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Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

Old Dec 4th 2019, 6:03 am
  #766  
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Default Re: Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

Originally Posted by Scamp View Post
Nice to see Corbyn apologise for the antisemitism on telly the other day. It's a long road to redemption but it's important to acknowledge it before trying to move on and rebuild. Admitting it is a big step for shoulders so slippery. Good on him.
Wider picture Scamp . Far wider picture on this. Don't buy into rhetoric & even in writing that I realise it sounds something rubbish from me to you but I really do not mean it that way at all. I love that you are interested and willing to speak up. I want that.

I do not find Corbyn 'slippery' at all. Rather that he holds true . By the way, I very much doubt he is anti-Semitic . That is not how he thinks & he had already made statements regarding anti-semitism. That is and should remain distinctive from the Israel/Palestine difficulties .

What is concerning is Mirvis adding his voice as a friend of Johnson. That is not good. Not good at all given the Trump and his family thing.

All parties and many people need redemption for their thoughts regarding those of a jewish faith & not just for that either.

It may help to look up the history regarding this for all parties.

It is a red herring in a way Scamp. Being horribly used for political gain.

Times of Isreal. Read to the end. Not all are so happy with the Cons and Johnson.

Something from Vox . Not too much a fan really but makes some good points

Oh and something about the Cons in general and Rees-Mog and his traditional thing. 15 onward is more current.

So you see. it seems that all parties and several prominent members ( not a pun) also need to apologise if the benchmark is known anti-semitism remarks and innuendoes.

Quote of Jeremy Corbyn from November

"Anti-Semitism is vile and wrong" That is his thinking & the way he thinks. He thinks this way on many subjects, always has done without hiding it or making it all seem something it is not . He does not take the easy road. If he would it would help his political party. I know you don't get that but I do. I would much rather him - and I am not particularly a fan as that is not my way - than Johnson who cares nothing for the country and by that I mean all its people and its land .

Perhaps other parties may like to take Corbyn's lead on this for that faith ,other faiths and those minorities sidelined too and also apologise.

It is a political ruse Scamp & an unpleasant one at that. Seeking to divide to conquer. You don't want that for a nation .

If I felt the Cons had something good to offer I would say so. They are being a bit weak, very weak, in allowing Johnson his smoke and mirrors and jostling which really will not help all the people of the nation.

I'll shut me gob now.
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Old Dec 4th 2019, 6:05 am
  #767  
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Default Re: Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

Originally Posted by BEVS View Post

I do not find Corbyn 'slippery' at all. Rather that he holds true . By the way, I very much doubt he is anti-Semitic .

From a link I posted a little while ago - If Jeremy Corbyn is anti-Semetic, he's not very good at it.
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Old Dec 4th 2019, 6:24 am
  #768  
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Default Re: Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

Originally Posted by BEVS View Post
Wider picture Scamp . Far wider picture on this. Don't buy into rhetoric & even in writing that I realise it sounds something rubbish from me to you but I really do not mean it that way at all. I love that you are interested and willing to speak up. I want that.

I do not find Corbyn 'slippery' at all. Rather that he holds true . By the way, I very much doubt he is anti-Semitic . That is not how he thinks & he had already made statements regarding anti-semitism. That is and should remain distinctive from the Israel/Palestine difficulties .

What is concerning is Mirvis adding his voice as a friend of Johnson. That is not good. Not good at all given the Trump and his family thing.

All parties and many people need redemption for their thoughts regarding those of a jewish faith & not just for that either.

It may help to look up the history regarding this for all parties.

It is a red herring in a way Scamp. Being horribly used for political gain.

Times of Isreal. Read to the end. Not all are so happy with the Cons and Johnson.

Something from Vox . Not too much a fan really but makes some good points

Oh and something about the Cons in general and Rees-Mog and his traditional thing. 15 onward is more current.

So you see. it seems that all parties and several prominent members ( not a pun) also need to apologise if the benchmark is known anti-semitism remarks and innuendoes.

Quote of Jeremy Corbyn from November

"Anti-Semitism is vile and wrong" That is his thinking & the way he thinks. He thinks this way on many subjects, always has done without hiding it or making it all seem something it is not . He does not take the easy road. If he would it would help his political party. I know you don't get that but I do. I would much rather him - and I am not particularly a fan as that is not my way - than Johnson who cares nothing for the country and by that I mean all its people and its land .

