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-   -   Why not the GTP? (https://britishexpats.com/forum/teaching-80/why-not-gtp-572907/)

KathC Nov 13th 2008 3:29 pm

Why not the GTP?
 
Does anyone know why Australia won't accept the GTP teaching qualification. My partner and I had pinned our hopes on moving to WA - in our heads we were already there, but have had my assessment form back and they don't recognise the GTP, even though I've been working in a school for over two years. Does anybody know of a way round this? We do have family out in Adelaide, so possibly could get sponsored but don't want to move if I'm not going to be able to work. Is it true that NZ has just started accepting the GTP and do you think Oz may soon follow? We are gutted!!:confused:

Australia_bound? Nov 13th 2008 6:18 pm

Re: Why not the GTP?
 

Originally Posted by KathC (Post 6969694)
Does anyone know why Australia won't accept the GTP teaching qualification. My partner and I had pinned our hopes on moving to WA - in our heads we were already there, but have had my assessment form back and they don't recognise the GTP, even though I've been working in a school for over two years. Does anybody know of a way round this? We do have family out in Adelaide, so possibly could get sponsored but don't want to move if I'm not going to be able to work. Is it true that NZ has just started accepting the GTP and do you think Oz may soon follow? We are gutted!!:confused:

Would suggest you do a search of the threads on here as have been a lot on gtp. Australia has set the standard and that's what is required to get in. Is the same in a lot of other countrys. Why not GTP as is 3 year qualification and the requirement is 4 years.
You'll have to wait 4 years (I think) to be able to move from NZ to Aus, not sure if they accept GTP, hopefully someone will be able to answer this for you. Aus getting plenty of Teachers who fit the requirements so I doubt they'd change their requirements.
As for family sponsoring you are they brothers/sisters/parents and is the balance of family equal or more in Aus than UK?
Think you've got a lot of research to do or would advise you speak to an agent.
Good luck ;)

Briar Nov 17th 2008 10:18 am

Re: Why not the GTP?
 
Hallo - it seems that GTP is not recognised outside of UK, from what I have discovered. Whether NZ or Australia will recognise it in the future is up to pressure from those with GTP perhaps. From what I have investigated about qualifications needed to teach in Australia, perhaps GTP will never be recognised in Australia. Maybe political pressure could change that of course.

roamer25 Nov 17th 2008 3:10 pm

Re: Why not the GTP?
 
Out of interest - what exactly is the GTP? It's not something we have where I teach (Scotland) or where I am from (Ireland)

hereshoping Nov 18th 2008 2:26 am

Re: Why not the GTP?
 

Originally Posted by roamer25 (Post 6981947)
Out of interest - what exactly is the GTP? It's not something we have where I teach (Scotland) or where I am from (Ireland)

GTP= Graduate Training Program (I think) basically on the job rather than uni based teacher training.

st79 Nov 22nd 2008 4:33 am

Re: Why not the GTP?
 

Originally Posted by hereshoping (Post 6983783)
GTP= Graduate Training Program (I think) basically on the job rather than uni based teacher training.

Hi, I have had the same problem. I found out about 2 yrs ago that the GTP qualification is not recognised. I came out to OZ with hubby (Oz Citizen) and trying to find work.

Accreditation is not due to the length of years you trained, it is purely due to the academic level of your qualification. Although a GTP is very hard going and in my case I did everything the same as a PGCE student apart from 2 assignments (you probably did the same) Oz will not accept it.

I have since found out that in NSW (other states may be different) I am able to teach in independent schools ie. International, Catholic, Christian etc. for up to 4 yrs full time and 6 yrs temporary. But there is another catch, the time limits are set because you have to gain an official qualification whilst you are teaching. Therefore I am enrolling on a BA of Teaching (Secondary) distance learning course as an international student (I am a Temporary Resident).

In order to work in religious schools you have to get classification from the local area and they are quite strict.

I have been told by the New South Wales Institute of Teachers that I am officially allowed to teach without being enrolled on the course but the religious denomination schools are picky and require you to be either on a course or have completed one.

It has been hard going and very frustrating at times, as everybody tells you a different story, each university has there own limitations so does each school.

My recommendation to you, if you are serious about moving over is to enrol on a distance education course with Charles Sturt University in a BA of Teaching (secondary) or Primary. You can do it at your own pace take 1.5 yrs or up to 6 yrs if you like. There are some practical elements but sometimes you can get exemptions due to experience and prior training.

