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Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

Old May 2nd 2014, 9:39 pm
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Default Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

I know lots of people have Amex here, for those with the Delta Amex, they are upgrading to the EMV chips... Not quite the same as chip and pin because you still have to sign but it can be used more easily in chip and pin machines (so I read online). I just called and requested a new card. Also Delta amex dropped international fees starting yesterday.

For those of you with target cards I heard the other day, that after the security issues around Christmas, Target will be switching their cards to chip and pin.
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Old May 4th 2014, 4:11 am
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Default Re: Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

Originally Posted by Ash UK/US View Post
I know lots of people have Amex here, for those with the Delta Amex, they are upgrading to the EMV chips... Not quite the same as chip and pin because you still have to sign but it can be used more easily in chip and pin machines (so I read online). I just called and requested a new card. Also Delta amex dropped international fees starting yesterday.

For those of you with target cards I heard the other day, that after the security issues around Christmas, Target will be switching their cards to chip and pin.
Not only that, but my wife went into Walmart yesterday where she tried to use our UK business card for a couple of things -- we have done many hundreds of times since being here with no problem and no pin number required -- and it was refused because they installed a new software that morning (she was told by the staff that it's now Walmart-wide) which if the card has a chip in it, you have now to input the pin. Needless to say, as we've not had to use it in ten years, she didn't remember it. Have dug it out now, and it works fine.
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Old May 4th 2014, 11:25 am
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Default Re: Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

My new Delta Amex arrived yesterday morning, and didn't include any chip - looks like I'll be requested a new one in a few months.
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Old May 4th 2014, 7:58 pm
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Default Re: Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

Interesting that they mailed one so close to the release date but did not include the chip.... I just requested mine Friday.
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Old May 6th 2014, 5:16 pm
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Default Re: Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

Originally Posted by civilservant View Post
My new Delta Amex arrived yesterday morning, and didn't include any chip - looks like I'll be requested a new one in a few months.
I called on Friday to request mine... It arrived yesterday, chip included.
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Old May 6th 2014, 9:03 pm
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Default Re: Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

Originally Posted by paul32x View Post
Not only that, but my wife went into Walmart yesterday where she tried to use our UK business card for a couple of things -- we have done many hundreds of times since being here with no problem and no pin number required -- and it was refused because they installed a new software that morning (she was told by the staff that it's now Walmart-wide) which if the card has a chip in it, you have now to input the pin. Needless to say, as we've not had to use it in ten years, she didn't remember it. Have dug it out now, and it works fine.
I have a chip and signature Chase Sapphire credit card, and last time I was in Walmart yes, it wanted me to use the chip and push it in the bottom of the reader rather than swiping, but no, it didn't need a pin, just the usual scrawled e-sig. Which is lucky, because I haven't got a pin for it.

So perhaps the machines are quite clever, and differentiate between the US bodge of chip and sig cards, and the overseas ones with pins.
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Old May 10th 2014, 8:47 am
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Default Re: Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

Originally Posted by kodokan View Post
I have a chip and signature Chase Sapphire credit card, and last time I was in Walmart yes, it wanted me to use the chip and push it in the bottom of the reader rather than swiping, but no, it didn't need a pin, just the usual scrawled e-sig. Which is lucky, because I haven't got a pin for it.

So perhaps the machines are quite clever, and differentiate between the US bodge of chip and sig cards, and the overseas ones with pins.
Most chip cards have a list of preferred cardholder verification methods and it goes down the list until there is one the terminal supports. The big exception to this is US-issued AmEx which have no list so they fallback to the service code verification method which is signature. I'm not quite sure why AmEx does this and I know it caused problems overseas at first but I've heard those are mostly resolved.

Also, Walmart skips cardholder verification (at least signature, not sure about if they skip PIN) for small-value transactions the networks allow verification to be skipped on.
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Old May 10th 2014, 2:46 pm
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Default Re: Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

Originally Posted by Markie View Post
..... Walmart skips cardholder verification (at least signature, not sure about if they skip PIN) for small-value transactions the networks allow verification to be skipped on.
Not just Walmart, also Lowes, Home Depot, and most fast food restaurants AFAIK, and presumably a lot of other stores, but as discussed on another active thread, I don't shop at many brick-and-mortar stores.
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Old May 11th 2014, 5:01 am
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Default Re: Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

Originally Posted by kodokan View Post
I have a chip and signature Chase Sapphire credit card, and last time I was in Walmart yes, it wanted me to use the chip and push it in the bottom of the reader rather than swiping, but no, it didn't need a pin, just the usual scrawled e-sig. Which is lucky, because I haven't got a pin for it.