Perhaps other parties may like to take Corbyn's lead on this for that faith ,other faiths and those minorities sidelined too and also apologise.

It is a political ruse Scamp & an unpleasant one at that. Seeking to divide to conquer. You don't want that for a nation .

If I felt the Cons had something good to offer I would say so. They are being a bit weak, very weak, in allowing Johnson his smoke and mirrors and jostling which really will not help all the people of the nation.

I'll shut me gob now.
I politely disagree with the slippery bit, but it's very much opinion so I respect yours totally.
I posted that comment purely from a poking fun point of view. It's laughable the antisemitism, but I similarly don't believe there's smoke without fire. The fact he's come out and apologised is actually commendable because there's obviously been an issue in the past.
He's a foolish old man in many respects and his past is right to be questioned, like all of them.
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Old Dec 4th 2019, 7:36 am
  #769  
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Default Re: Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

It's as simple as this, Corbyn says he gives a **** about the working classes, the welfare state, and the NHS. The Tories have demonstrated time and again that they don't.
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Old Dec 4th 2019, 8:31 am
  #770  
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Default Re: Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

Originally Posted by BEVS View Post
This doesn't make much sense to me to be honest in terms of national interest. By that I mean the welfare of the country.



Even this is ?
A rent is set by a landlord. If there is a shortage of rental stock then an ignoble landlord could command an unfair rent for a sub standard rental property. Regulating or capping that is a way to ensure fair rents and standards. Now in an ideal world , which we do not live in, private landlords would all be fair minded however most see a rental property as an investment to make money. That does not go hand in hand sometimes with fair rents and good standards. Now I am not stating this for all landlords at all but there is a difficulty with this market and it needs addressing.
The price of everything in a market economy is related to the supply:demand dynamics at the time - that is a market. If there is a shortage of rentals then the prices will rise and this will stimulate supply expansion which then moderates the price (the issue in the UK is the persistent demand expansion over the past 20 years outstripping the inelastic supply's ability to respond in some locations). The only times that government involvement in price-setting is appropriate is when there is a monopoly position or when there is price gouging in an emergency, otherwise the most efficient and fair system for setting prices is the market.

Of course private landlords see their business as one to make money - why else would they do it otherwise?

Again, the fair price for a good is that between a willing buyer and seller, if I pushed rents up by £200 pcm above the fair market price I would get no takers.

A publically owned rental stock is about putting rooves over heads and for a rent that is affordable.
"Affordable" = subsidised and paid for by others.

Of course public utilities shouldn't be owned or operated by private investors and companies, particularly those from overseas. They should be owned & operated by the country concerned. The nation as a whole each paying a % of tax towards that. That taxation should be apportioned fairly as a % of earnings and investments in an affordable way.
I don't understand what you are trying to say about the nation paying a % of tax towards public utilities - are they not supposed to charge for gas/water/electric now? Is this the "free-fibre" Corbyn model? There is certainly monopoly issues around private ownership of utilities, but if you think government is better at running these operations that the private sector you are mistaken.

Addressing the odd remark about immigrants. BE is made up of immigrants and expats. My mum was an immigrant to the UK. I'm an immigrant to NZ. The UK is a huge melting pot of immigrants past present and future. They are not just arriving to nick jobs and take housing & I have no idea why you would even think that.
I have no problem with immigrants, but there are pros and cons of persistent high net immigration of uncontrolled quality and we should not ignore them. The very fact of them arriving in a location adds demand-side pressure to housing and supply-side weakness to wage bargaining.

I have a doubt that you actually really believe a lot of what you write. Having said that a little dissent and alternative viewpoint is a good thing.
OK

I also wonder if you deliberately determined to try to somehow insult my own family with your remark about council housing. It doesn't bother me as such as I am secure in my experience and knowledge but I must say I am rather hoping it was not so from you as that would negate entirely much and most of what you write.
I've no idea about you families history in council housing and had no intention of insult. I don't insult people on BE except rarely when in response to continued insults at myself.
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Old Dec 4th 2019, 8:39 am
  #771  
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Default Re: Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee View Post
Part of that inelastic supply is the continued creation of jobs where there is a large pool of workers. and infrastructure. And where jobs are created in areas of low unemployment, those jobs will attract people from outside the area to either take those jobs, or take on the jobs vacated by locals who have left their previous employer to join the new one.

