it works for the customer so that when it arrives, the chances of a DOA are as close to zero as possible. This isn't because we have a high failure rate - just to offer the best customer experience possible.

2. Ship everything from the UK to the USA. This is of course possible but adds additional lead time to the order for the customer, as well as increased costs that either the customer or I have to bear and the customer to have to stand dealing with some costs associated with them being the importer (customs clearance and import duties). Finally, I know that I wouldn't be comfortable buying anything more than a few quid, sorry, bucks from a completely foreign entity so I would still have to have the setup costs and admin overhead of running the company in the USA

3. Employ people in the USA to carry out the business and I operate from afar. Whilst not a bad idea and as it's a business I've ran before in the UK I know how some of the business processes work, I'm not at the level that putting in a full management team on day one is a cost I'd personally like to bear and would add additional time to any issues that need ironing out. That's not to say that this route is not possible long term and is one of my long term routes that I am considering, depending on how the business goes. And besides, I want to be in the USA!

This shows that whilst the market technically is accessible to me in the UK, it's not necessarily financially viable or the best route for me to go down.

As I say, I'm not sure what's got lost in translation in what I posted - perhaps you can clarify your comment above.

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Old Mar 5th 2017, 11:58 pm
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Default Re: E2 Visa for USA - Help

Originally Posted by The Moose
I think there's some crossed wires going on here - as I'm confused about your reply.
Well... let's see! You started your post with: "Wow - so much mis-information in this thread!!!" This implies that everything you're about to quote is misinformation (which, by the way, is one word), and the only reason you'd quote is, therefore, is to correct it. That's what happened. Whether or not that was your actual intent is irrelevant... because we can only go by what you actually wrote and not what happened to be in your head at the time.

Ian
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Old Mar 6th 2017, 12:04 am
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Default Re: E2 Visa for USA - Help

Originally Posted by ian-mstm
Well... let's see! You started your post with: "Wow - so much mis-information in this thread!!!" This implies that everything you're about to quote is misinformation (which, by the way, is one word), and the only reason you'd quote is, therefore, is to correct it. That's what happened. Whether or not that was your actual intent is irrelevant... because we can only go by what you actually wrote and not what happened to be in your head at the time.

Ian
Sorry for the spelling faux pas - being dyslexic I concentrate very hard on getting my written output spelled correctly and as grammatically correct as I possibly can however I do sometimes make mistakes. I do however believe that every day is a school day so will try to remember misinformation!

I would hope that it was clear that not everything that I quoted was misinformation given that I followed with the following comments:
  • This I think is the best bit of advice on this thread. I rarely need a ‘Like’ button, but this is one of those times.
  • Agree with all this
  • Would be a good route. Obviously not one I’ve gone down, however I understand it’s a more expensive way to come to the US than the E2 application.

That should make it fairly clear what was in my head at the time. Apologies if not.
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Old Mar 6th 2017, 2:08 am
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Default Re: E2 Visa for USA - Help

Originally Posted by The Moose
Wow - so much mis-information in this thread!!!

It’s not a lot, however you should be able to do it for about $6,000 with an attorney.

Honestly this sounds like a business you would like to move to the US, rather than one that needs to be in the US, so IMO is likely to be an uphill struggle for a visa, not to mention that "subsistence businesses" are specifically prohibited.

Obviously it depends on the business - for example, a gem stone dealer could store a hell of a lot of stock in a wardrobe. There is actually nothing that stops you renting some self-storage space under your new business in the USA.

You don’t need a business premises - you can use a virtual office/corporate image contract to cover the business premises requirement with no issues at all. If it’s a solely e-commerce business then there should be no zoning issue for working at home.

I don’t know where this $200k comes from - there are plenty of people who get their E2 visa with a lot less. The exact wording is ‘substantial investment’ which is so wooly it’s meaningless really. During my research I came across someone who had invested less than $50,000 for their E2 visa - it’s all about how you put together the pack as I understand it.

I also don’t know where this $400k comes from either…it’s almost as if you don’t actually want people to move to the USA and really isn’t helpful advice!!!

Why go to the expense of a full on office and all that entails if it’s not necessary for the business?

Or have the USA company buy the stock from the UK company. Check the harmonized tariff code (if you import to the UK it’ll be the same code) and see what the US import duty numbers are going to be like. I was very lucky - my commodity codes in the USA are actually a fraction of what they were i the UK.

Not at all! If you walk into a Berkshire Hathaway Home Services branch and say that you want to rent that one then you will have an issue with rent. If you do some ground work and find a rental-by-owner then there’s no reason why you can’t talk your way into a rental without 6+ months rent up front. ....
I DO agree with that, and usually recommend renting privately for exactly that reason.
.... Car insurance don’t require huge deposits. My utilities deposit was $400 for water and nothing for electric or cable. Having said that, I wouldn’t want to make the move with ‘only’ £10,000. I don’t know what medical fees you refer to - I haven’t spend anything yet (other than insurance premiums).

