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Tories in chaos

Tories in chaos

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Old Nov 6th 2017, 1:08 pm
  #196  
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Default Re: Tories in chaos

Originally Posted by macliam View Post
There is a difference between limiting tax liability within the law and avoiding tax. The Benns and the Millibands did the former - others may have done more.
hogwash - tax avoidance and limiting tax liability is the same thing and is morally repugnant to me.

Tax evasion is illegal.

In my view we should change the system to eliminate all the possibilities to avoid/limit your taxes especially for inherited wealth in 7 figures

You (and I strongly suspect someone else on here) will defend your "champagne socialist" millionaires whilst despising the Tory ones - I reserve the right to despise them all with the same venom as they are doing the same thing - not paying their taxes when the country is in a mess.
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Old Nov 6th 2017, 1:31 pm
  #197  
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Default Re: Tories in chaos

Originally Posted by Garbatellamike View Post
You (and I strongly suspect someone else on here) will defend your "champagne socialist" millionaires whilst despising the Tory ones - I reserve the right to despise them all with the same venom as they are doing the same thing - not paying their taxes when the country is in a mess.
I strongly suspect it's me you're referring to there and I don't defend "my" champagne socialist anything.

It's methods we're talking about here, not the individuals concerned and just as you say you despise the lot, I say there are differences between the methods employed, the intent behind them and the degree to which they can be considered unethical or immoral. That is entirely separate from the individuals concerned whose right or otherwise to employ a given method (and whose morality in doing so) is the same in my book no matter who they are.
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Old Nov 6th 2017, 2:30 pm
  #198  
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Default Re: Tories in chaos

Originally Posted by Garbatellamike View Post
hogwash - tax avoidance and limiting tax liability is the same thing and is morally repugnant to me.

...
I loaded my pension fund when I was working - one reason being to reduce my 40% tax liability. Is this morally repugnant?

I have various (although not substantial) investment instruments - pensions and the like. I would be amazed if I have no funds in some tax haven somewhere but, crucially, that doesn't make me a tax evader nor even avoider.
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Old Nov 6th 2017, 2:39 pm
  #199  
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Default Re: Tories in chaos

Originally Posted by Garbatellamike View Post
hogwash - tax avoidance and limiting tax liability is the same thing and is morally repugnant to me.
Not at all, minimising your tax bill makes absolute sense and is not immoral.

Avoiding tax by exploiting loopholes only available to high net worth individuals and companies, and then puppet mastering lawmakers in sustaining said unfair advantage is absolutely morally repugnant.
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Old Nov 6th 2017, 2:46 pm
  #200  
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Will Priti Patel be forced to resign?
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Old Nov 6th 2017, 4:08 pm
  #201  
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Default Re: Tories in chaos

Originally Posted by Garbatellamike View Post
hogwash - tax avoidance and limiting tax liability is the same thing and is morally repugnant to me.

Tax evasion is illegal.

In my view we should change the system to eliminate all the possibilities to avoid/limit your taxes especially for inherited wealth in 7 figures

You (and I strongly suspect someone else on here) will defend your "champagne socialist" millionaires whilst despising the Tory ones - I reserve the right to despise them all with the same venom as they are doing the same thing - not paying their taxes when the country is in a mess.
As I said, change the law - and if your prejudice allowed you to read the whole post you'd realise what a stupid assumption you'd made in your rush to demonise....
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Old Nov 6th 2017, 4:29 pm
  #202  
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Default Re: Tories in chaos

Originally Posted by Red Eric View Post
I strongly suspect it's me you're referring to there and I don't defend "my" champagne socialist anything.

