2020 Election
#3691
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Nov 2011
Location: Somewhere between Vancouver & St Johns
Posts: 19,840
Re: 2020 Election
You cant really blame the police per se but yes you can hold individual officers accountable for their actions. For as long as I can remember since 1984 when I joined the ordinary street copper in the UK has been telling anyone who would listen that they were not trained or equipped to deal with mental health issues which is a big part of their daily call outs which we have now seen turn into multiple deaths. Ever tried getting a mental health specialist to attend a scene after 5pm and before 9am.
Although their job is to protect and serve as many do admirably when you give them guns to carry on a daily basis and they attend a scene which goes sideways especially where the person has a knife then don't be surprised if the officer reacts where he believes his life or others are in danger.
#3692
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,900
Re: 2020 Election
I don't know who in the Trump campaign had the brilliant idea for Trump to start up his defunct press briefings but I just want to say thank you.
It was mentioned in that presser today that Trump admires a doctor who apparently has given a medical opinion involving "Demon Sperm".
Makes me wonder if Obama's people who are quite ruthless and brilliant may have infiltrated Trump's campaign strategist team.
I will be watching tomorrow with popcorn
Oh, btw, when the reporter kept asking about that favorite Doctor of Trump he suddenly ran out the room lol.
It was mentioned in that presser today that Trump admires a doctor who apparently has given a medical opinion involving "Demon Sperm".
Makes me wonder if Obama's people who are quite ruthless and brilliant may have infiltrated Trump's campaign strategist team.
I will be watching tomorrow with popcorn
Oh, btw, when the reporter kept asking about that favorite Doctor of Trump he suddenly ran out the room lol.
#3693
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,900
Re: 2020 Election
"Reform," "training" and "improvement" requires a lot more resources and a lot more staffing. So, more police! That's why they don't want that.
#3694
Banned
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 97
Re: 2020 Election
No politician is going to run on defunding the military or the police, so politicaly it's a bad slogan (that goes without saying) that is why it's not the official position of too many politicians...Just the protesters- Merely banning choke holds is good, but it doesn't change the culture in many police departments..
#3695
Banned
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 614
Re: 2020 Election
Because that will cost lots of money and the object is to defund them
You cant really blame the police per se but yes you can hold individual officers accountable for their actions. For as long as I can remember since 1984 when I joined the ordinary street copper in the UK has been telling anyone who would listen that they were not trained or equipped to deal with mental health issues which is a big part of their daily call outs which we have now seen turn into multiple deaths. Ever tried getting a mental health specialist to attend a scene after 5pm and before 9am.
Although their job is to protect and serve as many do admirably when you give them guns to carry on a daily basis and they attend a scene which goes sideways especially where the person has a knife then don't be surprised if the officer reacts where he believes his life or others are in danger.
You cant really blame the police per se but yes you can hold individual officers accountable for their actions. For as long as I can remember since 1984 when I joined the ordinary street copper in the UK has been telling anyone who would listen that they were not trained or equipped to deal with mental health issues which is a big part of their daily call outs which we have now seen turn into multiple deaths. Ever tried getting a mental health specialist to attend a scene after 5pm and before 9am.
Although their job is to protect and serve as many do admirably when you give them guns to carry on a daily basis and they attend a scene which goes sideways especially where the person has a knife then don't be surprised if the officer reacts where he believes his life or others are in danger.
Another problem is in most cities and cases cops at least on patrol duty patrol alone. In New York they don't at least I don't think they do but other cities they do patrol alone. And of course any cops who stands up against bad cops there career is over and maybe even their life because after get they no back up after that none. That needs to change.
The only candidate who would seriously defund the police is Kanye West but he isn't really running is he. He is just all a big noise.
#3696
Banned
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 614
Re: 2020 Election
And in other election news according to CNN. Trump is lauding the advice of a witch doctor who believes vaccines are made using alien DNA with demons raping people in dreams. He will probably make her replacement for Doctor Fauci.
Last edited by andyrebell; Jul 29th 2020 at 5:55 pm.
#3697
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Nov 2011
Location: Somewhere between Vancouver & St Johns
Posts: 19,840
Re: 2020 Election
They are also trained to believe that everyone wants to kill them and if you are a woman cop everyone wants to rape and kill you and they know that if they kill someone it is highly likely nothing will happen to them and no one will seek revenge against them. Baltimore detective newman being the exception and only known case.
Another problem is in most cities and cases cops at least on patrol duty patrol alone. In New York they don't at least I don't think they do but other cities they do patrol alone. And of course any cops who stands up against bad cops there career is over and maybe even their life because after get they no back up after that none. That needs to change.
The only candidate who would seriously defund the police is Kanye West but he isn't really running is he. He is just all a big noise.
Another problem is in most cities and cases cops at least on patrol duty patrol alone. In New York they don't at least I don't think they do but other cities they do patrol alone. And of course any cops who stands up against bad cops there career is over and maybe even their life because after get they no back up after that none. That needs to change.
The only candidate who would seriously defund the police is Kanye West but he isn't really running is he. He is just all a big noise.
