chequer

I have been looking into the (primary) teaching field in Australia. At the same time, my mate has been doing the same for Canada.

In the UK it seems that teaching is more obviously a 'career' with opportunities to extend beyond class teaching into subject specialism, management, curriculum development, Advanced Skills Teaching and the like. It feels as if enthusiasm and willingness to 'get on' is valued and that teaching can be a good career for men as the main breadwinner.

The impressions we have got of Australia and Canada, and I do hope we are wrong, is that teaching is less of a 'dynamic' career path. It appears that it makes a better second income for the family but not the primary income. Salary increase, point by point, is the natural progression with a sudden jump to deputy principal and the like.

As we are both male primary teachers, with extensive teaching and management experience and we have our fingers in lots of pies, developing and improving the teaching and learning around us, it seems surprising that the same opportunities are not available if we move to Canada or Australia. In truth, it appears we would have to completely disregard the last 10+ years of our career development as part of the deal of moving to somewhere where the lifestyle is better than here. What a balancing act - better lifestyle/ordinary job (Australia/Canada) or crap lifestyle/better job (UK)!

Come on everyone, put the record straight......please!

Australia_bound?

If thinking of going to Aus, I'd firstly look at their immigration policy with regard to same sex couples! Not very enlightened!

With regard to your question, yes career development is available in Aus, but getting that first step on the ladder is very difficult! Unless you don't mind where you live, seems lots of jobs available in remote areas, that would not really be most peoples first choice to live in!
Can't comment on Canada as not looked into it! Would probably say greater opportunities as larger population.

But try and think that life is what you make it, if it's crap then make changes!

chequer

Thanks for the post.

I think my main beef, and I'm getting the idea that there are promotional opportunities but they just aren't transparent from outside Australia, is that Australia (and they're not alone) doesn't seem to recognise the hard work you might have done in another country.

I was recently told that it was unreasonable to expect to jump into a promotion from outside the country. They even went so far as to say it was insulting to the people currently 'at the chalkface'.. Duh, where do they think I am every working day of my life.....?

I've worked with Australian teachers and it never once crossed my mind to think of them as 'lesser' teachers because they trained in other places than the UK. It just seems a shame that the same courtesy isn't afforded us.......

And don't even get me started on Canada! My mate's having to do 18 university credits in order to get a teaching certificate in Canada. He's a 4 year BEd(Hons) with 10+ years of experience. At least 6 of those at Senior Management level.

TraceyW

I'm currently training to become a teacher (B.ed, kindy through year 7) and the chances of me getting a permanent position are NIL. I could get one if I wanted to work 'country' but I don't. If I were to stay here I would have to work supply or contract in order to earn anything at all.

You are right to believe Australia does not recognise previous experience in other countries. As far as employers here are concerned, only Aussie experience is worth any salt. This is the norm in most career paths here. An impressive resume isn't worth much without Australian experience to back it up.

Teachers are pitied over here. I am constantly being asked "why do that awful job?" The pay is poor and conditions are stressed. O.B.E being introduced to existing teachers has caused no end of grief for them.

Once qualified, Blighty here I come!

chequer

Thanks for the post.

It's sad you can't count on a permanent teaching post. If we do come to Australia, I think we'll have to count on my wife's nursing job and I'll have to hope there's enough supply work to keep my hand in.

Is there a problem with teaching 'country'? I think we'd be up for trying that maybe. If that doesn't pan out it might have to be the independent schools.

What is OBE? It means something quite different in the UK!

Good luck with the training.

JAJ

You should find out the facts before getting worked up - there is such a thing as the interdependent visa in Australia.

foxall22

Hi, Well I hope I can help set the record straight a bit! Hi have recently arrived in Western Australia. If you get a statement of service from your previous employer then your past experience IS taken into account financially. There are 6 points on the classroom teacher salary scale, so with 10+ you would go straight to the top. Once there, there is 'senior teacher 1' 'senior teacher 2' and 'level 3 classroom teacher'. The latter is on a decent ish salary (not far from $70k I think, but don't quote me, and don't check the website yet, they haven't updated for this year!). Level 3 must be applied for, and you assemble a portfolio over aperiod of time. It is to try and stop 'excellent teachers' from leaving the classroom. You get automatic permanency with level 3.

'Permanent' jobs do seem hard to come by, but I am near Bunbury (WA's 2nd city) and I don't feel I will have a problem gaining a job. The state give you more money to go remote, but this is VERY remote where there wouldn't be even a regional hospital for your wife to work in.

Around 25% of schools 'merit select' which just means they employ teachers like UK schools, ie advertise and interview themselves. The rest of state schools the DET sort out. Private schools advertise in papers and on the AISWA website. They are proportionally much cheaper than private schools in UK and nearly 1 in 3 children attend private school.

I too was worried about career opportunities. I was offered deputy head in 2 years were I to stay in UK, and I know it'll take me a few more years to get that here. However, there ARE career opportunities, esp if you live in a city. Similar things, curriculum support officers etc.

OBE is 'outcome-based-education' which WA have, and has come under a lot of scrutiny and the education system is under a huge amount of pressure because they can't get teachers to go remote.

I hope this has been helpful to you. I personally feel the lifestyle advantages will outweigh the negatives. I'm ambitious and determined to further my career and it is possible, just a few less opportunities than the UK.

Cheers,

Gemma

chequer

Gemma, your post is a breath of fresh air!

It's so pleasing to hear that it isn't as black as the lack of information on websites paint. As the days go past, we are becoming more and more enthusiastic for the move despite our original worries.

It looks as if we'll apply with my wife as the main name as she has age on her side and her job is on the MODL list for an extra 15 points! The only thing we'll have to sort is whether the "2 years in 3" experience requirement will count the fact that she has only worked part time since the birth of our 5 year old.

I'm on the trail of my original degree transcript which may prove difficult as I graduated 18 years ago. Is it right that you need to apply for 'accreditation' for your qualifications BEFORE you apply for the visa? How did that go for you?

I think we're sold on Queensland at the moment so we'll see how everything pans out. The visa wait is supposedly 6-12 months though I know they do try to work quickly for MODL jobs. As we had set Summer 2008 for the end of my current placement, the timing would be perfect.

Also, thanks for explaining the scale. It'd be great if I can start at the top of the scale and would take the pressure off us financially if we were both earning. I'm still expecting to have to do supply at the start which is why we would like to arrive in August so I have a good run at it before the end of the academic year. I'm interested in how the Level 3 post needs a portfolio - that sounds suspiciously like the AST portfolio I had to prepare when I was doing that job in the UK. Looks like I too might be able to 'climb the ladder' when I've got to grips with the system.

Thanks for the positive information! Hooray, I knew it would be out there somewhere!

Robert

WS

Hi, part time work can count for work experience as long as it is over 20 hours a week.

And yes, if you are claiming the 5 spouse points, you would need to get a skills assessment before the visa application is lodged.

Good luck!

foxall22

Hi Robert,

Glad to help - just to reiterate the information I shared is JUST for WA. I have no idea if Queensland have level 3 stuff or equivalent.

When I arrived I had to do an entry and orientation program, which is 3 days curriculum stuff, 10 days teaching, then an interview/presentation. Just time consuming stuff and I advise you to start the ball rolling asap.

Getting qualifications was a pain, - transcripts, certifying every certificate I ever owned etc. They lost a couple of documents I sent so again, be organised and send it quickly, and be prepared to send it again!

I know that WA and Queensland have a reciprocal arrangement so if you teach in one state you can teach in another. However, on my orientation course were plenty of teachers from NSW and Vic because WA make them do the same course as overseas teachers.

Good luck!

Gemma