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UK immigration post Brexit

UK immigration post Brexit

Old Feb 29th 2020, 8:00 am
  #766  
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Default Re: UK immigration post Brexit

You (deliberately?) missed the point.
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Old Feb 29th 2020, 8:58 am
  #767  
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Default Re: UK immigration post Brexit

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost View Post
There have been numerous reported cases of Romanians doing illegal day labour in the UK and sleeping rough not to mention working in the trafficking trade and the sex industry.
Reported in the newspapers you don't read? And presumably these are an entirely different group from those vast numbers who allegedly rock up and help themselves to a huge slice of free money thanks to the UK's over-generous system of in-work handouts.

Facetiousness aside, though, I'm surprised you don't see some problems in regarding the imposition of a working visa requirement on those hitherto exempt as a solution to either labour exploitation or undocumented migrants.

For starters, is the employer likely to be any more bothered by the requirement than they are about breaking whatever rules they currently do? And if those fully entitled to seek any work they please are accepting precarious and dodgy employment or engaging in criminal activities to sustain themselves, just what do you think will prevent them doing so when they no longer have access to legit work?

Do you really think all such employers and shysters or those they exploit are going to suddenly go clean of their own accord?
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Old Feb 29th 2020, 9:07 am
  #768  
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Default Re: UK immigration post Brexit

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee View Post
Maybe technically it isn't a visa, but it fulfils almost exactly the same purpose as one.
No it doesn't and neither does ESTA. It exists only as a form of airline whitelisting, designed to reduce wait times and rejections at the border by preventing certain individuals from even boarding a flight in the first place. That's why it only applies to international air travel and no other form of transportation into Canada. Once you've actually sat on a plane, the eTA has served its purpose and has no actual relevance at the border.

Last edited by DigitalGhost; Feb 29th 2020 at 9:09 am.
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Old Feb 29th 2020, 9:11 am
  #769  
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Default Re: UK immigration post Brexit

Originally Posted by Red Eric View Post

Do you really think all such employers and shysters or those they exploit are going to suddenly go clean of their own accord?
Possibly not but the penalties for employing illegal immigrants in the UK are severe and if you restrict the ability of those illegal immigrants to be in the country then there will be less of a supply anyway.

I actually saw this on a BBC Three documentary by one of their left-leaning, young journalists who was investigating worker exploitation.
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Old Feb 29th 2020, 9:17 am
  #770  
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Default Re: UK immigration post Brexit

Well, its a good thing there's not many "illegal immigrants" then, right?

Well, not yet anyway...
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Old Feb 29th 2020, 9:24 am
  #771  
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Default Re: UK immigration post Brexit

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost View Post
Possibly not but the penalties for employing illegal immigrants in the UK are severe and if you restrict the ability of those illegal immigrants to be in the country then there will be less of a supply anyway.
But it's not going to be "restricting the ability of illegal immigrants to be in the country" any more than at present. It's simply going to exclude more people from having a legal right to seek some categories of work in the UK.

As, even currently and with EU FoM largely helping to keep the labour market supplied with its needs, questionable practices appear to be such a problem, what makes you think that will change except for the worse?

I'm sure the penalties for dodgy employers on grounds other than employing unauthorised migrants are also similarly severe, should they actually be caught. It doesn't seem to be effectively deterring them, even by your account.
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Old Feb 29th 2020, 9:29 am
  #772  
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Default Re: UK immigration post Brexit

Originally Posted by Red Eric View Post

As, even currently and with EU FoM largely helping to keep the labour market supplied with its needs
I'm not sure that's really true. FoM has just flooded the country with low skilled and low paid labour tbh. They weren't filling a need so much as they were enabling work to do be done on the cheap and pushing wages down in the lower end of the employment market.
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Old Feb 29th 2020, 9:44 am
  #773  
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Default Re: UK immigration post Brexit

