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Public schools indoctrinating kids

Public schools indoctrinating kids

Old Aug 28th 2020, 2:25 am
  #61  
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Default Re: Public schools indoctrinating kids

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
Yes. She was nice really. She used to take me to lunch at the English Speaking Union. She had been my mother's tutor at Newnham.
I’ve used her tome on merchant shipping and the war. It’s difficult, but there’s a treasure trove in there. Part of my family history research - my litigious grandfather commanded a French liner during the war, commandeered as a troopship by .. the BOT? War Office? Whoever. After he lost his command in 1942, because the French had found a French captain which was obviously politically preferable, my grandfather sued the Admiralty, the Free French government etc for monies he thought he was owed .. various out of pocket sums he’d had to pay for supplies and repairs in neutral ports and suchlike. Anyway, it’s very complicated but I needed the Behrens book to understand the relationship of the merchant fleet and the government during the war.
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Old Aug 28th 2020, 2:35 am
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Default Re: Public schools indoctrinating kids

Originally Posted by robin1234 View Post
I’ve used her tome on merchant shipping and the war. It’s difficult, but there’s a treasure trove in there. Part of my family history research - my litigious grandfather commanded a French liner during the war, commandeered as a troopship by .. the BOT? War Office? Whoever. After he lost his command in 1942, because the French had found a French captain which was obviously politically preferable, my grandfather sued the Admiralty, the Free French government etc for monies he thought he was owed .. various out of pocket sums he’d had to pay for supplies and repairs in neutral ports and suchlike. Anyway, it’s very complicated but I needed the Behrens book to understand the relationship of the merchant fleet and the government during the war.
I believe she was highly academic and a scrupulous researcher, which probably made her works a bit, well, dense. Interesting story about your grandfather.

Small world.

This is the only pic I can find of her on the net. My christening present from her was a set of Victorian illustrated children's bricks with a picture of each British monarch from William 1 up through Queen V. On the back was a very short summary of key features of the reign and some moral judgements, Victorian style. I still have them.


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Old Aug 28th 2020, 2:50 am
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Default Re: Public schools indoctrinating kids

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
I believe she was highly academic and a scrupulous researcher, which probably made her works a bit, well, dense. Interesting story about your grandfather.

Small world.

This is the only pic I can find of her on the net. My christening present from her was a set of Victorian illustrated children's bricks with a picture of each British monarch from William 1 up through Queen V. On the back was a very short summary of key features of the reign and some moral judgements, Victorian style. I still have them.
Aw, that’s a lovely photograph. Much as I disapprove of pigeons. Those bricks sound good, remind me of that book Jane Austen wrote as a child, Kings and Queens of England, although she obviously didn’t get as far as Victoria. (Brilliantly illustrated by her sister Cassie.)
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Old Aug 28th 2020, 2:24 pm
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Default Re: Public schools indoctrinating kids

Hold up. All this discussion of Kings and Queens of England (Willy, Willy, Harry, Ste / Harry, Dick, John, Harry 3 and all that...) is confusing. Are they Marxists too now? Or is it still just the Marxist, tweed-jacket-wearing, pipe-smoking history teachers who are the Marxists, indoctrinating their pupils about the violent suppression of autonomous collectives and anarcho-syndicalist communes.
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Old Aug 28th 2020, 2:31 pm
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Default Re: Public schools indoctrinating kids

Originally Posted by Oakvillian View Post
Hold up. All this discussion of Kings and Queens of England (Willy, Willy, Harry, Ste / Harry, Dick, John, Harry 3 and all that...) is confusing. Are they Marxists too now? Or is it still just the Marxist, tweed-jacket-wearing, pipe-smoking history teachers who are the Marxists, indoctrinating their pupils about the violent suppression of autonomous collectives and anarcho-syndicalist communes.

