Florida shooting

Old Feb 23rd 2018, 2:32 am
  #721  
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Default Re: Florida shooting

Nice to hear a high ranking police officer call out the NRA'S bs.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/...action-sot.cnn
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Old Feb 23rd 2018, 9:50 am
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Default Re: Florida shooting

Originally Posted by anotherlimey

I hear there was a school cop outside when the shooting started, but he didn't confront the shooter. That really makes me sick.
How long before the NRA, asshole 45, et al start to blame the 'good guy with a gun'. Would you be so keen to offer yourself up for target practice? Presumably it is the assumption that an SRO is there to run gung ho, Rambo style, into a fire fight without assessing the situation?
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Old Feb 23rd 2018, 9:57 am
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Default Re: Florida shooting

School cop probably didn't have enough guns, or heavy enough weaponry to make it a "fair fight". What's going to happen when the first teacher issued with a 9mm pistol gets shot by a loony with a couple of AR-15s?

The NRA won't be happy until every public building in the USA is like a post-apocalyptic survivalist zombie movie, where the only thing that matters is how well-armed you are.
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Old Feb 23rd 2018, 11:09 am
  #724  
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Default Re: Florida shooting

Seems like he resigned tp protect his pension, I think we can safety assume he will also be moving from the area.
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Old Feb 23rd 2018, 11:11 am
  #725  
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Default Re: Florida shooting

Originally Posted by zzrmark
How long before the NRA, asshole 45, et al start to blame the 'good guy with a gun'. Would you be so keen to offer yourself up for target practice? Presumably it is the assumption that an SRO is there to run gung ho, Rambo style, into a fire fight without assessing the situation?
Yes, that's also what his boss expected him to do. He's also paid to do it. Hence the SRO resigned.

A coach, and a few students, died jumping in front of other students. The one guy with the means to end it stayed outside.

IIRC the standard response to an active shooter changed in recent years from wait for backup to engage as soon as possible. They had a 60 minutes piece on it last year.
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Old Feb 23rd 2018, 11:13 am
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Default Re: Florida shooting

Originally Posted by Boiler
Seems like he resigned tp protect his pension, I think we can safety assume he will also be moving from the area.
Everyone wants a cop's benefits until it's time to do real cop work.
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Old Feb 23rd 2018, 12:39 pm
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Default Re: Florida shooting

Originally Posted by anotherlimey
Yes, that's also what his boss expected him to do. He's also paid to do it. Hence the SRO resigned.

A coach, and a few students, died jumping in front of other students. The one guy with the means to end it stayed outside.

IIRC the standard response to an active shooter changed in recent years from wait for backup to engage as soon as possible. They had a 60 minutes piece on it last year.
I wonder whether there are grounds for charges against him. His action (or inaction) indirectly caused the deaths of at least some of those kids.

Isn't that the definition of manslaughter?
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Old Feb 23rd 2018, 12:55 pm
  #728  
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Default Re: Florida shooting

Originally Posted by zzrmark
How long before the NRA, asshole 45, et al start to blame the 'good guy with a gun'. Would you be so keen to offer yourself up for target practice? Presumably it is the assumption that an SRO is there to run gung ho, Rambo style, into a fire fight without assessing the situation?
Makes the 'more guns is the answer' point of view look a bit lame, doesn't it?

Yet Trump still pushes his 'guns for teachers' as a sensible solution. It's not sensible, and it's not a solution.
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Old Feb 23rd 2018, 1:00 pm
  #729  
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Default Re: Florida shooting

Originally Posted by chawkins99
I wonder whether there are grounds for charges against him. His action (or inaction) indirectly caused the deaths of at least some of those kids.

Isn't that the definition of manslaughter?
According to an article in the BBC today,

"School resource officers are sworn law enforcement officers who are responsible for safety and crime prevention in schools, although their exact roles differ from school to school and authority to authority.
Employed by the local police or sheriff's office, they document incidents and can make arrests, as well as working on areas such as mentoring and education."

So do we actually know that he was trained up in SWAT style activities? A high proportion of police officers I've seen don't look like they could run - either towards or away from a shooter ...
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Old Feb 23rd 2018, 1:06 pm
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Default Re: Florida shooting

Originally Posted by chawkins99
I wonder whether there are grounds for charges against him. His action (or inaction) indirectly caused the deaths of at least some of those kids.

Isn't that the definition of manslaughter?
Pretty sure he can not be prosecuted for Cowardice.

If he was in the Armed Forces, yes.
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Old Feb 23rd 2018, 1:18 pm
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Default Re: Florida shooting

Originally Posted by Octang Frye
Let's see what we have so far from the antis:

[x] Name calling, ridiculing, ad hominem attacks.
[x] NRA is some evil money making organization, not a popular organization of 5 million individuals
[x] Allusion to penis size/compensation.
[x] Demands to compromise/common sense/reasonableness. What are you compromising with? How about national reciprocity.
[x] Appeals to emotion.
Well thanks for pretty much demonstrating I wasted my time the other day attempting to talk to you rationally about anything. Thought we were making headway, then I take one day off and it all goes to shit.
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Old Feb 23rd 2018, 1:30 pm
  #732  
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Default Re: Florida shooting

Originally Posted by anotherlimey
Well this went downhill fast.

I think RW's account must have been hijacked. This isn't his normal behavior.

I hear there was a school cop outside when the shooting started, but he didn't confront the shooter. That really makes me sick.
Sorry if the truth offends you.

If it isn't obvious by now that Trump is a bigot leading a party of bigots, then I'm not sure what it's going to take. Do they have to fire up the ovens before we are allowed to complain about it?

As for the security guy, he is there to be a deterrent, not to make his wife into a widow. A cop in such a circumstance would call for backup.
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Old Feb 23rd 2018, 1:41 pm
  #733  
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Default Re: Florida shooting

Originally Posted by RoadWarriorFromLP
As for the security guy, he is there to be a deterrent, not to make his wife into a widow. A cop in such a circumstance would call for backup.
I think it was an SRO, which is an actual policeman and not just a security guard. He would be armed, but I think I read he was in another part of the school and couldn't get there fast enough or something. I'm not going to go searching for it now though because it doesn't matter since 17 kids died, so semantics won't help a bit.

Anyway, the fact that there was an armed, trained police office on site and he was effectively powerless against the shooter should make it pretty clear that throwing more guns at the problem, and putting them in the hands of untrained civilians who also happen to be underpaid, overstressed teachers and expect them to potentially point their gun at a child and put two in the chest and one in the head is just pure lunacy. That's before you even get to the fact that even trained marksmen are not 100% accurate with a pistol.
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Old Feb 23rd 2018, 2:01 pm
  #734  
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Default Re: Florida shooting

There was an armed police officer (off duty) working at the Pulse nightclub. He did engage with the shooter and he had to withdraw and wait for backup because he was so drastically outgunned.

I don't understand how we can expect the police to rely less on military grade weapons (as expressed earlier in the thread) when clearly it takes more than a "good guy with a gun" to stop a bad guy with a gun ... It takes a SWAT team with a bearcat.
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Old Feb 23rd 2018, 2:06 pm
  #735  
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Default Re: Florida shooting

Based on LaPierre's unhinged rhetoric yesterday, the only thing I can surmise is that the NRA must be heartbroken that Obama is gone. For 8 years they had him as their boogeyman and gun sales went through the roof. Having somebody like Trump in office must be so scary for them.
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