Guaranteed Vacation Time by Country
Dec 18th 2014, 5:17 pm
#61
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Re: Guaranteed Vacation Time by Country
I'm not saying that people don't lose their jobs, in fact quite the opposite, we all know that people often do in the US. What I said was that most qualified and experienced people soon find other jobs/ occupations.
Dec 18th 2014, 5:39 pm
#62
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Re: Guaranteed Vacation Time by Country
Is the system perfect? No but I'd rather take my chances in the Silicon Valley than anywhere else.
Last edited by Michael; Dec 18th 2014 at 5:43 pm.
Dec 18th 2014, 5:58 pm
#63
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Re: Guaranteed Vacation Time by Country
Profit sharing is quite common with many American companies. Even Walgreens has profit sharing. However for the Silicon Valley, almost all hi-tech companies offer stock options and employee stock purchase plan (typically 85% of the lowest price at the beginning or end of the period which ever is lower) to all their employees and that is where someone makes the real money and not through profit sharing. Stock options were started by Bob Norris when he started Intel in the 1960s and he was called a communist since stock options are supposed to be only for the top executives. Since then, almost every Silicon Valley company has followed suit. Microsoft, Facebook, Google, Apple, and many others have made tens of thousands of millionaires with stock options including secretaries that were with the company when the company started up and the odds are far greater than winning the lottery.
Is the system perfect? No but I'd rather take my chances in the Silicon Valley than anywhere else.
Is the system perfect? No but I'd rather take my chances in the Silicon Valley than anywhere else.
Unfortunately, it's not something companies usually offer to average employees over here, and of course there are certain regulations which penalise 'excessive' generosity - presumably to protect us all from common business evils such as "success". No surprise the employer-employee relationship is always rather adversarial here. It's the law.
Dec 18th 2014, 6:07 pm
#64
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Re: Guaranteed Vacation Time by Country
I'll just say this and get out:
First, competition is good. It gives you a lot more choices, and better ones, too.
If you don't like the vacation offered in a job, then (especially in the US) you can go elsewhere. The US has a pretty low unemployment number. Nobody is holding a gun to your head, and it isn't as though there are no other jobs (as is in Spain, for example, where if you're lucky enough to have a job, you better suck it up, 'cause there just ain't any other choices, but that's our social system at work).
I believe anybody who has skills and brings value to a company always has the ability to leverage it in their favour. If your company doesn't recognise your value, then offer that value to their competitor for better conditions. That's competition.
But if you're worthless, well, then why should you be rewarded with a "guarantee"?
For christs' sake, since when has anything been guaranteed in life? Perhaps all people (even the worthless) should be guaranteed to have a minimum of 6 weeks paid time off? 12 Weeks? Blimey! why work at all? We're entitled. Besides, it's not my problem. The ****** government is responsible for everything that I don't get.
Right, then.
First, competition is good. It gives you a lot more choices, and better ones, too.
If you don't like the vacation offered in a job, then (especially in the US) you can go elsewhere. The US has a pretty low unemployment number. Nobody is holding a gun to your head, and it isn't as though there are no other jobs (as is in Spain, for example, where if you're lucky enough to have a job, you better suck it up, 'cause there just ain't any other choices, but that's our social system at work).
I believe anybody who has skills and brings value to a company always has the ability to leverage it in their favour. If your company doesn't recognise your value, then offer that value to their competitor for better conditions. That's competition.
But if you're worthless, well, then why should you be rewarded with a "guarantee"?
For christs' sake, since when has anything been guaranteed in life? Perhaps all people (even the worthless) should be guaranteed to have a minimum of 6 weeks paid time off? 12 Weeks? Blimey! why work at all? We're entitled. Besides, it's not my problem. The ****** government is responsible for everything that I don't get.
Right, then.
Those in the upper income brackets do indeed have more negotiating space but those who are not in the lower income brackets generally do not understand life in that bracket.
Dec 18th 2014, 6:13 pm
#65
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Re: Guaranteed Vacation Time by Country
I'm not saying the system is fair since it isn't in any country. The US as a whole ranks near the top in median household income in PPP$ compared to individual European countries. If the US was broken out by states individually, probably over 1/2 would all be near or at the top.
