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Transgenderism - a sign of the times

Transgenderism - a sign of the times

Old Dec 3rd 2019, 6:36 pm
  #256  
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Default Re: Transgenderism - a sign of the times

Originally Posted by spouse of scouse View Post
The struggle continues, but it's great to see the gains that have been made in a very diverse range of countries.

An activist has gone to the court of appeal to force the Home Office to provide gender-neutral, or “X”, passports to UK citizens as an alternative to opting for male or female identities.
A passport is not a personal statement. It is a State issued travel / identify document with various criteria listed to establish / confirm the bearer's bona fides. Sex is one of those criteria, along with name, photograph, etc.

For example, if a passport is presented by a full burqa wearing person, identified as male in the passport, that may be reasonable grounds for an immigration Officer to consider the applicant more carefully.


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Old Dec 3rd 2019, 6:38 pm
  #257  
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Default Re: Transgenderism - a sign of the times

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
So you're saying mistakes never happen? Someone with mental illness might not misperceive clues and become convinced that they are trans. There's a whole lobby out there encouraging them to do just this. It's not uncommon in the gay community to recruit new members (particularly women) but the difference is that homosexuality really isn't a big deal. It's just sext at the end of the day. And someone who drifts into it can drift out of it if they want. Not as simple in trans world, especially if the person transitions. This is part of my objection to the advertising, it trivialises it and glamorises it. I could see there might be a trade-off between that risk and say, broadening tolerance, but it's not really possible to look into the trade-off when there's absolute denial of the risk.
I did not think you actually need to do anything, can you not just self identify as transgender?
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Old Dec 3rd 2019, 6:41 pm
  #258  
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Default Re: Transgenderism - a sign of the times

Originally Posted by BristolUK View Post
Scary organisations can have such benign innocent sounding names.


European Research Group
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Old Dec 3rd 2019, 6:44 pm
  #259  
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Default Re: Transgenderism - a sign of the times

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
There's a whole lobby out there encouraging them to do just this.
There is? Where?

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
It's not uncommon in the gay community to recruit new members (particularly women)
Hol' up ...

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
but the difference is that homosexuality really isn't a big deal.
Well I guess your heart's in the right place.

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
And someone who drifts into it can drift out of it if they want.
People don't just wake up in the morning and decide if they're gay or not. And no, bisexuality doesn't work like that before you try to suggest it does.

A person doesn't drift in and out of being gay, they either are or they aren't.

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
Not as simple in trans world, especially if the person transitions.
People don't just make these choices on a whim, you know.

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
This is part of my objection to the advertising, it trivialises it and glamorises it. I could see there might be a trade-off between that risk and say, broadening tolerance, but it's not really possible to look into the trade-off when there's absolute denial of the risk.
My only objection to advertising is that it's advertising. If they inadvertently make trans- people feel accepted, then I guess that is one small positive in a giant industry of negatives.
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Old Dec 3rd 2019, 6:46 pm
  #260  
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Default Re: Transgenderism - a sign of the times

Originally Posted by SultanOfSwing View Post
There is? Where?



Hol' up ...



Well I guess your heart's in the right place.



People don't just wake up in the morning and decide if they're gay or not. And no, bisexuality doesn't work like that before you try to suggest it does.

A person doesn't drift in and out of being gay, they either are or they aren't.



People don't just make these choices on a whim, you know.



My only objection to advertising is that it's advertising. If they inadvertently make trans- people feel accepted, then I guess that is one small positive in a giant industry of negatives.
Don't worry Sultan, I know.
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Old Dec 3rd 2019, 6:52 pm
  #261  
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Default Re: Transgenderism - a sign of the times

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
Don't worry Sultan, I know.
You know what, exactly?
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Old Dec 3rd 2019, 7:18 pm
  #262  
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Default Re: Transgenderism - a sign of the times

Originally Posted by SultanOfSwing View Post
A person doesn't drift in and out of being gay, they either are or they aren't.
.
But some people do drift in and out. I’ve known quite a few. Hasbians and such.