It's methods we're talking about here, not the individuals concerned and just as you say you despise the lot, I say there are differences between the methods employed, the intent behind them and the degree to which they can be considered unethical or immoral. That is entirely separate from the individuals concerned whose right or otherwise to employ a given method (and whose morality in doing so) is the same in my book no matter who they are.
I am a simple man - millionaires avoiding tax by whatever means repulse me. You will, I suspect, defend those who share your political views but I remain unconvinced that there are any degrees of ethical tax avoidance. It is unethical and we should change the system to put a stop to it.
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Old Nov 6th 2017, 4:29 pm
  #203  
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Default Re: Tories in chaos

Originally Posted by iano View Post
Austerity means 1,182,954 emergency 3 day food rations issued by foodbanks in the last year while Tory donors continue to dodge paying VAT on their latest yacht.

We're all in this together after all.
A lot of that figure can be attributed to the suffering people have to go through to access the Tories’ hated Universal Credit, a curse on the unemployed. It is not austerity but when one has no money the wording doesn’t matter. The six week wait for an unemployment benefit is an evil that is making people's lives a misery.
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Old Nov 6th 2017, 4:33 pm
  #204  
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Default Re: Tories in chaos

Originally Posted by macliam View Post
As I said, change the law - and if your prejudice allowed you to read the whole post you'd realise what a stupid assumption you'd made in your rush to demonise....
I abhor all tax avoiders and tax evaders - claiming limiting your tax liability isn't avoiding taxes is not intellectually sound imho.

Pay your taxes you rich *********ers
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Old Nov 6th 2017, 4:55 pm
  #205  
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Default Re: Tories in chaos

Originally Posted by iano View Post
Not at all, minimising your tax bill makes absolute sense and is not immoral.

Avoiding tax by exploiting loopholes only available to high net worth individuals and companies, and then puppet mastering lawmakers in sustaining said unfair advantage is absolutely morally repugnant.
Where do you put being rich enough to avoid inheritance tax and gifting all your children over a million each in your will? Is that moral?
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Old Nov 6th 2017, 4:56 pm
  #206  
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Default Re: Tories in chaos

Originally Posted by Garbatellamike View Post
I abhor all tax avoiders and tax evaders - claiming limiting your tax liability isn't avoiding taxes is not intellectually sound imho.

Pay your taxes you rich *********ers
- Payments into a company pension scheme are made tax free and can reduce the tax band at which income tax is payable.
- A person retiring can spread a lump-sum payment over more than one year to avoid being taxed at higher rate.
- Investing through an ISA removes the tax liability on dividends and capital gains.
- A parent can gift money to their children, within certain parameters, to limit the tax payable on their estate.
etc., etc.

These are all was to limit taxation, commonly used and perfectly legal.

Paying tax-free into an offshore company and getting back "loans" which you never repay is not.

Better save your ammunition for the bad boys.
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Old Nov 6th 2017, 5:53 pm
  #207  
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Default Re: Tories in chaos

Originally Posted by Garbatellamike View Post
You will, I suspect, defend those who share your political views...
You've read enough of my posts by now, surely, to know that I will also defend those whose political views I find repugnant if they are being unfairly accused of something.
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Old Nov 6th 2017, 9:18 pm
  #208  
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Default Re: Tories in chaos

Originally Posted by Garbatellamike View Post
I abhor all tax avoiders and tax evaders - claiming limiting your tax liability isn't avoiding taxes is not intellectually sound imho.

Pay your taxes you rich *********ers
Not only rich people avoid taxes.
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Old Nov 6th 2017, 11:24 pm
  #209  
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Default Re: Tories in chaos

Originally Posted by Red Eric View Post
You've read enough of my posts by now, surely, to know that I will also defend those whose political views I find repugnant if they are being unfairly accused of something.
not seen any evidence of that but glad you will
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Old Nov 7th 2017, 8:24 am
  #210  
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Default Re: Tories in chaos

Originally Posted by macliam View Post
So, can I have your car then?
....Only if I can have your racehorses and your yacht Mclaim.......


Originally Posted by Expatrick View Post
And you would deny women the vote?
NOT SO... Suggest you re-read the Putney Debates.... it was the Leveller's position that all Women should have the franchise which the army grandees squished on the excuse that servants & such would be forced by their masters to vote as told. Which leveller kept servants?
............

mikelincs, I don't respond to trolls.
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