So which Police Academies/training Centres have you completed to become a serving officer????? I have and it was located in Bruche just outside Warrington in the UK. I have also attended and completed the CBSA College for the job which I currently do except I don't wear a gun but our employees at the Canada/US border do.
#3698
Re: 2020 Election
I do have some sympathy for cops, especially in the US. If you live in a land where there are enough guns available for evry man woman and child then as a cop approaching someone then you have to assume that he or she may be armed.
The issue becomes serious when you expect people to be armed and react accordingly, especially when race becomes an issue and as a cop you start believing steriotypes.
It's a difficult job and I wouldn't want to do it and you have wonder at the type of person who would.
You get to deal with people who've little and want what's yours, people who don't know what time of day it is, people who see you as a threat, people who hate the thought of you etc etc. It's little wonder that as a policeman you start from the premise that the guy in the car you've just stopped won't be pleased to see you and could be reaching for his weapon.
If I ran the police service I'd be over the moon if some of the jobs my people had to deal with were given to those better equipped to deal with, it'd release them to do what they're more suited for but would I be able to afford it?
The phrase 'Defund the Police' is political It became political the moment it was uttered because it was thought up by morons, by people who didn't realise the consequences of their actions. But we are where we are and it's taken a life on all of its own and it isn't going to go away. It is a gift to the Republicans and they'll milk it for all it's worth.
There's little doubt that some police officers shouldn't wear the uniform but until the service sorts itself out there'll continue to be protests when people are killed because they behaved badly in the eyes of the local cop. Only the police service itself is in a position to police itself, all other avenues result in conflict.
The issue becomes serious when you expect people to be armed and react accordingly, especially when race becomes an issue and as a cop you start believing steriotypes.
It's a difficult job and I wouldn't want to do it and you have wonder at the type of person who would.
You get to deal with people who've little and want what's yours, people who don't know what time of day it is, people who see you as a threat, people who hate the thought of you etc etc. It's little wonder that as a policeman you start from the premise that the guy in the car you've just stopped won't be pleased to see you and could be reaching for his weapon.
If I ran the police service I'd be over the moon if some of the jobs my people had to deal with were given to those better equipped to deal with, it'd release them to do what they're more suited for but would I be able to afford it?
The phrase 'Defund the Police' is political It became political the moment it was uttered because it was thought up by morons, by people who didn't realise the consequences of their actions. But we are where we are and it's taken a life on all of its own and it isn't going to go away. It is a gift to the Republicans and they'll milk it for all it's worth.
There's little doubt that some police officers shouldn't wear the uniform but until the service sorts itself out there'll continue to be protests when people are killed because they behaved badly in the eyes of the local cop. Only the police service itself is in a position to police itself, all other avenues result in conflict.
#3699
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Nov 2011
Location: Somewhere between Vancouver & St Johns
Posts: 19,840
Re: 2020 Election
Oh if only if I was a Chief of Police in a US City in any State and present during an Operational Briefing for an upcoming BLM march in the City I was responsible for. Can you imagine this scenario during the briefing
So Chief how many officers will you be deploying for this march by the BLM?
Same as today which consists of 12 x patrol cars, 6 x officers on foot patrol and the usual compliment of station officers required.
But this a a march where thousands are expected to march to City Hall.
But these are peaceful marches so why do you need additional officers?
But what if there are incidents?
Why would there be incidents? These are peaceful marchers and I have every confidence there will be no incidents.
Will you have officers on standby just in case?
No as officers are on rest days, and some will be taking vacation days.
But what if we need them?
Well I cant provide officers I don't have and who are not scheduled for normal duties. Are you suggesting that I deny these officers their rest days and cancel vacation time?
At what point am I asked to resign
So Chief how many officers will you be deploying for this march by the BLM?
Same as today which consists of 12 x patrol cars, 6 x officers on foot patrol and the usual compliment of station officers required.
But this a a march where thousands are expected to march to City Hall.
But these are peaceful marches so why do you need additional officers?
But what if there are incidents?
Why would there be incidents? These are peaceful marchers and I have every confidence there will be no incidents.
Will you have officers on standby just in case?
No as officers are on rest days, and some will be taking vacation days.
But what if we need them?
Well I cant provide officers I don't have and who are not scheduled for normal duties. Are you suggesting that I deny these officers their rest days and cancel vacation time?
At what point am I asked to resign
#3700
Re: 2020 Election
Trump tried to pin "defund the police" on Biden and was swiftly knocked down on that one.
I think people just want police accountability - an actual independent investigation into every injury and complaint, no investigating themselves, whistleblower protection and anonymity. Despite the months of protests in some places, the police haven't even offered these things (I haven't heard of any department that has, but there probably are some).
People in my area (not my town in particular) call the fire department for various police matters because the police cause more problems than they solve. The fire department is getting increasingly annoyed.
I think people just want police accountability - an actual independent investigation into every injury and complaint, no investigating themselves, whistleblower protection and anonymity. Despite the months of protests in some places, the police haven't even offered these things (I haven't heard of any department that has, but there probably are some).