What needs to happen is for jobs to be created in areas of high unemployment, with which the EU has helped a lot with development funding for infrastructure and jobs. Merthyr Tydfil in Wales went from being a major town in a coal-mining area to a run-down town after the coal mines closed, but is now doing well since EU funds regenerated the area, including upgrading the A465 Heads of the Valleys road to a dual carriageway. EU funds have done the same for many other former mining communities.

The availability of employment is a big factor in rents because most people don't want to commute 90 mins to work, and want to live near where the jobs are. And as I said, employers create jobs where people are. You're a fan of automation. What happens to those people when technology puts them out of a job and the area goes from low unemployment to higher unemployment?
Yes, supply and demand are what sets the fair market price, we agree.

There are no "EU funds", merely redirected UK ones. Now we will not have to fund Spanish roads and Polish farmers we will have more money to spend on our own.

People liked social housing because the rules were understood, but social housing was never 'something for nothing'. I grew up in social housing, and my father worked almost all his life and we paid the rent, but that rent didn't come to nearly half of his pay back then. Wages actually paid the bills in those days.
They liked it because it was cheaper than private renting and therefore the sub-market rates are a direct subsidy between the tax payer and the council tenant.
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Old Dec 4th 2019, 9:17 am
  #772  
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Default Re: Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

Originally Posted by amideislas View Post
"Crap Blue". Hadn't seen that one before. Not my style, but perhaps fitting nonetheless.

What's so derogatory about "Blueboy"? I think it's a fitting nickname for his cartoon-like persona.
+1
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Old Dec 4th 2019, 10:00 am
  #773  
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Default Re: Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

Originally Posted by Cape Blue View Post
Yes, supply and demand are what sets the fair market price, we agree.<br /><br />There are no "EU funds", merely redirected UK ones. Now we will not have to fund Spanish roads and Polish farmers we will have more money to spend on our own.<br /><br />They liked it because it was cheaper than private renting and therefore the sub-market rates are a direct subsidy between the tax payer and the council tenant.
Erm, you might like to consider that the UK isn't the only EU net contributor, and not the largest. And Spain is neither a net contributor nor net beneficiary. Its about even in Spain.

"EU funds" are not "the UK's money", and the "UK's money" doesn't build "Spanish roads". And "net contribution" only considers what's contributed vs. what is returned in the form of subsidiaries, grants and loans. It doesn't count the trillions in trade in the single market, which the UK particularly enjoys as a net beneficiary.

Also, the entire EU budget shared by all members is a small fraction compared to UK annual expenditures alone. And without EU investments in infrastructure and trade, those "net beneficiaries" wouldn't be experiencing the growth that further accelerates trade within the single market, which again, the UK is perhaps the single largest net beneficiary.

Last edited by amideislas; Dec 4th 2019 at 11:12 am.
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Old Dec 4th 2019, 11:09 am
  #774  
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Default Re: Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

Originally Posted by Scamp View Post
Nice to see Corbyn apologise for the antisemitism on telly the other day. It's a long road to redemption but it's important to acknowledge it before trying to move on and rebuild. Admitting it is a big step for shoulders so slippery. Good on him.
I've asked this here before, and on twitter,
Would someone please give something to prove the anti-semitism slur that is being quoted? anyone?
It's notable that despite all the slurs, and the 'will you apologise questions, there IS NO PROOF, yes some members of the Labour party may have said something, but then again so have cabinet ministers, leaders of other parties BUT NOT JEREMY, he has been getting rid of people proven to be anti-semitic. The Tory party has proven Islamophobic, Homophobic, Misogynistic members in high position, ohh yes that would all apply to Johnson wouldn't it, but he NEVER gets asked about it because the MSM who fund him or are reliant on his government for tbeir jobs will jus not do it, orders from on high comes to mind. If Johnson loses the election then heads will roll at the BBC for one, as the top jobs are all poitically appointed. and I can't see some of the more syncophantic reporters keeping their jobs, mind you Johnson will find them jobs, there has to be some reward for all the arselicking that is going on.
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Old Dec 4th 2019, 11:25 am
  #775  
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Default Re: Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

I haven't seen anything that I could regard as tangible evidence that Corbyn is an anti Semite. Just accusations. And he doesn't exhibit it either.