You stated earlier that you sell back your 2 weeks vacation because you need the money but what would you do if you got 6 weeks vacation and a reduction in salary by 8% and couldn't sell those vacation days back? You may say that Europe has a better safety net than Canada or the US but much of that paid for by the middle class with 20%-25% VAT, $5 per gallon taxes on petrol, and one country's income tax rate is a flat 45% for all incomes. In every country there are the extremely rich with tax loopholes to keep them very rich.
We can't see behind closed doors so we don't know what the average life is like in any country. Personally I've been behind those closed doors where my father had a middle class income and very little extra money for 5 children. I felt deprived since there wasn't money for vacation and even things that many would consider the basics of life.
Over the past month, I met a guy that asked me to help him find a better job. When I met him, he was single and making about $24,000 per year because his work hours were cut by one day per week. He shares a place with another guy but besides his low salary, he is carrying baggage that made things worse. For the last month he was over my place just about every day and I was showing him how to use the computer so he could search and find a better job, teach him why he was carrying that baggage and how to get out from under it, and to establish goals that he can accomplish. He claims he is willing to work long hours to get out of the hole he dug himself.
There are currently about 5 million unfilled jobs in the US and he can see the light if he works hard enough and has started to remove some of the baggage. The biggest question is whether he will follow through with his goals
You stated earlier that you sell back your 2 weeks vacation because you need the money but what would you do if you got 6 weeks vacation and a reduction in salary by 8% and couldn't sell those vacation days back? You may say that Europe has a better safety net than Canada or the US but much of that paid for by the middle class with 20%-25% VAT, $5 per gallon taxes on petrol, and one country's income tax rate is a flat 45% for all incomes. In every country there are the extremely rich with tax loopholes to keep them very rich.
We can't see behind closed doors so we don't know what the average life is like in any country. Personally I've been behind those closed doors where my father had a middle class income and very little extra money for 5 children. I felt deprived since there wasn't money for vacation and even things that many would consider the basics of life.
Over the past month, I met a guy that asked me to help him find a better job. When I met him, he was single and making about $24,000 per year because his work hours were cut by one day per week. He shares a place with another guy but besides his low salary, he is carrying baggage that made things worse. For the last month he was over my place just about every day and I was showing him how to use the computer so he could search and find a better job, teach him why he was carrying that baggage and how to get out from under it, and to establish goals that he can accomplish. He claims he is willing to work long hours to get out of the hole he dug himself.
There are currently about 5 million unfilled jobs in the US and he can see the light if he works hard enough and has started to remove some of the baggage. The biggest question is whether he will follow through with his goals
I just work now as I get too bored at home, but there is no incentive to work, I make the same working as I would on disability which I am able to get anytime I am not working, pretty sad when working full-time brings in the same amount as disability income does.
The system is North America is set up very much to benefit those at the top with high incomes, not those at the bottom in the trenches who receive no real benefits other then a low wage.
Dec 18th 2014, 6:14 pm
#66
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Re: Guaranteed Vacation Time by Country
Stock options? Yes, many people become pretty wealthy that way. All of my employees were shareholders and made out quite well when we sold the company. I was under the impression it was not at all uncommon to give employees incentive equity to give them a personal stake, and stay and grow with the company. I've often characterised that model as the "American" model, and I think that's how most people characterise it too.
Unfortunately, it's not something companies usually offer to average employees over here, and of course there are certain regulations which penalise 'excessive' generosity - presumably to protect us all from common business evils such as "success". No surprise the employer-employee relationship is always rather adversarial here. It's the law.
Unfortunately, it's not something companies usually offer to average employees over here, and of course there are certain regulations which penalise 'excessive' generosity - presumably to protect us all from common business evils such as "success". No surprise the employer-employee relationship is always rather adversarial here. It's the law.
Facebook’s Saverin May Save $67 Million on U.S. Tax Bill - Bloomberg
Dec 18th 2014, 6:14 pm
#67
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Re: Guaranteed Vacation Time by Country
But not necessarily quickly, or easily. When there are mass quarterly layoffs in an industry and relocations are often needed to take a job.
Dec 18th 2014, 6:27 pm
#68
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Re: Guaranteed Vacation Time by Country
America is not without risk. When the sale boom started in North Dakota, many unskilled workers moved to North Dakota on the chance they could find a job and were immediately offered jobs that paid $100K plus. The work was hard and long but they made 3x more than they previously made and they now have a skill that is transferable.
