Where is the anger?

Old Sep 16th 2021, 3:36 pm
  #196  
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Default Re: Where is the anger?

Originally Posted by johnbrown1938 View Post
And a better candidate on both sides. The last candidate anyone got really excited about was Obama.
Boris ? He is/was a USC….

all your talk about the UK pulling out of intelligence sharing seems even less likely with this new deal:
https://www.politico.eu/article/uk-f...-johnson-says/
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Old Sep 16th 2021, 5:25 pm
  #197  
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Default Re: Where is the anger?

Originally Posted by robin1234 View Post
Not sure that is really realistic. COVID probably will spike sometime in the next six months anyway. But, it’s very likely that by the run up to the 2022 elections, it will have decisively receded, so the general takeaway will be relief that the pandemic is over, even if COVID remains in endemic form.
I think the Delta variant will burn itself out in 6 weeks or however many weeks but not months. Cases are down 50% in a week according to the google graph. If the pandemic is of the unvaccinated as they say there can't be that many left in America for it to infect. And the MU can't be what we fear it will be because it would right on the heels of the delta infecting people and it doesn't seem to be doing that. In UK less than 100 since May.

Last edited by johnbrown1938; Sep 16th 2021 at 5:30 pm.
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Old Sep 16th 2021, 6:21 pm
  #198  
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Default Re: Where is the anger?

In the US everyone has had a chance to get vaccinated for many months. There is no "line" or people who havent had a chance

Those who are vaccinated are protected. End of story, the vaccine works.

Case numbers are irrelevant. It's like saying "how many people tripped over their shoelaces today" and there are so many variables comparison of data is flawed.It might be a guide if there is consistent testing regimes but there is not
  • How many people did we ask? Did we ask 1 million or one thousand? The number of tests carried out will influence the number of cases found
  • Where did we ask? Did we ask outside the local library, or did we ask outside the local old peoples home?

Deaths is what should drive a massive national action."How many people tripped over their shoelaces, smacked their head on the pavement and died of a direct result of that fall

So we are looking at a couple of thousand deaths a day right now. Apparently a pandemic of the unvaccinated.
Here are the other causes of death, that kill more people a day than covid
  • Heart Disease
  • Cancer
  • Accidents
  • Strokes
  • Chronic lower respiratory disease
  • Alzheimers
So Coivid deaths are bad, but if you have had the vaccine it doesn't effect you and it isn't grounds for mandates/lockdowns/masks etc in the same way alcohol, smoking, driving a car etc haven't been banned. Where is the national shoelace ban? If it saves one life...... Out of all of those causes of death, one (covid) is easily and instabtly avoidable. So we are done here. The vaccine is available and everyone who wants it has had it. Over and done.

Unvaccinated people have taken a decision and if they get sick and die that's on them in the same way heavy smokers or speeding drivers take a risk. Fortunately their numbers are relatively small so hospitals are able to handle that. This is in comparison to 18months ago when no one was vaccinated, this was unexpected and hospitals in the main, kinda coped. We should be al set now.

If you can't get vaccinated for health reasons, then stay at home. Don't expect the rest of the country to dance around you, there is no precedent for that. No one tells the rest of the world not to drive because some people died in a car crash
Vaccinated people are good to go. Maybe a tiny number will still get sick from covid but nowhere near a number that demands any action at a national level

More kids died from being shot, in Chicago, last year, than from Covid. Vaccines for Kids, masks for kids is sick and cruel. If it is to protect adults, then see above.

TexanScot is angry at unvaccinated people. My question to him/her is Why? Their decision costs them, no one else. The only reason that impacts you or anyone else is because the government have chosen to double down on the stupid and decided that unvaccinated people have to be protected from themselves at the expense of vaccinated people (and also to protect the vaccinated who are not at risk because they are vaccinated so get vaccinated because it protects you but you are also at risk from those nasty unvaccinated people.....).

If you have anger. direct it at those fools, they are the ones dragging this out for political reasons, not scientific and public health reasons.
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Old Sep 16th 2021, 6:29 pm
  #199  
 
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Default Re: Where is the anger?

Originally Posted by SimonLes View Post

TexanScot is angry at unvaccinated people. My question to him/her is Why? Their decision costs them, no one else.

Leaving aside all the rest of this, this statement is not true. Pools of unvaccinated people are where the variants arise, including variants that may ultimately be able to completely evade the vaccines and put us all right back where we started.
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Old Sep 16th 2021, 6:39 pm
  #200  
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Default Re: Where is the anger?

Those who are vaccinated are protected. End of story, the vaccine works.
You're missing the point. Every vector of transmission is also a vector of possible mutation. We are all at risk.

Fortunately their numbers are relatively small so hospitals are able to handle that.

This is in comparison to 18months ago when no one was vaccinated, this was unexpected and hospitals in the main, kinda coped. We should be al set now.
Must be nice to live in your liberal utopia over there on the West Coast. Over here in the South, hospitals are under siege and ICU beds are either at or near capacity. you sound just like Trump and it 'magically going away'

Not so much.
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Old Sep 16th 2021, 6:40 pm
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Default Re: Where is the anger?

