British Expats

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-   -   Post EU Referendum (https://britishexpats.com/forum/take-outside-67/post-eu-referendum-879308/)

DigitalGhost Jan 13th 2017 11:01 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Red Eric (Post 12150774)
Most of the EU doesn't appear to me to share the same phobias as lifelong Brexiters - and the UK's referendum vote doesn't appear to have swung EU citizens into an exit frenzy of their own in any other member state.

Let's be honest there Eric, it's early days yet. I would wait to see how this year's French and German elections go before jumping to that conclusion.

Bipat Jan 13th 2017 11:01 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost (Post 12150771)
Definitely. Plenty of us on here either live or have lived in other commonwealth countries and didn't have the right to vote there unless going through local naturalisation.

I've never quite been able to figure out why commonwealth nationals resident in Britain are allowed to vote tbh. The empire died a long, long time ago and very few aspects of British politics affect the commonwealth as a whole.

I agree that they shouldn't have a vote unless they become British.
Don't know all the rules but maybe some are unable to get British nationality for some reason?
(EMR can tell us:lol:)

(70 years or so not that long)

DigitalGhost Jan 13th 2017 11:03 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Red Eric (Post 12150783)
That doesn't explain why countries outside the EU have also seen rises in far right activity.

Which countries, the United States?

Similarly many of them are facing levels of economic hardship and illegal immigration has obviously become a hot topic in America. The likes of Russia are obviously a different kettle of fish altogether and I can't really think of any other examples.

DigitalGhost Jan 13th 2017 11:06 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Bipat (Post 12150802)

(70 years or so not that long)

Well put it into perspective. That is almost half the number of years for which Canada has existed.

From my own personal point of view, it makes absolutely no sense that an Aussie resident in Britain can vote in UK elections right now but my other half can't. They both pay their taxes just the same after all.

DaveLovesDee Jan 13th 2017 11:30 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost (Post 12150771)
Definitely. Plenty of us on here either live or have lived in other commonwealth countries and didn't have the right to vote there unless going through local naturalisation.

I've never quite been able to figure out why commonwealth nationals resident in Britain are allowed to vote tbh. The empire died a long, long time ago and very few aspects of British politics affect the commonwealth as a whole.

Yet some of the Leave campaigners want to make it easier for nationals of certain Commonwealth countries to be able to more easily immigrate to the UK, after we leave the EU.

Immigration will never be an absolutely perfectly level playing field. Ever.


Originally Posted by DigitalGhost (Post 12150765)
Totally. For the life of me, I still can't figure out how or why that happened. In effect, the EU brought the likes of UKIP, Le Front National and the AfD entirely on itself. Tbh, they should probably be grateful that politics in Britain have remained as moderate as they have.

It's almost like there's an organisation somewhere behind the scenes orchestrating a 'Europe Spring', isn't it.

After all, the west helped start the Arab Spring thing in 2011. Why can't the same be done to us, politically-speaking? :p If Russia did influence the US election result, what's to say it can't and won't do the same in the French and German elections?

DigitalGhost Jan 13th 2017 11:35 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee (Post 12150819)
Yet some of the Leave campaigners want to make it easier for nationals of certain Commonwealth countries to be able to more easily immigrate to the UK, after we leave the EU.

I thought we already had that e.g. the ancestry visa for Australians.



Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee (Post 12150819)
After all, the west helped start the Arab Spring thing in 2011. Why can't the same be done to us, politically-speaking? :p If Russia did influence the US election result, what's to say it can't and won't do the same in the French and German elections?

I'm not going to lie, it's possible. The Russians are right sneaky bastards and I wouldn't put anything past them. It's true that some of those smaller countries who are dependent upon Russian energy could suffer at the hands of the Kremlin more if the EU wasn't around as well.

The problem IMHO is that the EU has just gotten too big and has lost sight of its original goal. It needs to focus more on being an economically stable trade union and less on becoming a federal superpower because, let's face it, the latter is absolutely never going to work in practice.

Dick Dasterdly Jan 13th 2017 11:50 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 
Unfortunately becoming a Dictatorial Superstate always was the foremost original plan as laid out by its main founder member,
the free trade zone simply being the carrot on the stick.

:cool:

Dick Dasterdly Jan 13th 2017 11:52 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 
.....And so it continues,

Yet another U turn.:thumbup:


U-TURN | Ryanair - who threatened to pull out of the UK if we voted Leave - is to launch nine new routes from London Stansted in a dramatic Brexit U-turn.
The budget carrier also plans to add more flights to 13 existing routes.
In a company statement back in July, the low-cost airline had threatened to "cut capacity and frequency on many London Stansted routes" yet now finds itself launching new ones in a move it says is part of its push to sustain growth in the UK.

:cool:

DaveLovesDee Jan 13th 2017 12:19 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost (Post 12150806)
Well put it into perspective. That is almost half the number of years for which Canada has existed.

And that's part of the problem. We're happy to compare compare historical issues to the length of time an area of land has been an official country. Canada was called something else before that, and no-one gave the indigenous people of the time a choice in our migrating there.


From my own personal point of view, it makes absolutely no sense that an Aussie resident in Britain can vote in UK elections right now but my other half can't. They both pay their taxes just the same after all.
There are millions of UK taxpayers and non-taxpayers who don't vote in the UK either, and I don't think the right to vote should be based on whether you pay tax or not. It should be based on whether you pay money to the government or not. If you're a legal resident, you should have the right to vote on matters that affect you, whether it's local council or Parliamentary elections, or an EU referendum.


