Unvaccinated traveling to the UK?
Jan 21st 2022, 3:25 pm
#16
Banned
Joined: Feb 2017
Location: San Diego
Posts: 42
Re: Unvaccinated traveling to the UK?
Ill give you the first one. I'll replace the word "only" with mostly
The vaccines do not reduce transmission. you are incorrect. Even if there was a marginal difference one should alsolook at behavioural factors. for example vaccinated people like SDgirl and Karen et al all feel save and cosy warm on a plane together, without any of those ghastly unvacninated people. They are more likely to be less careful about washing hands, social distancing, mask wearing etc. Also they will be less likely to exhibit symptoms and will therefore not realize when they are infected.
This is from July- Omnicrom is even more transmissible
Based on this which contradicts what you said, somehow it makes sense to force millions of people to inject their bodies with something to protect a tiny number of people, for no tangible gain?
Even if you are right, does it make sense to force millions of people to do something they don't want, for a 10% (or whatever your number is) reduction in transmission, for a disease that a majority of people are vaccinated against and the remainder a high percentage most likely have some form of natural immunity. So maybe at a high estimate that's 10% of the population who are 10 % more transmissible for a disease with a 0.07% mortality rate. That's a tiny risk, tiny.
The vaccines do not reduce transmission. you are incorrect. Even if there was a marginal difference one should alsolook at behavioural factors. for example vaccinated people like SDgirl and Karen et al all feel save and cosy warm on a plane together, without any of those ghastly unvacninated people. They are more likely to be less careful about washing hands, social distancing, mask wearing etc. Also they will be less likely to exhibit symptoms and will therefore not realize when they are infected.
FAUCI: What we did know was how transmissible the virus was among unvaccinated people. So it was very clear that when you compared the delta variant with, for example, the alpha variant, it was clearly considerably more transmissible. The new data show that it is so transmissible that even a vaccinated person who has a breakthrough infection can now transmit it. That is the new data.
“The virus in the nasal pharynx of a vaccinated person who gets a breakthrough infection with Delta, it is exactly the same as the level of virus in an unvaccinated person who’s infected” - Dr Fauci
Based on this which contradicts what you said, somehow it makes sense to force millions of people to inject their bodies with something to protect a tiny number of people, for no tangible gain?
Even if you are right, does it make sense to force millions of people to do something they don't want, for a 10% (or whatever your number is) reduction in transmission, for a disease that a majority of people are vaccinated against and the remainder a high percentage most likely have some form of natural immunity. So maybe at a high estimate that's 10% of the population who are 10 % more transmissible for a disease with a 0.07% mortality rate. That's a tiny risk, tiny.
Jan 21st 2022, 3:56 pm
#17
Heading for Poppyland
Joined: Jul 2007
Location: North Norfolk and northern New York State
Posts: 14,539
Re: Unvaccinated traveling to the UK?
Isn’t the above seriously off-topic? People are trying to find out what the current rules are for traveling to the UK when not vaccinated.
Jan 21st 2022, 4:02 pm
#18
SUPER MODERATOR
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 88,020
Re: Unvaccinated traveling to the UK
Ill give you the first one. I'll replace the word "only" with mostly
The vaccines do not reduce transmission. you are incorrect. Even if there was a marginal difference one should alsolook at behavioural factors. for example vaccinated people like SDgirl and Karen et al all feel save and cosy warm on a plane together, without any of those ghastly unvacninated people. They are more likely to be less careful about washing hands, social distancing, mask wearing etc. Also they will be less likely to exhibit symptoms and will therefore not realize when they are infected.
This is from July- Omnicrom is even more transmissible
Based on this which contradicts what you said, somehow it makes sense to force millions of people to inject their bodies with something to protect a tiny number of people, for no tangible gain?
Even if you are right, does it make sense to force millions of people to do something they don't want, for a 10% (or whatever your number is) reduction in transmission, for a disease that a majority of people are vaccinated against and the remainder a high percentage most likely have some form of natural immunity. So maybe at a high estimate that's 10% of the population who are 10 % more transmissible for a disease with a 0.07% mortality rate. That's a tiny risk, tiny.
