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We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum

We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum

Old Jun 14th 2020, 2:14 pm
  #16  
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Default Re: We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum

Originally Posted by johnwoo View Post
I suspect most people don't know who the statues are of, and know even less about why they are there, or what they represent.
Not far from the Bristol Colston statue, in Queen Square, stands a statue of a man on a horse. Growing up, I was told that every night, the man climbed off his horse and went for a walk. Possibly for a chat with Eddie.

Only by googling yesterday, did I discover it's William lll, referenced in Steely Dan's great song My Old School.
(I knew about William and Mary not sufficing of course, but I didn't know it was William the third )

Maybe we could have some sort of laws regarding statues and what they stand for (pun intended). Perhaps these statue laws could be statutes.
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Old Jun 14th 2020, 7:26 pm
  #17  
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Default Re: We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum

Originally Posted by Bipat View Post
Also many of the statues represent people who are both 'bad' and 'good'. The slave traders who spent the money made from trading doing good work for people in UK cities.
Churchill a hero in that he saved the UK in WW2 , but was certainly 'racist' and committed atrocities in other countries in his younger days. Gandhi who in his younger days obviously cared for 'brown' people but did not think it his 'duty' to care for 'black' people. Hero Churchill who certainly insulted Hero Gandhi!!
I hardly think doing good work from the blood and enslavement of others in anyway balances the bad from the good.
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Old Jun 14th 2020, 9:28 pm
  #18  
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Default Re: We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum

Originally Posted by johnwoo View Post
I hardly think doing good work from the blood and enslavement of others in anyway balances the bad from the good.
Why did you only answer half my post??? What about Churchill?
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Old Jun 14th 2020, 9:54 pm
  #19  
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Default Re: We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum

Originally Posted by Bipat View Post
. The slave traders who spent the money made from trading doing good work for people in UK cities.
Originally Posted by johnwoo View Post
I hardly think doing good work from the blood and enslavement of others in anyway balances the bad from the good.
  • Absolutely this, the whole point of slavery was to benefit from other peoples labour. with substantial cost to the enslaved. To consider any action "good" by those that distributed this wealth obtained directly from these gains, is an extraordinary attempt at apologetics for slavery. (I am sure this was not Bipats intention) It does however illustrate the systematic exchange of wealth from one community to another.

Last edited by kimilseung; Jun 14th 2020 at 10:03 pm.
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Old Jun 14th 2020, 10:03 pm
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Default Re: We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum

Originally Posted by kimilseung View Post
  • Absolutely this, the whole point of slavery was to benefit from other peoples labour. with substantial cost to the enslaved. To consider any action "good" by those that distributed this wealth obtained directly from these gains, is an extraordinary attempt at apologetics for slavery. It does however illustrate the systematic exchange of wealth from one community to another.
So again no mention of Churchill. The atrocities in other countries??

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-29701767

Last edited by Bipat; Jun 14th 2020 at 10:08 pm.
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Old Jun 14th 2020, 10:09 pm
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Default Re: We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum

Originally Posted by Bipat View Post
So again no mention of Churchill. The atrocities in other countries??
I think me going off on Churchill, would be even more thread drift. You have attempted tp pass "saved the UK in WW2" off as an axiom, while it is widely believed, it is not the thoughts of everyone. including people on both left and right. I am not going to discuss Churchill in this thread. I think you are trying to create another argument, that you are having with yourself, not with me.
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Old Jun 14th 2020, 10:21 pm
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Default Re: We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum

Originally Posted by kimilseung View Post
I think me going off on Churchill, would be even more thread drift. You have attempted tp pass "saved the UK in WW2" off as an axiom, while it is widely believed, it is not the thoughts of everyone. including people on both left and right. I am not going to discuss Churchill in this thread. I think you are trying to create another argument, that you are having with yourself, not with me.
No----I am discussing statues.
As I said in previous posts there are statues of those such as slave traders who then spent money on UK towns and statues of those such as Churchill who was regarded as a hero during WW2 but who had a past of racial disregard and atrocities for other communities.

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Old Jun 14th 2020, 10:22 pm
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Default Re: We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum

I think we should burn every Mercedes we can find for their support of the Nazis.
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Old Jun 15th 2020, 1:11 am
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Default Re: We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum

Originally Posted by anotherlimey View Post
I think we should burn every Mercedes we can find for their support of the Nazis.
Close down the Daily Mail for the same reason?
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Old Jun 15th 2020, 12:47 pm
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Default Re: We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum

Originally Posted by anotherlimey View Post
I think we should burn every Mercedes we can find for their support of the Nazis.
What about "The peoples car"....VW?
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Old Jun 15th 2020, 5:54 pm
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Default Re: We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum

Originally Posted by Chatter Static View Post
What about "The peoples car"....VW?
yep. And on my next trip to France I'll demand they pull down Napolean statues.
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Old Jun 16th 2020, 1:49 am
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Default Re: We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum


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Old Jun 16th 2020, 2:22 am
  #28  
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Default Re: We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum

Take them all down. As has been said they serve no purpose other than as a perch and toilet for pigeons and drunken humans. Before mobile phones etc when you'd have to go to a library to look information up, who actually looked at a statue, read the blurb at the bottom and went away to investigate further? Very few. I don't need to see a statue of Churchill in Parliament Square unless every PM since the year dot is also planted there. Having a statue of someone because they once did something, generally a bloody long way away from where they've been planted in concrete seems pointless and teaches nothing other than the possible skill of the artist.
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Old Jun 16th 2020, 2:56 am
  #29  
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Default Re: We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum

Originally Posted by Bipat View Post
Also many of the statues represent people who are both 'bad' and 'good'. The slave traders who spent the money made from trading doing good work for people in UK cities.
Churchill a hero in that he saved the UK in WW2 , but was certainly 'racist' and committed atrocities in other countries in his younger days. Gandhi who in his younger days obviously cared for 'brown' people but did not think it his 'duty' to care for 'black' people. Hero Churchill who certainly insulted Hero Gandhi!!
And Clive of India, when he was just plain Clive.
[I think that's Jones in Dad's Army]
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Old Jun 16th 2020, 7:04 am
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Default Re: We need to preserve history, Lets put these statues in a museum

Originally Posted by Chatter Static View Post
What about "The peoples car"....VW?
Porsche too, and Ferrari....
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