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost View Post
I'm not sure that's really true. FoM has just flooded the country with low skilled and low paid labour tbh. They weren't filling a need so much as they were enabling work to do be done on the cheap and pushing wages down in the lower end of the employment market.
The good thing about Brexit actually happening is that we will now see whether that was actually the case. When the low-skilled EU nationals return (and at least some of them will, and they won't be replaced), we will see swarms of "economically inactive" Brits abandoning their university lecture halls, their comfortable suburban semis to which they retired early on their company pensions, their sheltered workshops and hospital beds, and the homes of their relatives for whom they are caring, to pick turnips and empty bedpans for the generous salaries that will then magically be offered.
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Old Feb 29th 2020, 9:45 am
  #774  
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Default Re: UK immigration post Brexit

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost View Post
I'm not sure that's really true. FoM has just flooded the country with low skilled and low paid labour tbh. They weren't filling a need so much as they were enabling work to do be done on the cheap and pushing wages down in the lower end of the employment market.
I guess we'll see the truth about that, insofar as the lowest paid work is concerned, in due course.

Meantime, the government has helpfully lowered the pay threshold for foreign workers entering the middle and upper end of the employment market. Do you not have any concerns about that depressing wages or flooding the country?
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Old Feb 29th 2020, 9:52 am
  #775  
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Default Re: UK immigration post Brexit

Originally Posted by Bipat View Post
In 1951, there was FOM also from Commonwealth countries, the EEC eventually became 27 EU countries---times change!!!
Indeed they do. The EU has progressively integrated and facilitated the movement of people within a wider territory; the UK has progressively disengaged from and obstructed the movement of people within a (previously existing) wider territory.

There are, indeed, considerable similarities between "FOM" in the EU and the Commonwealth, if you conveniently overlook that the processes have largely been in opposite directions over much the same timeframe.

Originally Posted by Bipat View Post
Just as there are good relationships, trade and otherwise with previous occupied countries so also there can be good relationships ( not federal!) between the UK and the EU!.
Times change.
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Old Feb 29th 2020, 10:59 am
  #776  
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Default Re: UK immigration post Brexit

Originally Posted by Red Eric View Post

Meantime, the government has helpfully lowered the pay threshold for foreign workers entering the middle and upper end of the employment market. Do you not have any concerns about that depressing wages or flooding the country?
Yes I do. I personally think that decision was a huge mistake and was merely an example of government kowtowing to leftist groups and businesses.
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Old Feb 29th 2020, 11:17 am
  #777  
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Default Re: UK immigration post Brexit

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost View Post
Yes I do. I personally think that decision was a huge mistake and was merely an example of government kowtowing to leftist groups and businesses.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha! Very funny.

The hard-right Tories pandering to the left is as likely as Corbyn voting for austerity measures....
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Old Feb 29th 2020, 11:49 am
  #778  
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Default Re: UK immigration post Brexit

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee View Post
Ha ha ha ha ha ha! Very funny.

The hard-right Tories pandering to the left is as likely as Corbyn voting for austerity measures....
Why? It happened over the Syrian refugee thing. Cameron suddenly went from a flat out refusal to reluctantly agreeing to a 20k over 5 year cap.

It happened over the Dubs agreement as well although thankfully it seems like we may have been able to get rid of that.
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Old Feb 29th 2020, 12:06 pm
  #779  
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Default Re: UK immigration post Brexit

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost View Post
Yes I do. I personally think that decision was a huge mistake and was merely an example of government kowtowing to leftist groups and businesses.
It's got absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with "leftist groups". Where on earth did you get that from, other than that peculiar obsession of yours that insists that anything at all connected with immigration that doesn't consist of stopping it dead or hoofing immigrants out has to be "leftist"?

You might actually be quite surprised if you read some properly leftist comments on the matter.
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Old Feb 29th 2020, 12:45 pm
  #780  
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Default Re: UK immigration post Brexit

Originally Posted by Red Eric View Post
It's got absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with "leftist groups". Where on earth did you get that from, other than that peculiar obsession of yours that insists that anything at all connected with immigration that doesn't consist of stopping it dead or hoofing immigrants out has to be "leftist"?

You might actually be quite surprised if you read some properly leftist comments on the matter.
No that's OK. I don't have any cyanide pills on me right now and there isn't enough whiskey in the world to numb the pain induced by reading that tripe.
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