It’s often much better to run the business from the market you’re selling to. My products are too ‘custom’ to just stick in a fulfilment warehouse and keep odd hours in the UK. That’s not to say that it’s not possible at all, however my wife and I wanted to make the move to the USA.

This I think is the best bit of advice on this thread. I rarely need a ‘Like’ button, but this is one of those times.

I’m sorry, but what absolute nonsense!!! Most retail businesses are working on a much larger profit margin than you imply. Most retail businesses would operate on a minimum of 100% markup, if not much much more. It does of course depend on the business.

That’s not true.

Agree with all this

Would be a good route. Obviously not one I’ve gone down, however I understand it’s a more expensive way to come to the US than the E2 application.

I would strongly suggest not doing this alone, however you will require more money for attorney fees. I also suggest you speak with a CPA who is experienced with both the UK/USA side of things. It sounds like you should set up a USA LLC and have that company buy the assets from your UK company. You don’t have to physically move the stock from UK to USA until or unless the visa is issued.

I hope the above has been of some use - for reference, my qualifications to answer the comments are having just gone through the E2 visa process and currently in the USA working.
You obviously know your own business but appear to know very little about businesses in general. While I agree some people have been able to get an E-2 visa based on a capital investment of as little as $50,000, such cases are the exception, not the rule.

The biggest single reason that businesses fail is under capitalization, especially in the early period of establishing and developing the business. So while it is possible to run some businesses on a shoe string, it is usually necessary, and certainly good practice (your business is more likely to succeed) if it has a solid capital base. It is remarkably easy to burn through start up capital, and especially so if you don't have ready access to credit, as new immigrants rarely do.

And everything that applies to a business also applies to setting up a home in another country when you have limited access to credit and are starting a new business which isn't yet up and running, and is therefore generating low or little profit. I would argue that having $100k for personal home expenses rent/ down payment, cars, appliances, furniture, etc, and a cushion of $100k to use in case the business doesn't generate much revenue in the first year or two would be prudent.

Do people start businesses and burn through less start-up money? Undoubtedly yes, but I wouldn't recommend trying to scrimp by with so little as the chances of you simply running out of cash is too high. For a notional "average" business needing commercial or industrial premises, some sort of equipment and machinery, and some sort of stock/inventory of raw.materials and/or merchandise for sale, then $200k is a pretty good starting point. Just 'cos your business didn't need as much doesn't mean that most others don't either!

FWIW if you invest $200k in a business, say with some plant/machinery and inventory, and make a 20% return on your capital invested (which I would argue is high, perhaps unrealistically so, for anything other than a consulting/ advisory/ professional services firm), then you're only making $40,000 which isn't going to get you very far. ..... And one of the reasons I suggest the aggregate $400k - to see you through the period of establishing your business.

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Old Mar 6th 2017, 2:27 am
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Default Re: E2 Visa for USA - Help

Originally Posted by The Moose
On the phone, but to address your points in order:

1. No idea how much space the stock takes up - depends on the industry. That could be one diamond or a hell of a lot of furniture foam

2. I looked at moving to multiple residential locations and not a single one had any issue for working from home for a solely e-commerce business and the way it would operate - I.e. As long as you don't have customers coming to the house and it doesn't add more than x vehicle movements a day. Obviously I didn't look at EVERY location in Florida but that was what I found.

3. It sounds like a reasonable fee for a company that has a US and a U.K. presence where you can go into an office in London and speak to someone face to face. That, however, is not necessary. My concern would be the only £10k for this exercise.

4. No idea on this - would need to see full business plan and personal finances before I'd venture advice on whether this particular business is 'E2 compatible'

Does that make you feel better?!
i feel a bit better:

1. Clothing, so quite a lot of space.

2. We re talking about a warehouse operation.

3. OK

4. Could be E2 compatible, depends on scale.
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Old Mar 6th 2017, 1:00 pm
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Default Re: E2 Visa for USA - Help

Originally Posted by Pulaski
You obviously know your own business but appear to know very little about businesses in general. While I agree some people have been able to get an E-2 visa based on a capital investment of as little as $50,000, such cases are the exception, not the rule.

The biggest single reason that businesses fail is under capitalization, especially in the early period of establishing and developing the business. So while it is possible to run some businesses on a shoe string, it is usually necessary, and certainly good practice (your business is more likely to succeed) if it has a solid capital base. It is remarkably easy to burn through start up capital, and especially so if you don't have ready access to credit, as new immigrants rarely do.

And everything that applies to a business also applies to setting up a home in another country when you have limited access to credit and are starting a new business which isn't yet up and running, and is therefore generating low or little profit. I would argue that having $100k for personal home expenses rent/ down payment, cars, appliances, furniture, etc, and a cushion of $100k to use in case the business doesn't generate much revenue in the first year or two would be prudent.

Do people start businesses and burn through less start-up money? Undoubtedly yes, but I wouldn't recommend trying to scrimp by with so little as the chances of you simply running out of cash is too high. For a notional "average" business needing commercial or industrial premises, some sort of equipment and machinery, and some sort of stock/inventory of raw.materials and/or merchandise for sale, then $200k is a pretty good starting point. Just 'cos your business didn't need as much doesn't mean that most others don't either!