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
Leaving aside all the rest of this, this statement is not true. Pools of unvaccinated people are where the variants arise, including variants that may ultimately be able to completely evade the vaccines and put us all right back where we started.
Vaccintated people can still get it. The virus is more likely to mutate when resisting antibodies in a vaccinated person or person who has natural immunity.

This argument also has no end. The same can be applied to flu or any other virus that we live with ordinarily.
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Old Sep 16th 2021, 6:44 pm
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Default Re: Where is the anger?

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
Leaving aside all the rest of this, this statement is not true. Pools of unvaccinated people are where the variants arise, including variants that may ultimately be able to completely evade the vaccines and put us all right back where we started.
If you choose to continue mandates/masks/lockdowns based on that premise then this will never end. The same logic has never been applied to any other virus/vaccine. This is hysteria. You can't control the rest of the world. Remember when the "delta" variant used to be called the "indian variant"? A USA vaccine mandate isn't going to help.
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Old Sep 16th 2021, 6:47 pm
  #203  
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Default Re: Where is the anger?

Originally Posted by SimonLes View Post
You can't control the rest of the world. Remember when the "delta" variant used to be called the "indian variant"? A USA vaccine mandate isn't going to help.
So by extension we shouldn't be worried about climate change either then. Since we can't enforce our standards on India. Just because something is hard doesn't mean you don't do it. This country used to lead by example.
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Old Sep 16th 2021, 6:48 pm
  #204  
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Default Re: Where is the anger?

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post



Must be nice to live in your liberal utopia over there on the West Coast. Over here in the South, hospitals are under siege and ICU beds are either at or near capacity. you sound just like Trump and it 'magically going away'

Not so much.
If that is the case then anger should be directed at the government (any one you like) for not being prepared. They have had 18 months to prepare for the current peak, a fraction of the size of past waves. What have they been doing?? Where is their "nightingale hospital"? Why should the whole country suffer because of their failure?
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Old Sep 16th 2021, 6:52 pm
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Default Re: Where is the anger?

Originally Posted by SimonLes View Post
If you choose to continue mandates/masks/lockdowns based on that premise then this will never end. The same logic has never been applied to any other virus/vaccine. This is hysteria. You can't control the rest of the world. Remember when the "delta" variant used to be called the "indian variant"? A USA vaccine mandate isn't going to help.
I was simply correcting a factually incorrect statement.

The last time we had a pandemic, the measures we have now were not available. If you can't adapt to changing circumstances, then you won't do very well. It is how our species has grown and prospered.

I will wear a mask for as long as it is necessary for mutual protection. That is how a society works. We take responsibility for each other.

Compulsory vaccines absolutely do work. Remember smallpox? No, you don't. It was eradicated by vaccination. More vaccination = fewer deaths and less disease. Direct relationship.

You are in the US - you are aware that children cannot go to school without a series of mandatory vaccinations? Yes, it works.



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Old Sep 16th 2021, 6:52 pm
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Default Re: Where is the anger?

Originally Posted by SimonLes View Post
If that is the case then anger should be directed at the government (any one you like) for not being prepared. They have had 18 months to prepare for the current peak, a fraction of the size of past waves. What have they been doing?? Where is their "nightingale hospital"? Why should the whole country suffer because of their failure?
I don't consider a vaccine mandate 'suffering' so I reject the premise of your question.

The same logic has never been applied to any other virus/vaccine.
Tell that to anyone that attended public schooling.
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Old Sep 16th 2021, 6:52 pm
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Default Re: Where is the anger?

Originally Posted by SimonLes View Post
If that is the case then anger should be directed at the government (any one you like) for not being prepared. They have had 18 months to prepare for the current peak, a fraction of the size of past waves. What have they been doing?? Where is their "nightingale hospital"? Why should the whole country suffer because of their failure?

You have misquoted. The text in quotes under my name that you have here was not said by me.
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Old Sep 16th 2021, 6:54 pm
  #208  
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Default Re: Where is the anger?

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
You have misquoted. The text in quotes under my name that you have here was not said by me.
Poster seems to be frantically firing out responses. One wonders what the motivation is.
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Old Sep 16th 2021, 6:55 pm
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Default Re: Where is the anger?

Originally Posted by SimonLes View Post
Vaccintated people can still get it. The virus is more likely to mutate when resisting antibodies in a vaccinated person or person who has natural immunity.
.

Where on earth did you get that idea?

The immunity induced by vaccination is "natural". It works by stimulating an immune response in your own immune system.

Yes, you can get infected if you are vaccinated. But you don't die.
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Old Sep 16th 2021, 6:56 pm
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Default Re: Where is the anger?

Originally Posted by civilservant View Post
Poster seems to be frantically firing out responses. One wonders what the motivation is.

He is now deeply down the misinformation rabbit hole.
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