Steerpike

So I find myself this week on a business trip in southern New Jersey, just across the river from Philadelphia - not exactly the 'bible belt' (at least, I didn't think so). I go out for dinner Saturday night in a beautiful little town I passed through during the day called 'Haddonfield' - classic 'main street', beautiful shops and homes, several cute restaurants.

I sit down for dinner and first order a beer. "Sorry, we don't sell beer" I heard from the waiter ... dumbfounded, I leave the place, heading for the next restaurant a few doors away (I was THIRSTY!). On entering the next restaurant, I ask ... 'do you sell beer?' ... "sorry sir, this is a dry town" was the reply. "you can bring your own wine". SHOOT - I'd worked all day Saturday until 8pm, and time was running out to find a place to eat. I decided to head back to the town where my hotel was - Cherry Hill, NJ. I knew it was not 'Dry' because I'd had dinner and a beer on my first day there, at some drinking hole/sports bar/burger doodle place called "PJ SomethingOrOther".

So I find this awesome looking Italian restaurant in Cherry Hill, and head inside. I first ask ... again ... "do you sell beer"? "Sorry, we don't have a liquor license, they are too expensive. You can bring your own wine, though ...". ARGHHHhhhhh !!!!

I ended up eating a mediocre steak at the very same "PJ SomethingOrOther" bar / restaurant that I'd dined at on arrival a few days ago ...

I did some research on google after this. Seems like liquor licenses are more valuable than gold in NJ - one sold recently in Cherry Hill for $500k, and some sell for over $1m. No person or corporation can own more than 2 liquor licenses in the state.

On my first day here, I went to the local grocery store to pick up a 6-pack so I could have a beer in my room. No beer (or alcohol of any kind) sold. Must go to a dedicated 'liquor store' ... which close at 11pm (I arrived 11:30pm ...) ... so again, in order to have a beer, I had to go to a late night bar, which was not my preference - and could not drink more than one beer since I had to drive.

To me, this is all backwards. I watched people in this late night bar - they were all knocking back masses of alcohol, and the parking lot was packed - so these people are all driving way over the limit ... but I could not easily pick up a 6-pack to take home to the comfort of my hotel room. Very strange!

In California, every grocery store sells alcohol till 2am or so ... doesn't seem to cause any problems ...

Ironically, I never drink more than 2 beers these days, so it's not like I'm an alcoholic ... but I do enjoy a cold one ...

edwords

That's why I moved from Mt. Laurel, New Jersey, to Gilbert, Arizona.
Well, also the better weather, lower taxes, friendlier people, nicer scenery, saner gun laws, lower insurance costs and several dozen other things.
On the other hand, I did like the Ritz movie theatre in Voorhees. Didn't seem like reason enough to stay, though.

Patrick Hasler

Plain stupid ain't it !

My first experience of this was in a Pizza hut near Clifton Park NY, I ordered the meal and a bottle of Bud.
"We don't sell beer sir"
"Go on .... your having me on aint' you" I replied.
"No ..... the local church doesn't want us to"
"Then the local church can come and pay for the pizza" .. got up and left.

A small town called Argyle near here is dry but seems to have the biggest percentage of drunks
Buisinesses that are nationwide have avoided coming to the place because they can't sell beer etc ......... These backward minded, dictator town councils can't see how much they are loosing in potential revenue.

Octang Frye

I've been out there on business too. Tried to buy beer in a liquor store and had to go and buy it from a restaurant.

But, let me say - these restrictions seem sensible. I can understand you wanting to enjoy a beer, but why do you need to own six? I think reasonable restrictions should apply, in that you can only purchase one beer a month. And there should be a waiting period.

It's just common sense. No-one needs six beers, or a bottle of wine. After all, alcohol is a poison and causes untold misery and suffering. It alters one's judgment and makes people bellicose and belligerent. How many people have died due to alcohol abuse or through accidents? How many thousands have to die each year? How many kids have access to alcohol vessels left unsecured around the house? There should be bottle locks. Wont someone think of the children?!

I think the East Coast liquor laws need strengthening. I propose a registration and licensing system for all alcoholic beverages sold, with heavy penalties for those who flout the laws. Society has to take a stand. This isn't 1776, and it's ridiculous to think we should embrace the values of degenerates like Sam Adams. This is 2008, for goodness sake!

There needs to be mandatory training in alcohol use and it's only reasonable that people should be vetted by the police and mental health professionals before being granted a license to purchase and imbibe alcohol. Besides, alcohol consumption is not an individual right. Only well regulated state organizations should be permitted to own and use alcohol.