FWIW if you invest $200k in a business, say with some plant/machinery and inventory, and make a 20% return on your capital invested (which I would argue is high, perhaps unrealistically so, for anything other than a consulting/ advisory/ professional services firm), then you're only making $40,000 which isn't going to get you very far. ..... And one of the reasons I suggest the aggregate $400k - to see you through the period of establishing your business.
I must say, I find the bit in bold I highlighted above a touch insulting given you (as far as I'm aware anyway!!!), know nothing about me or my background (also assuming you're not really Jeremy Clarkson!). A lesser man would start slinging insults your way but I'll refrain.

The biggest single reason that businesses fail is cashflow management (or the lack thereof) which is different to just throwing more money into the pot.

This USA sub-forum and the posts within are a fantastic resource for people looking to make the move to the USA. Right at the beginning of my investigation into the process, these threads where invaluable both from an informational point of view but also encouraging that people had actually made the move and were enjoying life on the other side of the pond. This is all down to the help and advice posted within from people who have been there, done that, got the t-shirt. Many a Google search would bring up a britishexpats.com thread.

I am now enjoying trying to establish myself and my business in a new country. I don't know what process you when through, what route you followed or when you came to the US however I do know it was a long time before me and things do change. The perfect example being that as I understand it a physical office presence was required for the E2 visa up until not that long ago but relatively recently USCIS agreed to accept a virtual office agreement as a lease.

I also have experience in ecommerce businesses and the point of my post was to show the OP that even if you are cash strapped it's not an impossibility if you're prepared to work for it. As I said, there's nothing (that I came across) to stop you working from home with a storage unit for your stock to sit within. Yes, you'll do a damn sight many more miles in your car however you'll save initial startup costs on lease(s).

I don't know if it's a recent change or if the forum has always been like this, however there's quite an unwelcoming tone towards anyone who is new here which doesn't seem particularly helpful. A great example is this thread. If you go and reread the thread it's almost as if most of the contributors don't want the guy to make the move across the pond.

My experience is relevant to threads such as this and I will continue to share that experience if I feel it can be of use to other people. This includes pointing out where I feel someone's being given misinformation (see, am learning!).

Have a good one.
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Old Mar 6th 2017, 1:23 pm
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Default Re: E2 Visa for USA - Help

Originally Posted by The Moose
I must say, I find the bit in bold I highlighted above a touch insulting given you (as far as I'm aware anyway!!!), know nothing about me or my background ....
And vice versa, which is why I didn't rubbish what you said as "misinformation".

Disagreeing with people is one thing, trashing it based on your opinion is another matted entirely.

BTW A business can get through some poor cash flow issues, so long as you get them fixed of course, if you have sufficient capital. If you're stretched to the max and have poor cash flow, the business will fold. Think of capital as like a blanket insurance policy, it will help you get through most of the issues a business faces, especially in the start-up years.

So far as not wanting people to move over, I think we don't want people to move over and fail. Certainly that is my take on it - come over well prepared, build a thriving business and enjoy life. But if you come over without a proper plan, and without enough money invested to make a decent income, then you're probably better off staying where you are. I'd sooner be thought of as cautious than be all "ra ra ra, yeah, come on over with $50k and you'll do great! "

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Old Mar 6th 2017, 1:40 pm
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Default Re: E2 Visa for USA - Help

Originally Posted by Pulaski
And vice versa, which is why I didn't rubbish what you said as "misinformation".

Disagreeing with people is one thing, trashing it based on your opinion is another matted entirely.

BTW A business can get through some poor cash flow issues, so long as you get them fixed of course, if you have sufficient capital. If you're stretched to the max and have poor cash flow, the business will fold. Think of capital as like a blanket insurance policy, it will help you get through most of the issues a business faces, especially in the start-up years.

So far as not wanting people to move over, I think we don't want people to move over and fail. Certainly that is my take on it - come over well prepared, build a thriving business and enjoy life. But if you come over without a proper plan, and without enough money invested to make a decent income, then you're probably better off staying where you are. I'd sooner be thought of as cautious than be all "ra ra ra, yeah, come on over with $50k and you'll do great! "
To your first point, absolutely correct. My comments however are not opinions - they are based on my experience over the last 12 months starting from a blank piece of paper and ending up with a visa and in the US with my lovely cat and wife (or should that be lovely wife and cat?!).

I also don't disagree with your second point, however throwing more cash at a poor cash flow management problem just masks the issue and, from experience, often people then don't address the core issue - that cash is king!

I think there's a middle ground here that we both occupy - just possibly slightly different ends. For the record, I also wouldn't go for the "it'll be alright on the night Denis" approach with
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Old Mar 6th 2017, 2:33 pm
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Default Re: E2 Visa for USA - Help

Sometimes more words mean less information. Just saying!
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