Australia is not used to all the many methods that the UK have for teaching and they have put strict levels because all the states had different teaching standards, so it made everything confusing. Therefore they have now got one standard across the country to make it easier for interstate teaching.

I think in the future may change due to a shortage of teachers. The UK is seen as a forward thinking country in contemporary schools here in regards to education therefore I believe in 5-10yrs, industry based qualifications may make there way into the system but for the mean time we just have to deal with the strict academic levels.

One other thing. I came out here three weeks ago. I have had 3 education interviews, 2 at catholic schools and 1 at an independent school. The catholic schools were impressed but are ultimately controlled by their local governing body and I missed out on jobs. The independent school has given me a second interview next week and I still have not officially enrolled on the BA course.

Each year things change as well!?!

Australia is a lovely place but its bloody hard getting a job and enrolling on a course if you don't have OZI quals.

I know its a lot of info, sorry. just let me know if you have any more questions.
x

dan and rachel Jan 1st 2009 4:11 pm

Re: Why not the GTP?
 
have just been referred to this thread following a desperate plea as i too qualified via the gtp route. this final post is really helpful - thank you.
i hope you got a job sorted in the end.
before i did my gtp in secondary ed, i got a pgce in post-compulsory. do you know how that would affect my application?
thanks.
r

Dobbsy Jan 6th 2009 10:54 pm

Re: Why not the GTP?
 
Yep... me too... I'm GTP trained (in 3rd yr of teaching) and been looking for answers for the last 6 months. No university in the UK will re-train me in a PGCE as in the UK eyes I already have QTS?!... except QTS means nothing to the Aussies? and yes, the GTP is not recognised as an academic qualification in Oz so we don't have the 4th yr academic qualification needed.

I have spoken to Teaching Australia many times and they have made it clear that the 4th year must have teaching practice in it (they won't accept my teaching experience on the GTP), so be careful.... make sure any courses you take have the placements at a school which can be verified. I understand teachers with a 3yr BEd are not accepted either.

My only option (it seems) is to take the 4th year in Oz on a student visa. But apart from the courses being around £8k for the 1 yr, myself and husband only being able to work 20hrs a week and having to pay for my two childrens education... and flights, housing, car etc.... my other obstacle is that the Oz academic yr starts Feb..... and as ours finishes July.... do I hand my notice in May.... finish work in July and hope and pray I can get some supply work for the next 6 months!.... and get a place on the course.. as you can't apply months in advance..... and to top it.... after the course is completed you are not even guaranteed to stay and get PR!!!!!

I have spoken to many agencies... and found that they don't always say the same thing, so its worth ringing around as your qualifications may be suitable to tag onto an occupation on the Skills list? You won't be able to teach, but at least you will have PR, then if you wanted you could attend Uni to do your 4th yr which would be a lot cheaper. I am also looking at this :unsure:

Anyway.... I have stopped feeling gutted and betrayed by the UK Uni that led me to believe the GTP was my best route into teaching ...... I do believe that we will get to Perth sooner rather than later....... There's always a way... we have just got to find it......:confused:
Keep in touch....
two heads are better than one!

Swerv-o Jan 7th 2009 3:13 am

Re: Why not the GTP?
 

Originally Posted by Dobbsy (Post 7134562)
Anyway.... I have stopped feeling gutted and betrayed by the UK Uni that led me to believe the GTP was my best route into teaching ...... I do believe that we will get to Perth sooner rather than later....... There's always a way... we have just got to find it......:confused:
Keep in touch....
two heads are better than one!


They don't mention that the GTP is only accepted as a qualification in England and Wales anywhere on their site, and they do sell it as being a proper professional way into the profession.

This happened to a friend of mine, and also to me but in slightly different circumstances. You may want to look at the Master of teaching that is offered at RMIT (I think) and other providers which is considered an acceptable qualification, as a number of other posters have taken this route in the past. Have a look here:

Master of Teaching

It incorporates the Graduate Diploma in Teaching, and allows specialisations in early, primary or secondary roles. Plus if you did your GTP with a recognised university, then you may be able to claim some RPL for modules that you can demonstrate that you have passed at a tertiary level.

I did a PGCE at a College of FE instead of a Uni, and because it's not a tertiary institution I can't teach in Australia either. I bent over backwards trying to prove that it was the same course, leading to QTS etc, but they were having none of it. Sadly Australia is addicted to bureaucracy, rules and regulations, and the inflexibility they offer when a slightly non standard case comes along is staggering.

Good luck with it!