The vaccines do not reduce transmission. you are incorrect. Even if there was a marginal difference one should alsolook at behavioural factors. for example vaccinated people like SDgirl and Karen et al all feel save and cosy warm on a plane together, without any of those ghastly unvacninated people. They are more likely to be less careful about washing hands, social distancing, mask wearing etc. Also they will be less likely to exhibit symptoms and will therefore not realize when they are infected.
This is from July- Omnicrom is even more transmissible
Based on this which contradicts what you said, somehow it makes sense to force millions of people to inject their bodies with something to protect a tiny number of people, for no tangible gain?
Even if you are right, does it make sense to force millions of people to do something they don't want, for a 10% (or whatever your number is) reduction in transmission, for a disease that a majority of people are vaccinated against and the remainder a high percentage most likely have some form of natural immunity. So maybe at a high estimate that's 10% of the population who are 10 % more transmissible for a disease with a 0.07% mortality rate. That's a tiny risk, tiny.
Jan 21st 2022, 4:27 pm
#19
BE Enthusiast
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 348
Re: Unvaccinated traveling to the UK?
In an earlier point you mentioned not wanting to show the card or app or whatever to the check-in person. In my recent travel, it was all done electronically and no human ever saw my records, it was via Virgin Atlantic's VerifyFly system and very quick and easy during online checkin.
Jan 21st 2022, 4:56 pm
#20
Banned
Joined: Feb 2017
Location: San Diego
Posts: 42
Re: Unvaccinated traveling to the UK?
You are of course welcome to not be vaccinated if you so choose, at this point it's your own lookout - but you have no right to travel internationally if you choose to do so.
Why? PM me if you don't want to go off topic on this thread
Anyway, back to the thread topic, thanks for the insight about the verifyfly. I will look into that.
<snip>
Last edited by christmasoompa; Jan 21st 2022 at 5:02 pm. Reason: Site Rule 15.
Jan 21st 2022, 5:06 pm
#21
DE-UK-NZ-IE-US... the TYP
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,855
Re: Unvaccinated traveling to the UK?
Those suggesting they are in some danger traveling with unvaccinated people are misinformed. I don't know how you can be under the impression you are at risk somehow. You are vaccinated so unlikely to get very sick, but you can still get it and spread it, same for your fellow vaccinated travellers travellers. Your logic doesn't stand up and it is damaging and dangerous. Just because Biden says unvaccinated people are killing people with covid, it doesn't mean it is true. he is talking rubbish and so are you.
To the OP, I ask this question
Let's say you go to the UK as an unvaccinated traveler (which soon will mean "hasn't had a booster") and you do the tests and give your address and promise to stay at home like a good boy. What if you just ignore that and carry on doing whatever you want. What exactly are the UK authorities going to do about it? They can fine you but you will be long gone.
I might be vaccinated, I might not be, but I refuse to show my medical papers to some check in clerk, so lets put me down as unvaccinated. This is my plan. I'll dance their stupid tune until I get to my place of residence in the UK and then I'll do exactly what i want. if some little nazi covid police shows up and finds me not at home, by the time any consequences come my way I will be back in the USA.
AND, a third of people in the UK are not boosted. Not boosted means "unvaccinated" soon, are the government really going to be able to restrict the travel of 1/3rd of the population with the current data on Omnicron and hospitalisations, especially when they are increasingly being called out for their manipulation of models and data. it can't be justified and intimidating people to try and force them to get a vaccination without a medical justification doesn't work.
I'll say it again people- being vaccinated doesn't stop you getting covid,. it doesn't stop you spreading covid, it just reduces your chances of getting very ill for a virus that only really hurts old people, ill people and fatties. Unvaccinated people are not a danger to you, any talk of "mutations" and "breakthrough cases" causes by unvaccinated people is incorrect and dangerous.
To the OP, I ask this question
Let's say you go to the UK as an unvaccinated traveler (which soon will mean "hasn't had a booster") and you do the tests and give your address and promise to stay at home like a good boy. What if you just ignore that and carry on doing whatever you want. What exactly are the UK authorities going to do about it? They can fine you but you will be long gone.
I might be vaccinated, I might not be, but I refuse to show my medical papers to some check in clerk, so lets put me down as unvaccinated. This is my plan. I'll dance their stupid tune until I get to my place of residence in the UK and then I'll do exactly what i want. if some little nazi covid police shows up and finds me not at home, by the time any consequences come my way I will be back in the USA.