I know we don't see eye to eye on this issue, but if you disagree, you're compensating for small genitalia. You may also be a hick alcoholic. So, in conclusion, I demand mandatory alcoholic beverage licensing and registration. After all, if you have done nothing wrong, you have nothing to hide.

Octang Frye

You know, if Steerpike and you storm out of restaurants because you can't purchase beer, then perhaps neither of you have the temperament to purchase and safely use alcohol in the first place.

/ Just saying.

Octang Frye

Steerpike, I'm not being facetious here. Alcohol is an archaic thing which has no place in modern society. Beer was useful because it could be stored for long periods without it spoiling; ideal for naval expeditions.
It was used in warfare as a way to galvanize the resolve of warriors. Times have changed. We have refrigeration these days.

Your support of this immoral industry renders me speechless. How many more spouses have to be beaten? How many more virgins will be debased because of your enabling stance? How many more kids will suffer through awkward breakfasts because daddy just hit mummy?

Shame on you, sir. Shame.

pejpm1

I bet when you read this back to yourself it seemed really clever and witty...

robin1234

I think when you live in a state with restrictive laws as described above, you can easily adapt to them with no inconvenience. I accept it can be frustrating to someone who is travelling, arrives late, doesn't know the dry towns etc. as described by Steerpike.

In Massachusetts we lived in a dry town. It was no inconvenience to us as our supermarket was in the next town, where they sold beer and wine. Now we live in New York, and are used to the concept of buying wine in a State Liquor Store and beer in a beer store. The only really bad aspect is that wine in NYS costs almost twice what it costs in New Hampshire. (My standard French table wine is $11.99 for 1.5 litres in NYS, and $5.99 in New Hampshire!!)

Duncan Roberts

Good thing you didn't go over the river to PA!

jumping doris

Tell me about it!!!!

The first time I went to the supermarket here I thought I was going mad, searching fruitlessly for the wine aisle. Didn't help that it was Sunday and so when I realised I had to go to a special shop, they were all closed.
Then when we went to the wine shop we found out it didn't sell beer...that's another shop and nowhere near the wine shop.

We also have to buy beer by the case unless you get it from a bar/restaurant. Then you can buy a six pack with a second mortgage.

We have got used to it but I don't like the lack of choice in the wine store. Beer choice is fairly limited too...no not fairly..very limited.

cindyabs

I almost dropped my teeth that a special election a few weeks back has allowed restaurants in my town TO SELL BOOZE ON SUNDAYS!!!!!!!!!! Gasp!!
It was not without opposition mind you, one of the Baptist ministers was very vocal against it, but it would seem that either there are less Baptists in town than I thought (unlikely) or it is not generally seen as invoking heavenly wrath to have a beer on Sunday while watching the game at the sports bar/restaurant.

Folinskyinla

Hi:

Welcome to America! In the 19th and early 20th Century there was a strong "temperance" movement in the US which culminated in the 18th Amendment instituting nationwide "Prohibition" of alcohol. This was repealed by the 21st Amendment in 1933. However, "local option" was retained. In other words, the local states can do pretty much anything they damn well please [within certain restrictions regarding interstate commerece].

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prohibi..._United_States

Folinskyinla

Hi:

I was in Philadelphia last August and noted that the West Coast institution known as "Trader Joe's" was operating quite well in Philly. I dropped by to pick some of their sandwiches for my flight back to LA. Out of curiosity I wanted to see how much they charged for the in-house brand Charles Shaw which is affectionately called "Two Buck Chuck" here. They did not have any beer and wine -- due to Pennsylvania law!

jumping doris

I keep on hearing about the wine in Trader Joe's and of course, our's doesn't sell it.:curse:

We do have one independent wine merchant in Pittsburgh but I think they can only sell by the case. Then we have the PA wineries but I have this feeling the wine would taste like vinegar.

robin1234

In my opinion, that is the worst aspect of the antediluvian laws in states like New York and (apparently) PA. Because of lack of competition the choice of wine is lacklustre. I was just in England for a week, and there is only so much you can drink in one week -- especially if you're trying to do some vigorous tourism & visiting during the day, But I enjoyed just looking at the range of French wine in Sainsburys-- priced from 3 pounds to hundreds per bottle. here in NYS, I see the same overpriced, tired wines from two or three negociants. Especially George DuBoeuf. I suspect you could buy a better range of quality wine in East Germany in 1955 than you can here.