2020 Election

Old Jul 23rd 2020, 1:08 am
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Default Re: 2020 Election

The writing is on the Wall and you can see all the signs of defeat coming from the Trump Administration because their actions point to their thinking and the coming story. And we've seen this story in many war movies involving great battles. When retreating Armies have been defeated on the battlefield in Wars, and the last huge fight has been lost from one particular side, the commanders for the losing forces understand they have lost all hope of winning, and at that time that is when you start to see desperate moves taken place in the last stretches in battle. You start to see that once securely captured land exited, by that slumping defeat mess of an Army, but not before those troops burn every building on their way out the door.

Those irrational decisions are being made by Trump in the form of sending goons to States ran by Democrats to attack none violent protesters that have a Constitutional right to protest. These goons are dressed in Uniforms that Troops wear in our Military to represent our country and every person in our nation. But these goons dressed in camouflage are not actual soldiers. These are a bunch of misfits from Ice and other immigration Units that have been empowered to illegally attack American citizens. And based on what Trump said today he plans to invade other cities and States governed by Democrats in the coming weeks.

And as third world, and unprecedented it is for an American President to send paramilitary units out to various regions of the country to attack and do physical harm to innocent Americans as a political move, it also tells everyone that the Trump Regime know they are finished! This desperate move to try and manufacture unrest in America where there is none, in order to give himself an excuse to send in Paramilitary units, is nothing but a last breath attempt to play the old Nixon ploy of trying to scare the day lights out of older voters. This is how you can tell that even Trump knows he can not win based on how voters feel about him. He has to come up with something drastic. So he is trying out the old Nixon play because he has burnt every bridge leading to goodwill he once had. And very soon you are going to see many Republican Senators and Congressman point the finger of blame to each other, for supporting their sociopathic leader.

In many States early voting starts in mid September. And one thing I agree with Trump on, it's so close and easily accessed it must be illegal.
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Old Jul 23rd 2020, 2:35 am
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Default Re: 2020 Election

Originally Posted by BritInParis View Post
No, it’s because COVID-19 is a disease that primarily affects the elderly. Unless your child has an underlying health condition or has an at risk primary caregiver at home then there’s no good reason not for them to go to school.

What does "affect" mean in this context? Your graph only showed hospitalization rates by age. Do you have data for the asymptomatic infection rate in children? Or data on the transmission rate (likelihood in percentages) from asymptomatic children to (1) other children (2) adults.
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Old Jul 23rd 2020, 3:39 am
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Default Re: 2020 Election

Originally Posted by civilservant View Post
I thought he actually came dangerously close to sounding Presidential for the first time in his entire term

No doubt he'll be back to riffing on Biden/Russia/Muller/Mail in voting by the end of the week.
I have to agree; since I want to see him gone with all my heart, I was somewhat disappointed to see him behave 'normally'. I feel selfish in saying that, because the country desperately needs an adult in the room, but at this point I'd almost rather see him fail more spectacularly just so he has no chance of getting re-elected. If he keeps this up, seriously, he could really turn things around. All he has to do, in reality, is behave normally, listen to the experts, and if the numbers (C-19 cases, deaths) go down steadily from now till election day, he could somehow claim to be the savior. People have very short memories ...

And as much as people on this forum decry the use of federal troops to squash protests, I'm not sure how big a deal that is with the country as a whole. No one wants to see destruction in the streets and I am, quite frankly, amazed that this is still going on. It plays 100% into Trump's 'Law and Order' message. I mean ... even if it's only 'graffiti' - what are these protesters protesting at this point? What does defacing a federal building have to do with racial justice and police reform? Biden should be speaking out loud and clear that this behavior isn't doing anyone any favors.
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Old Jul 23rd 2020, 3:51 am
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Default Re: 2020 Election

Originally Posted by BritInParis View Post
No, it’s because COVID-19 is a disease that primarily affects the elderly. Unless your child has an underlying health condition or has an at risk primary caregiver at home then there’s no good reason not for them to go to school.