Originally Posted by DigitalGhost (Post 12150826)
I thought we already had that e.g. the ancestry visa for Australians.

Only if you can prove that at least one grandparent was born in the UK Ancestry visa. I doubt many of those visas get issued.


I'm not going to lie, it's possible. The Russians are right sneaky bastards and I wouldn't put anything past them. It's true that some of those smaller countries who are dependent upon Russian energy could suffer at the hands of the Kremlin more if the EU wasn't around as well.
Would you prefer those current ex-Soviet states remain EU members, or to become prey to Russian bullying without the EU?

[/quote]The problem IMHO is that the EU has just gotten too big and has lost sight of its original goal. It needs to focus more on being an economically stable trade union and less on becoming a federal superpower because, let's face it, the latter is absolutely never going to work in practice.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, because no-one organisation could keep something like 50 states, 1 Federal district and 5 territories happy in an orderly system. Yet the US government has done exactly that for the last 57 and a half years since Hawaii joined the union.

The US had 28 states (the same number as the EU has member countries) in 1845. Are you seriously suggesting that the European Union is unable to do something that the US has been doing fairly well for over 170 years!

Both the US and the EU have the following;

An overall central government (US - Executive branch, Senate and Congress / EU - Council of Ministers & EU Parliament.

State / National governments deal with matters within their own borders.

Local government.

DaveLovesDee Jan 13th 2017 12:28 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Dick Dasterdly (Post 12150843)
.....And so it continues,

Yet another U turn.:thumbup:


U-TURN | Ryanair - who threatened to pull out of the UK if we voted Leave - is to launch nine new routes from London Stansted in a dramatic Brexit U-turn.
The budget carrier also plans to add more flights to 13 existing routes.
In a company statement back in July, the low-cost airline had threatened to "cut capacity and frequency on many London Stansted routes" yet now finds itself launching new ones in a move it says is part of its push to sustain growth in the UK.

:cool:

Why not make as much money as they can before they lose easy access to EU markets? Because once we leave the EU, Easyjet will lose the right to freely operate between other EU countries unless it either moves to an EU member state, or the UK and EU agree a deal. No deal means that Easyjet will lose a large percentage of it's routes, especially all those between non-UK countries.

scrubbedexpat099 Jan 13th 2017 12:30 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

The US had 28 states (the same number as the EU has member countries) in 1845. Are you seriously suggesting that the European Union is unable to do something that the US has been doing fairly well for over 170 years!
Hmmmm


History is not your strong point?

DigitalGhost Jan 13th 2017 12:51 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee (Post 12150860)
Yeah, because no-one organisation could keep something like 50 states, 1 Federal district and 5 territories happy in an orderly system. Yet the US government has done exactly that for the last 57 and a half years since Hawaii joined the union.

The US had 28 states (the same number as the EU has member countries) in 1845. Are you seriously suggesting that the European Union is unable to do something that the US has been doing fairly well for over 170 years!

The key difference is that most US states were never their own country. America wasn't divided in the way that Europe has been for hundreds of years. They also mostly shared a common language and a similar set of values and, even then, a lot of blood was shed during the creation of what is now the USA. In essence, you're comparing apples with oranges there I'm afraid.

I know that there are many in the EU who would just love to create a United States of Europe but it simply is never going to happen.

EMR Jan 13th 2017 1:01 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Dick Dasterdly (Post 12150843)
.....And so it continues,

Yet another U turn.:thumbup:


U-TURN | Ryanair - who threatened to pull out of the UK if we voted Leave - is to launch nine new routes from London Stansted in a dramatic Brexit U-turn.
The budget carrier also plans to add more flights to 13 existing routes.
In a company statement back in July, the low-cost airline had threatened to "cut capacity and frequency on many London Stansted routes" yet now finds itself launching new ones in a move it says is part of its push to sustain growth in the UK.

:cool:

What rubbish you post.
Ryan air never threatened to pull ots operations out if the UK and anyone who lives in thd real world knows that at this time of the year the summer schedules are announced .
Really Dick it is time you came out of that cave and rejoined the human race.

DaveLovesDee Jan 13th 2017 1:04 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Boiler (Post 12150874)
Hmmmm


History is not your strong point?

Texas became the 28th state of the union on December 29th, 1845.

What's wrong with my history.


Originally Posted by DigitalGhost (Post 12150896)
The key difference is that most US states were never their own country. America wasn't divided in the way that Europe has been for hundreds of years. They also mostly shared a common language and a similar set of values and, even then, a lot of blood was shed during the creation of what is now the USA. In essence, you're comparing apples with oranges there I'm afraid.

I know that there are many in the EU who would just love to create a United States of Europe but it simply is never going to happen.

There's been a lot of European blood spilt over the years too.

EMR Jan 13th 2017 1:06 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost (Post 12150896)
The key difference is that most US states were never their own country. America wasn't divided in the way that Europe has been for hundreds of years. They also mostly shared a common language and a similar set of values and, even then, a lot of blood was shed during the creation of what is now the USA. In essence, you're comparing apples with oranges there I'm afraid.

I know that there are many in the EU who would just love to create a United States of Europe but it simply is never going to happen.


State rights are as or even more important to some americans than the government in Washington.
Many are anti Federal involvement in their affairs.
States pass their own laws contradicting Washington
They fought a very bitter civil war over state rights.
The EU is in many ways very similar to the US .


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