We all know that the game of politics is routinely played by demonizing the opposition. And those who don't engage in it more often than not, lose.

The Tory camp certainly has plenty of form in this regard. The entire Brexit platform is based on a buffet of falsehoods, for example. On the record. Indisputable. It's not a stretch to suspect this whole antisemitism thing is a complete fabrication. Especially considering how (you name it)-phobic the whole Brexit campaign has been from the start. And the hypocrisy.

The Brexit Tories are almost sure to "win" this one. What's that tell you?
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Old Dec 4th 2019, 11:46 am
  #776  
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Default Re: Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

This is long, it's a book length collection of essays published by Verso. Apologies if it's been linked to before in this thread.

https://www.versobooks.com/blogs/450...e-labour-party

We are approaching the 2019 general election in bizarre circumstances. From the climate crisis to homelessness, Brexit to the NHS, the stakes could scarcely be higher. Yet a story about the Labour Party that has no basis in fact and whose partisan motivations are transparent is playing a significant role in our national conversation and might even influence the result.
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Old Dec 4th 2019, 11:46 am
  #777  
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Default Re: Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

Originally Posted by Scamp View Post
I politely disagree with the slippery bit, but it's very much opinion so I respect yours totally.
I posted that comment purely from a poking fun point of view. It's laughable the antisemitism, but I similarly don't believe there's smoke without fire. The fact he's come out and apologised is actually commendable because there's obviously been an issue in the past.
He's a foolish old man in many respects and his past is right to be questioned, like all of them.
Just like this bit in his past (17 years ago and posted by a jewish man on Twitter)
Take some time to listen to the 2 min and a bit ....

https://twitter.com/andrewfeinstein/status/1202157792297140225


Just because the Tories keep saying it and the press repeates it, doesn't mean it's all true !


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Old Dec 4th 2019, 11:48 am
  #778  
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Default Re: Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

Twitter is full, today, of a video from 2002 of Jeremy Corbyn adressing a meeting in London sopecifically regarding anti-semitism and racist behaviour and he totally condems it. Unfortunatley this will never be reported on the Tory dominated MSM.
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Old Dec 4th 2019, 11:49 am
  #779  
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Default Re: Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

Originally Posted by mikelincs View Post
I've asked this here before, and on twitter,
Would someone please give something to prove the anti-semitism slur that is being quoted? anyone?
It's notable that despite all the slurs, and the 'will you apologise questions, there IS NO PROOF, yes some members of the Labour party may have said something, but then again so have cabinet ministers, leaders of other parties BUT NOT JEREMY, he has been getting rid of people proven to be anti-semitic. The Tory party has proven Islamophobic, Homophobic, Misogynistic members in high position, ohh yes that would all apply to Johnson wouldn't it, but he NEVER gets asked about it because the MSM who fund him or are reliant on his government for tbeir jobs will jus not do it, orders from on high comes to mind. If Johnson loses the election then heads will roll at the BBC for one, as the top jobs are all poitically appointed. and I can't see some of the more syncophantic reporters keeping their jobs, mind you Johnson will find them jobs, there has to be some reward for all the arselicking that is going on.
https://metro.co.uk/2019/11/29/jerem...view-11240739/

Video where he says "the BBC has a bias towards saying Israel has a right to exist". As if this was a problem?

I don't really think he is anti-semitic, certainly he is anti-Israel and their attitudes to the Palestinians but that is fine, many of us are. He does seem to have plenty of Labour members who struggle to differentiate between dislike of Israeli policies and dislike of Jews. I suspect that Jewish organisations like to jump on any errors in defence of Israel.
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Old Dec 4th 2019, 12:29 pm
  #780  
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Default Re: Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn

Originally Posted by mikelincs View Post
Twitter is full, today, of a video from 2002 of Jeremy Corbyn adressing a meeting in London sopecifically regarding anti-semitism and racist behaviour and he totally condems it. Unfortunatley this will never be reported on the Tory dominated MSM.
Here's another Tweet from a Jewish person shared by a Jewish person ... Very enlightening !

And no, I'm not searching for these tweets, they just show up in my feed.

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