Originally Posted by Leslie View Post
What does "affect" mean in this context? Your graph only showed hospitalization rates by age. Do you have data for the asymptomatic infection rate in children? Or data on the transmission rate (likelihood in percentages) from asymptomatic children to (1) other children (2) adults.
This is an interesting discussion, and goes to the crux of the 'school' debate. BIP's point is, I think, fairly reasonable in that, I think everyone can agree that children are unlikely to suffer significantly from the virus, and if they were to return to school, we wouldn't be seeing children's bodies piling up in body bags. But Leslie's point is that, just because children don't 'suffer', they are still highly likely to be transmission vectors, whether due to fully asymptomatic spread or due to 'only mild symptoms'. In either case, if children are 'carriers' and 'spreaders', then we have to worry about their ability to continue the growth of the virus (through parents and teachers).

My own niece, who has two young kids (4 and 6) is extremely eager to see them both back in school, and in fact they both returned last week (UK). In her view, the social damage done by home isolation outweighs her concerns about the spread of the disease - rightly or wrongly.
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Old Jul 23rd 2020, 4:17 am
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Default Re: 2020 Election

This is how I see school reopening.

Vast sweeping statements from on high are useless on this land mass. We need federal guidelines, continuity and support. If we're not going to get that then Trump needs to out of the way. Americans are actually very good at this sort of thing. Nobody wants to keep the schools closed. Trump checked-out long ago and heaved the whole corona thingy onto the states --- but on this one thing (schools) he's going to bark orders and threaten to take away our tax dollars? Taxes we all paid for our schools.

These are my opinions (refraining from making declaration of fact retrieved from nowhere) . . .

Reopen schools, in areas with low infection rates, using vigilant protocols. (We should go into "protocols" because it matters but it would make this post TLDR). Schools that reopen must be ready to immediately shut down or scale back if numbers spike.

Staff who want to reopen, speaking of the outbreak/surging areas, should avail themselves to the school district. I believe there are ways to be innovative but those who want to go back to school are going to have to realize, it might not be like what they think. School staff who do not feel safe for ANY reason should not be compelled to return.

But don't believe the hype about kids not being affected . . . this is what's happening around here. This is really happening:

https://www.star-telegram.com/news/c...244417462.html

https://www.texastribune.org/2020/07...-cases-rising/

https://www.texastribune.org/2020/07...nueces-county/

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/06/healt...ies/index.html

Last edited by Leslie; Jul 23rd 2020 at 4:22 am.
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Old Jul 23rd 2020, 4:24 am
  #3531  
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Default Re: 2020 Election

Email today from the school district that I work for ,that the plan is to return completely remotely this Fall. A change in plan from a blended approach of some days in some out, that had been the hope since this all started.
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Old Jul 23rd 2020, 8:04 am
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Default Re: 2020 Election

Originally Posted by Leslie View Post
This is how I see school reopening.

Vast sweeping statements from on high are useless on this land mass. We need federal guidelines, continuity and support. If we're not going to get that then Trump needs to out of the way. Americans are actually very good at this sort of thing. Nobody wants to keep the schools closed. Trump checked-out long ago and heaved the whole corona thingy onto the states --- but on this one thing (schools) he's going to bark orders and threaten to take away our tax dollars? Taxes we all paid for our schools.

These are my opinions (refraining from making declaration of fact retrieved from nowhere) . . .

Reopen schools, in areas with low infection rates, using vigilant protocols. (We should go into "protocols" because it matters but it would make this post TLDR). Schools that reopen must be ready to immediately shut down or scale back if numbers spike.

Staff who want to reopen, speaking of the outbreak/surging areas, should avail themselves to the school district. I believe there are ways to be innovative but those who want to go back to school are going to have to realize, it might not be like what they think. School staff who do not feel safe for ANY reason should not be compelled to return.

But don't believe the hype about kids not being affected . . . this is what's happening around here. This is really happening:

https://www.star-telegram.com/news/c...244417462.html

https://www.texastribune.org/2020/07...-cases-rising/

https://www.texastribune.org/2020/07...nueces-county/

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/06/healt...ies/index.html
That first article above is just utterly disgraceful. I didn't realize such gatherings were even remotely possible at this time. The reluctance of the church group to actively notify parents is awful. Update - I found this article on Business Insider just now; I think it's the same summer camp ... https://www.businessinsider.com/covi...ok-like-2020-7

The other articles, though, all seem to simply confirm that children can catch, and spread, the virus, which I don't think is in much dispute. If the issue were a simple trade-off between kids being in school vs catching the virus, there'd be no contest - the need for in-person schooling would outweigh the limited danger to the children themselves. But the clear evidence that the kids are just as infectious as everyone else, and therefore likely to spread to other kids and their parents/families/friends/community, that's the big issue in my mind.