Dec 18th 2014, 8:26 pm
#69
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Re: Guaranteed Vacation Time by Country
So, you're saying that if you have talent, and your company doesn't reward it, you are forced to stay with that company? Their competitor wouldn't like to have that resource in their pocket? Or are you suggesting that all competitors collude with one another to prevent that from happening?
Unless you mean that only profit-driven industries count...?
But to be fair, if you're untalented, unenthusiastic, apathetic, pessimistic, and generally aren't much of an asset to your company, Europe is an excellent place to have a job (if you can get one). Lots of things guaranteed under the law, even if you're worthless. I reckon that helps explain Europe's employment situation.
Dec 18th 2014, 8:43 pm
#70
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Re: Guaranteed Vacation Time by Country
I lived in Europe when many German companies (Volkswagen, etc.) guaranteed lifetime employment since there were more jobs than German workers could fill and several million southern European employees were hired to fill the jobs that the Germans didn't want to do. That guarantee didn't last long after the oil shock hit in the 1970s.
Dec 18th 2014, 9:28 pm
#72
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Re: Guaranteed Vacation Time by Country
Because
'Legally guaranteed time off is silly. This is part of any decision to take a job. '
Some may not have much choice but to take a specific job. However they'd still like to enjoy a healthy work/life balance even if the employer doesn't respect that.
To dismiss something that many millions benefit from as 'silly' is kind of silly.
What's your opinion on a legally guaranteed minimum wage?
Last edited by Hotscot; Dec 18th 2014 at 9:31 pm.
Dec 18th 2014, 9:40 pm
#74
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Re: Guaranteed Vacation Time by Country
Sorry....Komrad...
Dec 18th 2014, 10:39 pm
#75
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Re: Guaranteed Vacation Time by Country
Some countries work very well without a legal minimum wage such as Switzerland.
Last year 1.532 million hourly workers earned the federal minimum of $7.25 an hour; nearly 1.8 million more earned less than that because they fell under one of several exemptions (tipped employees, full-time students, certain disabled workers and others), for a total of 3.3 million hourly workers at or below the federal minimum. That group represents 4.3% of the nation’s 75.9 million hourly-paid workers and 2.6% of all wage and salary workers.
Who makes minimum wage? | Pew Research Center
Pacific coast states and most New England states have a higher minimum wage than $7.25 per hour. Maybe the federal minimum wage should be $12 per hour but then expect food prices, restaurant services, hotel services, garden services, healthcare for the elderly, and other services to increase significantly and that may be real tough for people living in states like Mississippi where they may quit using many of those services. There is a fine line when minimum wage jobs approach median income wage jobs since then maybe median income workers may decide that they'd rather work any easy midnight shift as a security guard instead of having to put in an effort at their current job. Also since the middle class is the primary driver of the economy, a cut back in use of the services may lead to higher unemployment. A high minimum wage is primarily a redistribution of wealth from the middle class to the poor and not from the rich or upper middle class.
Last year 1.532 million hourly workers earned the federal minimum of $7.25 an hour; nearly 1.8 million more earned less than that because they fell under one of several exemptions (tipped employees, full-time students, certain disabled workers and others), for a total of 3.3 million hourly workers at or below the federal minimum. That group represents 4.3% of the nation’s 75.9 million hourly-paid workers and 2.6% of all wage and salary workers.
Who makes minimum wage? | Pew Research Center
Pacific coast states and most New England states have a higher minimum wage than $7.25 per hour. Maybe the federal minimum wage should be $12 per hour but then expect food prices, restaurant services, hotel services, garden services, healthcare for the elderly, and other services to increase significantly and that may be real tough for people living in states like Mississippi where they may quit using many of those services. There is a fine line when minimum wage jobs approach median income wage jobs since then maybe median income workers may decide that they'd rather work any easy midnight shift as a security guard instead of having to put in an effort at their current job. Also since the middle class is the primary driver of the economy, a cut back in use of the services may lead to higher unemployment. A high minimum wage is primarily a redistribution of wealth from the middle class to the poor and not from the rich or upper middle class.
Last edited by Michael; Dec 18th 2014 at 10:43 pm.