Leslie

Virginia Tech not only had armed guards ... they had their own armed police force.

Scouse Express

Let's not forget the incident when NYC Cops, responding to a shooting at the Empire State Building shot 9 Bystanders whilst trying to Nail the Shooter.......and they undergo weapons qualifying every so often.


Jim.

thinbrit

You are tackling the symptom and not the cause.
Ban guns, permits to sell knifes, ban samurai swords. The UK has been down that road, without ever spending as much effort on the 'why' and not the 'how' crimes are committed.
The bleeding hearts will want the 'MaM' (Mittens after Midnight) law that forces all party goers to wear mittens for each others protection:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-20861342

How about addressing the problem, the people doing these things? Or is it easier to address the symptoms, and to hell with everything else?

HarryTheSpider

Thanks for reminding me about something...

Your response reflects an understandably common view put forward by many, held by even more. It is based on our direct experience of solving everyday problems.

But I believe this is not a problem that lends itself to the standard problem solving approach of...

1. Define problem
2. Identify root causes
3. Remove/mitigate effects of root causes
4. Live happily ever after / move on to next problem

This issue is a 'wicked problem' IMHO. This term has specific meaning... A brief intro can be found here...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wicked_problem

So it could be the case that the symptoms are also the root causes and vice versa... Or more correctly, there are no isolate lee root causes, that the drivers of this issue are so interconnected that there is no 'root'...

Which means that you cannot solve this in the traditional sense... All you can do is adjust things to some extent and 'cope' or 'tolerate' the outcome...

SATX John

Correct on Wicked problem, Systems Theory and Complexity Theory. Once anything is done in the environment, the system changes. Just the statement about possibly passing a ban has fundamentally affected the system (country).

Result thousands of additional firearms, high cap mags, and ammo sold. The exact opposite of the intention to restrict ownership and control these weapons. I have a few friends that bought those types of guns only because they may be banned. They never had an intention to own one previously.

All this from just a statement, and media spin.

SATX John

And one of his handguns was legal during the assault weapons ban, he had a pistol with a 10 rd mag and one with a 15 rd magazine.

Just meant more magazines, for a demented person.

HarryTheSpider

This is one of the reasons these are called "wicked" - outcomes are difficult to predict with useful accuracy - so it could be foreseen some would buy because of the impending ban, but not how many... And that in future, now that this unintended consequence is known, might STOP law makers considering an option that had this effect in the past for fear it would be repeated. It might be repeated, but the 'system' itself is now different - though it's impossible to say how different, and whether any difference would matter - wicked!

SATX John

Agreed, unintended consequences usually get us all.

How bout health care, later?

Leslie

Good point. We'll need a bigger and better ban this time.

Leslie

Are you really this desperate? Do you honestly believe that that piece of human filth read the Guardian? Or followed international news at all? I reckon he killed his granny in 1981 because somebody in London killed their granny too? I'm sure it was completely the influence of the UK that made him the murderer that he turned out to be.

Why do you even post here? It's obvious that you hold the people on this forum, as well as the entire British culture, in complete and utter contempt. You've got issues that go well beyond normal everyday jingoism. I think you need to look at what motivates you.

Scouse Express

I would also like to point out that in the Virginia Tech Shooting, semi-auto pistols were used - No Assault Weapons.


Jim.

robin1234

I think his wife is British..

Leslie

I was trying to be tactful and wasn't going to come right out and say that but ...

Issues.

Pulaski

The magazine/ clip size is IMO a complete red herring because they can be replaced in a fraction of a second and with practice without even taking your eyes off the target. So there is no practical difference between a gunman with a gun and four 30 round magazines and one with twenty 6 round magazines.

Scouse Express

This was his first post on here;

http://britishexpats.com/forum/showt...74#post9919674