So perhaps the machines are quite clever, and differentiate between the US bodge of chip and sig cards, and the overseas ones with pins.
Do NOT use chip and pin with the Sapphire card. They will give you a PIN number if you ask, but if you use chip and pin it counts as a cash transaction and interest at about 19% starts from the time of the transaction. There is no free credit period. Chase told me this when I asked for the pin for my card.
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Old May 11th 2014, 10:47 am
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Default Re: Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

Originally Posted by lansbury View Post
Do NOT use chip and pin with the Sapphire card. They will give you a PIN number if you ask, but if you use chip and pin it counts as a cash transaction and interest at about 19% starts from the time of the transaction. There is no free credit period. Chase told me this when I asked for the pin for my card.
I'd read that Chase was going to issue a chip & PIN version of the Sapphire card sometime in 2014 but hadn't seen that this had happened yet. The current card is of the chip & signature variety. You would never be asked for a PIN during a normal purchase transaction in the US using one as far as I understand. Signature only. The only time you'd use a PIN would be in an ATM to get cash.

I can confirm though that when using US-issued EMV cards in Europe with the PIN transactions are not treated as cash advances. Including Chase Sapphire.

Has the Sapphire chip & PIN card come out already or was the Chase CSR mixed up about something?
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Old May 11th 2014, 11:55 am
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Default Re: Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

Originally Posted by lansbury View Post
Do NOT use chip and pin with the Sapphire card. They will give you a PIN number if you ask, but if you use chip and pin it counts as a cash transaction and interest at about 19% starts from the time of the transaction. There is no free credit period. Chase told me this when I asked for the pin for my card.
Thankfully, this is 99% nonsense. Listen closely - they didn't say "will" - they said "may."

The Chase Sapphire Preferred does NOT officially support PIN for purchases - that is, PIN is only in the CVM list for unattended cash. Thus, if everything is configured correctly on the terminal end, the PIN will ONLY be requested for cash point transactions, thus the assumption is anything where the PIN is requested is coded as a cash transaction.

In reality, on other forums people HAVE been asked for their PIN and it still was coded properly as a purchase.

Bank of America takes this a step further, their cards actually DO HAVE PIN in the CVM list for purchases, it works at unattended ticket kiosks demanding a PIN, etc, but they STILL issue the same warning not to use the PIN in case it gets coded as a cash transaction.

While I can make no guarantees, the reality is that I've never, once, heard of a merchandise transaction getting incorrectly coded as a cash transaction on a Visa card.

Chase, is, however correctly stating how the card is set up to work - a PIN will only, in theory, be requested for cash. IF THE TERMINAL HONOURS THE CVM LIST PROPERLY. It is many times more likely for the terminal to be incorrectly doing online PIN when not in the CVM list than it is for it to be incorrectly coding purchases as cash (I mean, can you imagine how angry all their customers would be if all their purchases were billed as cash advances? Such a bug wouldn't just affect US cardholders, it would affect ANYONE using that terminal).

Bank of America, however, just has a massive miscommunication issue between their tech people and their customer service people. The card is configured to use the PIN for purchases if signature isn't possible, but customer service tells people the PIN will only be used for cash and warns them not to use it, incorrectly!
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Old May 23rd 2014, 8:14 am
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Default Re: Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

Am I the only one having major issues with my Delta Gold Amex at Walmart? Not sure what'll happen when I'm back in the UK in 3 weeks and 5 days...

It works fine with the Ingenico terminals used in self-checkout. However, at the Verifone terminals used in the regular lanes it fails probably 2/3 of the time. It just says "remove card" early before reading and says something about a card read error.

I had Amex replace the card, but the replacement behaves the same. Other chip cards work fine.
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Old May 23rd 2014, 1:11 pm
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Default Re: Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

Just got this from AmEx today:

American Express is committed to protecting our Card Members. As part of our continued dedication to enhance the security of our products and services, we are excited to issue you a new Card with chip & signature technology that has additional features to protect you when used at participating retailers. You will receive your replacement Card for your account ending in <<snip>> within the next several days.

When your new Card arrives, please activate it by using the Amex mobile app, visiting americanexpress.com/activate or calling the number on the sticker on the front of the Card. You may continue to use your existing Card until your new Card is activated. For your convenience, your account number will remain the same, but please be aware that the four-digit security code on the front of your new Card will be updated.

Especially in today's environment, we understand that personal security is paramount. One of the many benefits you receive as a Card Member is our Fraud Protection Guarantee, which means you won't be held responsible for any fraudulent charges when you use your American Express Card.

If you have questions about your new Card with chip & signature technology, please see the Frequently Asked Questions available at americanexpress.com/chipandsignature.

Thank you for your continued Membership and we hope you enjoy your new chip & signature enabled Card.

Sincerely,

American Express Customer Care

Last edited by Sue; May 23rd 2014 at 6:58 pm. Reason: number removed
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Old May 23rd 2014, 10:07 pm
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Default Re: Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

Thank you Sue
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Old May 28th 2014, 3:24 am
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Default Re: Delta Amex and EMV chips... Target too.

Citibank issued me with a chip and pin card August last year, when I asked about the pin they gave me the cash advance pin.

According to citibank if used in an ATM it will be a cash advance, if used at a point of sale terminal it will be a normal credit transaction, alas I have not been out of the country yet to test it.
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