AND, a third of people in the UK are not boosted. Not boosted means "unvaccinated" soon, are the government really going to be able to restrict the travel of 1/3rd of the population with the current data on Omnicron and hospitalisations, especially when they are increasingly being called out for their manipulation of models and data. it can't be justified and intimidating people to try and force them to get a vaccination without a medical justification doesn't work.
I'll say it again people- being vaccinated doesn't stop you getting covid,. it doesn't stop you spreading covid, it just reduces your chances of getting very ill for a virus that only really hurts old people, ill people and fatties. Unvaccinated people are not a danger to you, any talk of "mutations" and "breakthrough cases" causes by unvaccinated people is incorrect and dangerous.
That's an incredible statement, absolutely insane. off topic, but insane
Why? PM me if you don't want to go off topic on this thread
Anyway, back to the thread topic, thanks for the insight about the verifyfly. I will look into that.
@jerseygirl- you deleted my attempt to get this back on topic. You ignored everyone else on the thread who went off topic. The minute I dispute the incorrect narrative and demonstrate a perfectly reasonable position, with evidence, you censor what I am saying. There may be a rationale for that, in that it was going off topic, but I didn't start it & you only delete me. It's censorship and hypocrisy. if you want to apply rules and use your authority, then you should apply them consistently and fairly.
"you need to move on" = " hey, don't come here with facts and reason, we don't like what you are saying because it attacks our confirmation bias and we want you to stop it"
I don't want to discuss the rights and wrongs of vaccination, I want to know about how all this is verified and enforced.
Why? PM me if you don't want to go off topic on this thread
Anyway, back to the thread topic, thanks for the insight about the verifyfly. I will look into that.
@jerseygirl- you deleted my attempt to get this back on topic. You ignored everyone else on the thread who went off topic. The minute I dispute the incorrect narrative and demonstrate a perfectly reasonable position, with evidence, you censor what I am saying. There may be a rationale for that, in that it was going off topic, but I didn't start it & you only delete me. It's censorship and hypocrisy. if you want to apply rules and use your authority, then you should apply them consistently and fairly.
"you need to move on" = " hey, don't come here with facts and reason, we don't like what you are saying because it attacks our confirmation bias and we want you to stop it"
I don't want to discuss the rights and wrongs of vaccination, I want to know about how all this is verified and enforced.
It reads like you are trying to gather information to allow you to circumvent the UK rules, which you have stated you are going to ignore.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/how-to-q...ive-in-england
Jan 21st 2022, 5:17 pm
#22
Account Closed
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 26,319
Re: Unvaccinated traveling to the UK?
It reads like you are trying to gather information to allow you to circumvent the UK rules, which you have stated you are going to ignore.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/how-to-q...ive-in-england
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/how-to-q...ive-in-england
Jan 21st 2022, 5:18 pm
#23
Banned
Joined: Feb 2017
Location: San Diego
Posts: 42
Re: Unvaccinated traveling to the UK?
It reads like you are trying to gather information to allow you to circumvent the UK rules, which you have stated you are going to ignore.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/how-to-q...ive-in-england
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/how-to-q...ive-in-england
I have a flight booked for June to London followed by one to Spain
Maybe i had the vaccine, Maybe I didn't. But that makes me "unvaccinated" I refuse to comply with this illogical tyranny.
I refuse to provide my health details to a unregulated third party for no good reason.
Vaccine passports don't achieve anything other than pressure people to get a vaccine in order to go about their business, the governments have admitted this <snip>. A vaccine that impacts nobody but the person getting it who the government seem to think they know better than me.
Last edited by christmasoompa; Jan 21st 2022 at 5:25 pm. Reason: Site Rule 15.
Jan 21st 2022, 5:22 pm
#24
Account Closed
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 26,319
Re: Unvaccinated traveling to the UK?
Yep.
I have a flight booked for June to London followed by one to Spain
Maybe i had the vaccine, Maybe I didn't. But that makes me "unvaccinated" I refuse to comply with this illogical tyranny.
I refuse to provide my health details to a unregulated third party for no good reason.
Vaccine passports don't achieve anything other than pressure people to get a vaccine in order to go about their business, the governments have admitted this and I provided a clip from the times that the censorious mods on this forum removed. A vaccine that impacts nobody but the person getting it who the government seem to think they no better than.