Are you saying such people, for instance identified as lesbian and then later was in a long term heterosexual relationship, then later ended up in another lesbian relationship (for instance) was actually permanently either gay or straight, and was acting contrary to their “true nature” part of the time?
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Old Dec 3rd 2019, 7:20 pm
  #263  
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Default Re: Transgenderism - a sign of the times

Originally Posted by robin1234 View Post


But some people do drift in and out. I’ve known quite a few. Hasbians and such.

Are you saying such people, for instance identified as lesbian and then later was in a long term heterosexual relationship, then later ended up in another lesbian relationship (for instance) was actually permanently either gay or straight, and was acting contrary to their “true nature” part of the time?
No, I'm not. Those people sound like they were bisexual, they just for some reason didn't say they were.
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Old Dec 3rd 2019, 9:00 pm
  #264  
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Default Re: Transgenderism - a sign of the times

I know several women who are now lesbian but weren't always.
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Old Dec 3rd 2019, 9:04 pm
  #265  
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Default Re: Transgenderism - a sign of the times

Originally Posted by jimenato View Post
I know several women who are now lesbian but weren't always.
There is already a word for that. Bisexual women aren't lesbians. It's not a decision, it's a realization.
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Old Dec 3rd 2019, 9:12 pm
  #266  
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Default Re: Transgenderism - a sign of the times

Originally Posted by SultanOfSwing View Post
There is? Where?

Hol' up ...

Well I guess your heart's in the right place.

People don't just wake up in the morning and decide if they're gay or not. And no, bisexuality doesn't work like that before you try to suggest it does.

A person doesn't drift in and out of being gay, they either are or they aren't.

People don't just make these choices on a whim, you know.

My only objection to advertising is that it's advertising. If they inadvertently make trans- people feel accepted, then I guess that is one small positive in a giant industry of negatives.
What's wrong with someone deciding they fancy being gay for a while?
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Old Dec 3rd 2019, 9:15 pm
  #267  
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Default Re: Transgenderism - a sign of the times

Originally Posted by Cape Blue View Post
What's wrong with someone deciding they fancy being gay for a while?
There's nothing wrong with sexual experimentation, but that doesn't make them gay, it makes them bisexual. Why does everyone forget what the 'B' in LGBT stands for?
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Old Dec 3rd 2019, 9:45 pm
  #268  
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Default Re: Transgenderism - a sign of the times

Originally Posted by SultanOfSwing View Post
There's nothing wrong with sexual experimentation, but that doesn't make them gay, it makes them bisexual. Why does everyone forget what the 'B' in LGBT stands for?
Most gay people have a hetro experience when they're young don't they, does that make them bi? Are people all just bi as they could decide to bat for the other side? Or are they all just pan?

I always found the "they are born like that" argument seems a bit like being gay is still a negative but they can't help themselves, rather than it just being a choice to go gay.
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Old Dec 3rd 2019, 9:50 pm
  #269  
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Default Re: Transgenderism - a sign of the times

Originally Posted by Cape Blue View Post
Most gay people have a hetro experience when they're young don't they, does that make them bi? Are people all just bi as they could decide to bat for the other side? Or are they all just pan?

I always found the "they are born like that" argument seems a bit like being gay is still a negative but they can't help themselves, rather than it just being a choice to go gay.
Maybe I'm oversimplifying it but I don't think there's anything inherently negative in saying that people are born gay. It's not that they can't help themselves, they just are what they are. Like I said earlier, it's not a choice as much as it is a realization. It looked like you were describing a situation that involved bisexuality but if you weren't then no worries. Calling it 'batting for the other side' is way more negative, if you're going to go down that route.

At the same time, I think implying that someone can wake up in the morning and go 'right, that's it I'm gay now' is vastly oversimplifying it too.
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Old Dec 3rd 2019, 10:51 pm
  #270  
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Default Re: Transgenderism - a sign of the times

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
Speaking of defensive ... FFS. You're obviously not taking the time to understand any of my points, but taking an enormous amount of time to try to refute them. I wouldn't be surprised if you're an activist for trans yourself, in which case it's not worth discussing things further.
That actually made me laugh out loud. The rest is as mundane and predictable as the rest of your poorly argued "points".
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