Well the Good Queen Bess was definitely a feminist, so she must have been a Marxist. They were all having sex with people outside of marriage and plenty of gay relationships too, so clearly trying to destroy Western Civilization and Our Values, and half of them were undocumented immigrants who turned up on our shores looking for benefits and a free palace.
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Old Aug 28th 2020, 2:50 pm
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Default Re: Public schools indoctrinating kids

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
Well the Good Queen Bess was definitely a feminist, so she must have been a Marxist. They were all having sex with people outside of marriage and plenty of gay relationships too, so clearly trying to destroy Western Civilization and Our Values, and half of them were undocumented immigrants who turned up on our shores looking for benefits and a free palace.
Best explanation of the Norman invasion ever
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Old Sep 27th 2020, 1:01 pm
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Default Re: Public schools indoctrinating kids

On the subject of schools indoctrination of kids, apparently the Johnson government wishes to exert control over the curriculum to the extent that competing economic systems are to be defined as extremist and certain books and materials to be banned.

"The government has ordered schools in England not to use resources from organisations which have expressed a desire to end capitalism.Department for Education (DfE) guidance issued on Thursday for school leaders and teachers involved in setting the relationship, sex and health curriculum categorised anti-capitalism as an “extreme political stance” and equated it with opposition to freedom of speech, antisemitism and endorsement of illegal activity...

...Schools should not under any circumstances use resources produced by organisations that take extreme political stances on matters. This is the case even if the material itself is not extreme, as the use of it could imply endorsement or support of the organisation...

...Economist and former Greek finance minister Yanis Varoufakis said the guidance showed “how easy it is to lose a country, to slip surreptitiously into totalitarianism”.He added: “Imagine an educational system that banned schools from enlisting into their curricula teaching resources dedicated to the writings of British writers like William Morris, Iris Murdoch, Thomas Paine even. Well, you don’t have to. Boris Johnson’s government has just instructed schools to do exactly that.”

Remind me again what sort of government it is that bans books?

https://www.theguardian.com/educatio...box=1601198869
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Old Sep 27th 2020, 3:27 pm
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Default Re: Public schools indoctrinating kids

Originally Posted by kimilseung View Post
Can't delete
.
Read the article, it is not saying what I thought it was going to say
Explain?
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Old Sep 27th 2020, 3:43 pm
  #69  
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Default Re: Public schools indoctrinating kids

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
Explain?
Phone wouldn't let me delete, now on my PC, so I have deleted.

I thought that "equated it with opposition to freedom of speech, antisemitism and endorsement of illegal activity." was saying that anti-capitalism was all of those things, rather than, being equal in naughtiness to those things. That difference made my comment irrelevant.
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Old Sep 27th 2020, 3:51 pm
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Default Re: Public schools indoctrinating kids

Originally Posted by kimilseung View Post
Phone wouldn't let me delete, now on my PC, so I have deleted.

I thought that "equated it with opposition to freedom of speech, antisemitism and endorsement of illegal activity." was saying that anti-capitalism was all of those things, rather than, being equal in naughtiness to those things. That difference made my comment irrelevant.
Ah, right. I wonder how much government interference of this kind there has been in the curriculum in the past. Up until A level, at least, my history curriculum was relatively narrow in many ways, but the literature one was much more open..
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Old Sep 27th 2020, 4:38 pm
  #71  
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Default Re: Public schools indoctrinating kids

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
On the subject of schools indoctrination of kids, apparently the Johnson government wishes to exert control over the curriculum to the extent that competing economic systems are to be defined as extremist and certain books and materials to be banned.

"The government has ordered schools in England not to use resources from organisations which have expressed a desire to end capitalism.Department for Education (DfE) guidance issued on Thursday for school leaders and teachers involved in setting the relationship, sex and health curriculum categorised anti-capitalism as an “extreme political stance” and equated it with opposition to freedom of speech, antisemitism and endorsement of illegal activity...

...Schools should not under any circumstances use resources produced by organisations that take extreme political stances on matters. This is the case even if the material itself is not extreme, as the use of it could imply endorsement or support of the organisation...