I have a flight booked for June to London followed by one to Spain
Maybe i had the vaccine, Maybe I didn't. But that makes me "unvaccinated" I refuse to comply with this illogical tyranny.
I refuse to provide my health details to a unregulated third party for no good reason.
Vaccine passports don't achieve anything other than pressure people to get a vaccine in order to go about their business, the governments have admitted this and I provided a clip from the times that the censorious mods on this forum removed. A vaccine that impacts nobody but the person getting it who the government seem to think they no better than.
Jan 21st 2022, 5:23 pm
#25
SUPER MODERATOR
Joined: Oct 2007
Location: In a darkened room somewhere.............
Posts: 34,030
Re: Unvaccinated traveling to the UK?
I have a flight booked for June to London followed by one to Spain
Maybe i had the vaccine, Maybe I didn't. But that makes me "unvaccinated" I refuse to comply with this illogical tyranny.
I refuse to provide my health details to a unregulated third party for no good reason.
Maybe i had the vaccine, Maybe I didn't. But that makes me "unvaccinated" I refuse to comply with this illogical tyranny.
I refuse to provide my health details to a unregulated third party for no good reason.
Last edited by christmasoompa; Jan 21st 2022 at 5:26 pm.
Jan 21st 2022, 5:29 pm
#26
Banned
Joined: Feb 2017
Location: San Diego
Posts: 42
Re: Unvaccinated traveling to the UK?
It reads like you are trying to gather information to allow you to circumvent the UK rules, which you have stated you are going to ignore.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/how-to-q...ive-in-england
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/how-to-q...ive-in-england
I "could" get fined up to £10,000. I'd like to see them get that off me, given I will be back in the US by the time any court dates came up. A non UK resident can't be tried in a UK court so that's going to be a waste of their time anyhow.
Now I need to figure out how to get to Spain. Maybe I could get the ferry to France and then the train through the unmanned border? Depends on the french rules I guess, problem with them is they will be in french!
Jan 21st 2022, 5:33 pm
#27
SUPER MODERATOR
Joined: Oct 2007
Location: In a darkened room somewhere.............
Posts: 34,030
Re: Unvaccinated traveling to the UK?
Jan 21st 2022, 5:34 pm
#28
Banned
Joined: Feb 2017
Location: San Diego
Posts: 42
Re: Unvaccinated traveling to the UK?
Denial of citizenship based on an illogical mandate to take a medicine is not a thing. The UK can't stop me going home and the US can't stop me going back to my place of residence- that has NEVER been the case at anytime during the covid pandemic. For someone so sure of themself, you really say a lot of things that are wrong. I call for your posts to be deleted for misinformation
Jan 21st 2022, 5:48 pm
#29
Account Closed
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 26,319
Re: Unvaccinated traveling to the UK?
That's incorrect. The link supplied is clear, if you can't provide evidence of vaccination you are not barred from flying, you have to do tests and quarantine, that is all,
Denial of citizenship based on an illogical mandate to take a medicine is not a thing. The UK can't stop me going home and the US can't stop me going back to my place of residence- that has NEVER been the case at anytime during the covid pandemic. For someone so sure of themself, you really say a lot of things that are wrong. I call for your posts to be deleted for misinformation
Denial of citizenship based on an illogical mandate to take a medicine is not a thing. The UK can't stop me going home and the US can't stop me going back to my place of residence- that has NEVER been the case at anytime during the covid pandemic. For someone so sure of themself, you really say a lot of things that are wrong. I call for your posts to be deleted for misinformation
But you've already said you'd refuse to do the quarantine, and couldn't if you're only in the UK shorter than the current required quarantine period.
So how about we ask the mods to remove you from the fòrum for trying to do something you've been told you shouldn't.
Jan 21st 2022, 6:12 pm
#30
BE Enthusiast
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 348
Re: Unvaccinated traveling to the UK?
Denial of citizenship based on an illogical mandate to take a medicine is not a thing. The UK can't stop me going home and the US can't stop me going back to my place of residence- that has NEVER been the case at anytime during the covid pandemic. For someone so sure of themself, you really say a lot of things that are wrong. I call for your posts to be deleted for misinformation