People in my area (not my town in particular) call the fire department for various police matters because the police cause more problems than they solve. The fire department is getting increasingly annoyed.
#3701
Re: 2020 Election
What a load of absolute BOLLOCKS you come out with at times. They are not trained to believe everyone wants to kill or rape them though they are made aware that a small percentage of people who they deal with could. Depending which police force UK/US/Canadian etc etc officers are held accountable and many in these countries are serving jail time for stuff they have done but I agree some not all do tend to believe they can get away with certain things. I can certainly attest that the Wall Of Silence you refer to has been breached many a time but also accept that it does exist but not to the extent you believe it does.
So which Police Academies/training Centres have you completed to become a serving officer????? I have and it was located in Bruche just outside Warrington in the UK. I have also attended and completed the CBSA College for the job which I currently do except I don't wear a gun but our employees at the Canada/US border do.
So which Police Academies/training Centres have you completed to become a serving officer????? I have and it was located in Bruche just outside Warrington in the UK. I have also attended and completed the CBSA College for the job which I currently do except I don't wear a gun but our employees at the Canada/US border do.
I also had cause to ask four police/sheriffs who were stood beside two patrol cars in a gas station just outside Greenville SC. I walked up to them, addressed them, and blow me, you might have thought they were a patrol in wartorn Baghdad approached by a local wearing a vest bomb. All four of them tensed up as soon as I opened my mouth, for a very brief moment I expected a gun to be unholstered, they too were polite, courteous and helpful but all four of them went from having a loose chat among themselves to being very uneasy.
When I was in the UK I was quite probably dressed down in a tee shirt and sneakers, in the US I seem to recall that I was driving the wife's, at the time, 3 year old Harley themed F150 (which was right behind me as we were gassing up) and I was going out for dinner so would have been wearing a shirt and looking reasonably well dressed so I'd have thought that would have gone in my favour.
I would say that the US reaction was that expected from a military man but in all my time in my twenties knocking about in and around Culdrose, St. Mawgan, Devonport, Lympstone and a few other bases, even when IRA tensions were high, I never came away feeling like I'd been treated as though I were in a warzone.
#3702
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 495
Re: 2020 Election
I have had very little interaction with police on either side of the Atlantic besides asking directions but the reaction to my approach was totally different despite a satisfactory outcome in both cases. I recall asking a pair of English bobbies on their beat in the middle of Exeter City, I walked straight up to them and began a conversation, they were polite, courteous, helpful and totally at ease, hurrah for the British bobby.
I also had cause to ask four police/sheriffs who were stood beside two patrol cars in a gas station just outside Greenville SC. I walked up to them, addressed them, and blow me, you might have thought they were a patrol in wartorn Baghdad approached by a local wearing a vest bomb. All four of them tensed up as soon as I opened my mouth, for a very brief moment I expected a gun to be unholstered, they too were polite, courteous and helpful but all four of them went from having a loose chat among themselves to being very uneasy.
When I was in the UK I was quite probably dressed down in a tee shirt and sneakers, in the US I seem to recall that I was driving the wife's, at the time, 3 year old Harley themed F150 (which was right behind me as we were gassing up) and I was going out for dinner so would have been wearing a shirt and looking reasonably well dressed so I'd have thought that would have gone in my favour.
I would say that the US reaction was that expected from a military man but in all my time in my twenties knocking about in and around Culdrose, St. Mawgan, Devonport, Lympstone and a few other bases, even when IRA tensions were high, I never came away feeling like I'd been treated as though I were in a warzone.
I also had cause to ask four police/sheriffs who were stood beside two patrol cars in a gas station just outside Greenville SC. I walked up to them, addressed them, and blow me, you might have thought they were a patrol in wartorn Baghdad approached by a local wearing a vest bomb. All four of them tensed up as soon as I opened my mouth, for a very brief moment I expected a gun to be unholstered, they too were polite, courteous and helpful but all four of them went from having a loose chat among themselves to being very uneasy.
When I was in the UK I was quite probably dressed down in a tee shirt and sneakers, in the US I seem to recall that I was driving the wife's, at the time, 3 year old Harley themed F150 (which was right behind me as we were gassing up) and I was going out for dinner so would have been wearing a shirt and looking reasonably well dressed so I'd have thought that would have gone in my favour.
I would say that the US reaction was that expected from a military man but in all my time in my twenties knocking about in and around Culdrose, St. Mawgan, Devonport, Lympstone and a few other bases, even when IRA tensions were high, I never came away feeling like I'd been treated as though I were in a warzone.
Someone mentioned a rural police force having a tank earlier. Blows my mind.
#3703
Banned
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 97
Re: 2020 Election
That was me! Its not rural...It's a bedroom community of white professionals. I didn't even have a lock on my front door for 20 years, It broke and I never fixed it..The local crime blog will site things like "kids trample a bush while cutting through a yard on the way to school"..... And they got a F-ing tank
#3704
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 12,852
Re: 2020 Election
Hopefully they'll saturate Maine with this one:
#3705
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 12,852
Re: 2020 Election