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-   -   Shamima Begum has UK citizenship revoked (https://britishexpats.com/forum/take-outside-67/shamima-begum-has-uk-citizenship-revoked-922232/)

Vitalstatistix Mar 14th 2019 11:03 am

Re: Shamima Begum has UK citizenship revoked
 

Originally Posted by Nutek (Post 12653485)
Nothing. We should ship the other 400 back out to live with her in her hole in the desert.

I love you :flirtyeyes:. They made their choice, let them live with the consequences. I'm all for living a peaceful life but I recognise that there are those in society who would rather we would all live as their religion dictates. I'm against such people, I regard them as divisive and dangerous . I don't believe that deprogramming will work in the majority of cases. I'm more than happy that these people are taken out. We have an over-populated world as it is. As a midwife I celebrate new life on the whole but as a realist I have no time for those who would willingly take the life of others for a tenuous belief system.

stevenglish1 Mar 14th 2019 11:22 am

Re: Shamima Begum has UK citizenship revoked
 

Originally Posted by macliam (Post 12653482)
I don't care - millions might support the death penalty due to ignorance, but that doesn't sway the moral compass. The actions taken (which are actually to fob off any action to someone else) will do nothing to prevent future radicalization and grooming of home-grown activists - quite the reverse. My concern is that whilst focus is on this one individual and Javid has appeased the blood-lust, the authorities will quietly do bugger all monitoring of those who have returned, because that's the hard bit.

Activists? :thumbdown:

EMR Mar 14th 2019 12:03 pm

Re: Shamima Begum has UK citizenship revoked
 

Originally Posted by Nutek (Post 12653485)
Nothing. We should ship the other 400 back out to live with her in her hole in the desert.

How, live in the real world.

EMR Mar 14th 2019 12:06 pm

Re: Shamima Begum has UK citizenship revoked
 

Originally Posted by stevenglish1 (Post 12653415)
No, quite obviously I'm not.

If you're going to edit your post then at least do it before I've replied.

You're using your usual straw man to lead you and others to the conclusion that I'm a raging racist, which is utter bollocks

I have said nothing, I leave others to reach their own views from the content of your posts.
They are your opinions, your words , you obviously believe in them...
I you do not equate belief with action why do you regard Begum as no different from Isis terrorists....


anotherlimey Mar 14th 2019 12:38 pm

Re: Shamima Begum has UK citizenship revoked
 

Originally Posted by EMR (Post 12653527)
I have said nothing, I leave others to reach their own views from the content of your posts.
They are your opinions, your words , you obviously believe in them...
I you do not equate belief with action why do you regard Begum as no different from Isis terrorists....

Shamima left the UK to join ISIS in 2015.

It's illegal to join a terrorist organization within the UK or abroad.

The UK listed ISIS as a terrorist organization in 2014. ISIS was already committing mass killings when she left, she knew what she went for no one forced her.


Nutek Mar 14th 2019 12:55 pm

Re: Shamima Begum has UK citizenship revoked
 

Originally Posted by EMR (Post 12653525)
How, live in the real world.

I would be perfectly content to do literally nothing for her. I would hope genuine refugees will be helped from the camps but her situation is self inflicted and she is welcome to stay exactly where she is...pretty much forever really,

It's a shame anyone has expended any effort at all on her behalf when that effort, however small, could have gone to someone who actually deserves it.


EMR Mar 14th 2019 12:58 pm

Re: Shamima Begum has UK citizenship revoked
 

Originally Posted by anotherlimey (Post 12653545)
Shamima left the UK to join ISIS in 2015.

It's illegal to join a terrorist organization within the UK or abroad.

The UK listed ISIS as a terrorist organization in 2014. ISIS was already committing mass killings when she left, she knew what she went for no one forced her.

Then she should be returned to the UK to stand trial for breaking UK law.
We are not some tinpot nation that denies people their rights..
We have tried and are in prison in the UK some who have joined far right groups proscribed by UK law..
We did not take away their citizenship because they were in the UK..

anotherlimey Mar 14th 2019 1:08 pm

Re: Shamima Begum has UK citizenship revoked
 

Originally Posted by EMR (Post 12653566)
Then she should be returned to the UK to stand trial for breaking UK law.
We are not some tinpot nation that denies people their rights..
We have tried and are in prison in the UK some who have joined far right groups proscribed by UK law..
We did not take away their citizenship because they were in the UK..

is it within the home secretary's powers to take citizenship away, or not?


macliam Mar 14th 2019 1:24 pm

Re: Shamima Begum has UK citizenship revoked
 

Originally Posted by anotherlimey (Post 12653582)
is it within the home secretary's powers to take citizenship away, or not?

I guess we'll find out if, and when, his decisions are subject to legal challenge.
AIUI and for those who want to "take back control" and shout about democracy, his powers come from the inheritance of "crown privilege", so he can decide without parliamentary oversight. But he is still subject to legal challenge - if the plaintiffs can afford the costs. With a cynical eye, Javid also knows that any such process will take a long time, so the chances are that even if he is challenged and loses, the problem will have been "solved", just as the problem of Begum's child is solved. In any case, he has kicked any decision into the long grass.....

EMR Mar 14th 2019 1:26 pm

Re: Shamima Begum has UK citizenship revoked
 

Originally Posted by anotherlimey (Post 12653582)
is it within the home secretary's powers to take citizenship away, or not?

We wait to see what the courts determine.
He will have to justify that she represents a genuine risk to the UK.
But it is yesterday's news.

Boiler Mar 14th 2019 2:01 pm

Re: Shamima Begum has UK citizenship revoked
 
I am still intrigued as to how you de programme somebody. I take it that her belief system is honestly held, that everybody else who has a similar belief system and there are lots of them also, so how does it work?

EMR Mar 14th 2019 2:12 pm

Re: Shamima Begum has UK citizenship revoked
 

Originally Posted by Boiler (Post 12653627)
I am still intrigued as to how you de programme somebody. I take it that her belief system is honestly held, that everybody else who has a similar belief system and there are lots of them also, so how does it work?

Start by removing her from the culture, society that reinforces those beliefs.
One of the factors that has been identified in radicalisation in the UK is putting those with a certain belief into prisons which house convicted radicals.
They have become a proven source if increased radicalisation.
The background of some involved in UK terror is petty criminals serving sentences alongside radicals.
Remove Begun from a radical society would be the first place to start.

Boiler Mar 14th 2019 2:31 pm

Re: Shamima Begum has UK citizenship revoked
 

Start by removing her from the culture, society that reinforces those beliefs.
So some sort of desert island, precludes the UK.


One of the factors that has been identified in radicalisation in the UK is putting those with a certain belief into prisons which house convicted radicals.
We agree


Remove Begun from a radical society would be the first place to start.
But where? Solitary confinement?

EMR Mar 14th 2019 2:47 pm

Re: Shamima Begum has UK citizenship revoked
 

Originally Posted by Boiler (Post 12653657)
So some sort of desert island, precludes the UK.



We agree



But where? Solitary confinement?

Solitary confinement would be the last thing to do..


Boiler Mar 14th 2019 2:50 pm

Re: Shamima Begum has UK citizenship revoked
 

Originally Posted by EMR (Post 12653671)
Solitary confinement would be the last thing to do..

That leaves a desert island, well North or South Pole may work.


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