S

Dobbsy Jan 7th 2009 6:57 pm

Re: Why not the GTP?
 
Thanks for the reply. The reason I am looking at taking the PGDE is because its only for 1 year, so obviously less costly, as its not just the course fees thats an issue.

My husband had been made redundant today..... perhaps its fate that we just bite the bullet and go. I think some universities in Oz have a July/Aug intake for teaching?

Anyway, how did you manage to 'get in' in the end?

Dobbsy

Swerv-o Jan 7th 2009 8:55 pm

Re: Why not the GTP?
 

Originally Posted by Dobbsy (Post 7137976)
Thanks for the reply. The reason I am looking at taking the PGDE is because its only for 1 year, so obviously less costly, as its not just the course fees thats an issue.

My husband had been made redundant today..... perhaps its fate that we just bite the bullet and go. I think some universities in Oz have a July/Aug intake for teaching?

Anyway, how did you manage to 'get in' in the end?

Dobbsy


I already had a visa before I decided to go into teaching - I thought that a teaching qualification would make me more employable when I got there, and I got funding for the course fees, so felt there was nothing to be lost.

In the end, after only three years, I never want to set foot in a classroom again - teaching really wasn't for me, and I'm working well away from it now, so I'm not too worried about it any more.

If you are looking at doing the course in Australia, note also that they pay a lot of attention to the subjects that were in your undergraduate degree - if you don't have the correct balance, then they may decline you entry to the course, so you may have to shop around depending on the requirements.


S

Dobbsy Jan 8th 2009 7:29 pm

Re: Why not the GTP?
 
Thanks.... I'm just about to start shopping for a course and work out exactly how much it will all add up to... fingers crossed x

Briar Jan 22nd 2009 12:33 pm

Re: Why not the GTP?
 
Dan and Rachel

If you are wanting to teach in Australia, your GTP will not be recognised in any state. Also with a PGCE post-compulsory education, you will only ever be able to teach in tertiary education. Teacher Registration Boards in Australia are really hot on this and will not register you to teach with your qualifications. I have a colleague in exactly the same situation as you, and he has been turned down for sponsorship by the WA Ed Dept because his qualifications will not allow him to register with the WACOT and therefore he cannot teach in WA. Good Luck though Dan and Rachel, and if you find a way through the maze, please post on this site!

dan and rachel Jan 22nd 2009 8:34 pm

Re: Why not the GTP?
 

Originally Posted by Briar (Post 7200214)
Dan and Rachel

If you are wanting to teach in Australia, your GTP will not be recognised in any state. Also with a PGCE post-compulsory education, you will only ever be able to teach in tertiary education. Teacher Registration Boards in Australia are really hot on this and will not register you to teach with your qualifications. I have a colleague in exactly the same situation as you, and he has been turned down for sponsorship by the WA Ed Dept because his qualifications will not allow him to register with the WACOT and therefore he cannot teach in WA. Good Luck though Dan and Rachel, and if you find a way through the maze, please post on this site!

Hi,
Thank you for this information. Of course I'll let you know if there is a way through the maze...Not too hopeful though!
Does anyone know anything about the tertiary sector in NSW?!

saoghalbeag Jan 28th 2009 11:58 pm

Re: Why not the GTP?
 
The GTP situation sounds like my experience of QTS in England...at least you can add to your quals and still have the chance to teach in Oz -because of the stupid 4 year rule for QTS in England I can never teach there again and (as you'd all probably understand given you have dreams of living abroad as well!) it has turned my whole world upside down.

Nevertheless, where there is a will there's a way and after 4 years of research, emails to nowhere and banging my head against brick walls I should be able to move back to the UK in a year or 2.

The PGCE is usually only about 9 months of study and I know a teacher who graduated and was able to work supply for the remainder of the year.

Also wanted to add for the poster asking if courses start in July - yes they definitely do start mid-year. It is also worth shopping around the unis - trying some of the more regional unis - as they can be more willing to accommodate you and help out with matching your existing quals with the course - they can also be cheaper!

Something that I don't think was mentioned for those on the GTP: I know it's not ideal, but what about working in childcare? The quals they have are Certificate and Diploma level and are designed so that they could eventually lead to a 4 year Bachelor of Education - so if the registration boards won't accept the GTP for standard teaching it should still be enough for teaching in a childcare setting (which can be kindergarten, preschool, preprep etc). It's a job at least, while you study etc? I don't think you can use it for migration though, but I might be wrong?

Good luck to everyone - I understand your frustration but don't let it put you off your plans!!!


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