...Economist and former Greek finance minister Yanis Varoufakis said the guidance showed “how easy it is to lose a country, to slip surreptitiously into totalitarianism”.He added: “Imagine an educational system that banned schools from enlisting into their curricula teaching resources dedicated to the writings of British writers like William Morris, Iris Murdoch, Thomas Paine even. Well, you don’t have to. Boris Johnson’s government has just instructed schools to do exactly that.”

Remind me again what sort of government it is that bans books?

https://www.theguardian.com/educatio...box=1601198869
Well, I don’t agree with banning things but there is a concern about people’s reactions when they hear, see or read something.

Regarding the authors you mentioned, I don’t understand why Iris Murdoch’s works would be banned. She’s very much like Ayn Rynd (hope I spelled her right) who wrote about subjects that were real eye openers for the general public. William Morris I don’t know that much about except he was a socialist. If he’s anything like Karl Marx then I can understand Boris Johnson’s concern. What you see as indoctrination, he sees as protecting the youth from straying on a dangerous path. Look at what is happening here in America and it’s happening because of socialist ideas that are being taught in the high school and college classrooms. I am sure that Boris J (like the rest of the world) is watching what’s happening in the States and is concerned that it will spread to the UK.

I will start to research William Morris and see if he’s as extreme as Mr. Johnson makes him out to be. Thanks for the post. Never would have learned about Mr. Morris without it. 👍
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Old Sep 27th 2020, 9:10 pm
  #72  
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Default Re: Public schools indoctrinating kids

Karl Marx died in 1883. He’s lain kinda low since then - I mean, communists used to bang on about Marx, but I think the rest of us assumed the communists were just paying lip service.

Now, I’m getting the impression that the Trumpites and other right-wingers really want to resurrect Marx?
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Old Sep 27th 2020, 10:19 pm
  #73  
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Default Re: Public schools indoctrinating kids

Originally Posted by robin1234 View Post
Karl Marx died in 1883. He’s lain kinda low since then - I mean, communists used to bang on about Marx, but I think the rest of us assumed the communists were just paying lip service.

Now, I’m getting the impression that the Trumpites and other right-wingers really want to resurrect Marx?

Hmm don’t know who you’re referring to but I promise you, no one wants to resurrect Karl Marx. This planet has enough troubles as it is.
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Old Sep 28th 2020, 1:38 pm
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Default Re: Public schools indoctrinating kids

Originally Posted by LoveFortheUK View Post
Well, I don’t agree with banning things but there is a concern about people’s reactions when they hear, see or read something.

Regarding the authors you mentioned, I don’t understand why Iris Murdoch’s works would be banned. She’s very much like Ayn Rynd (hope I spelled her right) who wrote about subjects that were real eye openers for the general public. William Morris I don’t know that much about except he was a socialist. If he’s anything like Karl Marx then I can understand Boris Johnson’s concern. What you see as indoctrination, he sees as protecting the youth from straying on a dangerous path. Look at what is happening here in America and it’s happening because of socialist ideas that are being taught in the high school and college classrooms. I am sure that Boris J (like the rest of the world) is watching what’s happening in the States and is concerned that it will spread to the UK.

I will start to research William Morris and see if he’s as extreme as Mr. Johnson makes him out to be. Thanks for the post. Never would have learned about Mr. Morris without it. 👍
It's Ayn Rand. I'm not seeking to correct you but that makes it easier to find her, and her books, for anyone who isn't familiar with her writing. Interesting and controversial.
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Old Sep 28th 2020, 1:54 pm
  #75  
 
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Default Re: Public schools indoctrinating kids

Originally Posted by robin1234 View Post
Karl Marx died in 1883. He’s lain kinda low since then - I mean, communists used to bang on about Marx, but I think the rest of us assumed the communists were just paying lip service.

Now, I’m getting the impression that the Trumpites and other right-wingers really want to resurrect Marx?
Not only that, there's a William Morris society in the US, working in concert with branches in the UK and Canada among other countries, and they're selling books! Why has the Right allowed this to go on? Well, the reason's obvious, isn't it. The secret agenda. Here they are, holding it.




The William Morris Society U.S.
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