Last edited by Steerpike; Jul 23rd 2020 at 8:36 am.
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Old Jul 23rd 2020, 12:33 pm
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Default Re: 2020 Election

Originally Posted by Leslie View Post
Staff who want to reopen, speaking of the outbreak/surging areas, should avail themselves to the school district. I believe there are ways to be innovative but those who want to go back to school are going to have to realize, it might not be like what they think. School staff who do not feel safe for ANY reason should not be compelled to return.
We're in a Florida hotspot, our county has said that parents can choose their child's method of being taught, that automatically removes the choice offered to teachers as many parents rely on their child being in school so that they don't need to pay for care. Teachers here are reluctant to return to the schools, some are calling for pushing back start dates without realizing that the county will be offloading staff in greater numbers the longer schools stay shut - this in addition to the teachers that were cut over the summer vacation when Florida upped it's class size maximum by 3 kids per class.
A school custodian (caretaker) in the county died this week, yesterday a high school sports coach in his 50's in neighbouring Sarasota county passed and also yesterday the local news station reported on a funeral for a Pasco county teacher in her 50's, all Covid related deaths. The teaching community around here is already losing staff and this before we send them back into the places that are ideal breeding grounds for all varieties of nasties.
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Old Jul 23rd 2020, 3:05 pm
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Default Re: 2020 Election

Originally Posted by Steerpike View Post
And as much as people on this forum decry the use of federal troops to squash protests, I'm not sure how big a deal that is with the country as a whole.
I think the real concern is that the deployment of federal law enforcement to typically democrat cities is a precursor to voter intimidation.

It's not hard to see these troops who are completely unaccountable being deployed on election day to over-subscribed urban polling stations in democrat areas under the pretense of "crowd control"
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Old Jul 23rd 2020, 3:37 pm
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Default Re: 2020 Election

Originally Posted by GeneralPowerpoint View Post
I think the real concern is that the deployment of federal law enforcement to typically democrat cities is a precursor to voter intimidation.

It's not hard to see these troops who are completely unaccountable being deployed on election day to over-subscribed urban polling stations in democrat areas under the pretense of "crowd control"
When you have had the local politicians abdicate their responsibility what do you do?
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Old Jul 23rd 2020, 4:07 pm
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Default Re: 2020 Election

Originally Posted by Boiler View Post
When you have had the local politicians abdicate their responsibility what do you do?
As far as I can see local politicians do take responsibility for their locality and would rather anonymous federal troops were not abducting citizens into unmarked vans.
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Old Jul 23rd 2020, 4:32 pm
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Default Re: 2020 Election

Trump gassed our locally elected officials last night. That is probably unprecedented in American peacetime history. I guess we just wait and see what comes our of the legislative arm.
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Old Jul 23rd 2020, 4:34 pm
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Default Re: 2020 Election

Originally Posted by Boiler View Post
When you have had the local politicians abdicate their responsibility what do you do?
If Trump were truly interested in “law and order” he’d be trying to stem the flow of illegal weapons into big cities from neighboring states, especially into Chicago. Of course his interest is actually on stunts that he thinks will help his re-election.
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Old Jul 23rd 2020, 4:38 pm
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Default Re: 2020 Election

Originally Posted by mrken30 View Post
Trump gassed our locally elected officials last night. That is probably unprecedented in American peacetime history. I guess we just wait and see what comes our of the legislative arm.
Oh come on. Look, I can't stand the guy, but can we assign some personally responsibility to the person that actually pulls the trigger?

'I was just following orders' didn't even work for the Nazis at Nuremberg.
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Old Jul 23rd 2020, 5:07 pm
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Default Re: 2020 Election

It's all a distraction from this:

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