British Expats

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-   -   Post EU Referendum (https://britishexpats.com/forum/take-outside-67/post-eu-referendum-879308/)

DaveLovesDee Nov 18th 2016 10:19 pm

re: Post EU Referendum
 
Brexit: Fresh blow for Theresa May as Supreme Court rules Scotland and Wales can intervene in Article 50 triggering

EMR Nov 18th 2016 10:28 pm

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Bipat (Post 12108408)
Why do you post about subjects that you have no knowledge. "Little or no demand in the Uk to live and work in India", you are wrong.
Why do you think visa regs. recently relaxed , why are there complaints about difficulties with business visas, why the wish of retired people for longer visas? There are many British there on employment and student visas.

Illegal immigrants should be deported, including those from Australia and USA (which I have just learned about).

Post Brexit the immigration rules will vary according to need, there will not be one particular group with free movement regardless of their skills or numbers.

You have no idea what the rules regarding immigration will be post brexit.
If the majority of brexit voters got their way it would be just a few tens thousands a year.
My belief is that nett immigration will continue to be in excess of 150,000 and that a degree of free movement will continue as the price for free access to the EU markets.
There will be no significant changes for anyone else where ever they originate from.

How many Brits emmigrated to India compared to the tens thousands from India who arrive in the UK every year and the thousands more who would like to plus of course those who are illegal.
Do you have any numbers to support your claims.
Are there 30,000 plus illegals from the US and Australia in the UK..
If you want equality as you keep posting then forget India and discuss the claims of all those from anywhere in the world who would like to live and work in the UK.

DaveLovesDee Nov 18th 2016 10:51 pm

re: Post EU Referendum
 
If the UK brought in national ID cards for UK nationals, like most EU countries have for their countries (and have many countries worldwide), then working out who is illegal would be much easier.

The UK already issues Residence Cards to EU and non-EU nationals. All it takes is political will, which we don't have.

Bipat Nov 19th 2016 7:40 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 
A;12108717]You have no idea what the rules regarding immigration will be post brexit.
If the majority of brexit voters got their way it would be just a few tens thousands a year.
My belief is that nett immigration will continue to be in excess of 150,000 and that a degree of free movement will continue as the price for free access to the EU markets.
There will be no significant changes for anyone else where ever they originate from.

How many Brits emmigrated to India compared to the tens thousands from India who arrive in the UK every year and the thousands more who would like to plus of course those who are illegal.
Do you have any numbers to support your claims.
Are there 30,000 plus illegals from the US and Australia in the UK..
If you want equality as you keep posting then forget India and
discuss the claims of all those from anywhere in the world who would like to live and work in the UK.[/QUOTE]

I have no idea but you have belief??

I cannot give figures for British living and workng in India just personal knowledge.

Illegals from Australia and USA see post from DavelovesDee.

I speak about India because obviously it is the country that I know (this is an expat forum), and it has a close relationship with the UK. I agree that there should be equality of entry for immigrants including those from the EU.

EMR Nov 19th 2016 7:45 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Bipat (Post 12108841)
A;12108717]You have no idea what the rules regarding immigration will be post brexit.
If the majority of brexit voters got their way it would be just a few tens thousands a year.
My belief is that nett immigration will continue to be in excess of 150,000 and that a degree of free movement will continue as the price for free access to the EU markets.
There will be no significant changes for anyone else where ever they originate from.

How many Brits emmigrated to India compared to the tens thousands from India who arrive in the UK every year and the thousands more who would like to plus of course those who are illegal.
Do you have any numbers to support your claims.
Are there 30,000 plus illegals from the US and Australia in the UK..
If you want equality as you keep posting then forget India and discuss the claims of all those from anywhere in the world who would like to live and work in the UK.

I have no idea but you have belief??

I cannot give figures for British living and workng in India just personal knowledge.

Illegals from Australia and USA see post DavelovesDee.

I speak about India because obviously it is the country that know (this is an expat forum), and it has a close relationship with theUK. I agree that there should be equality of entry for immigrants including those from the EU.[/QUOTE]

Equality is what yiu are going to get, what you voted for,
If the ultra brexuters get their way, even tighter restrictions that will apply to everyone who wants to live and work in the UK..
Unless you are wealthier enough to be exempted.

Bipat Nov 19th 2016 7:59 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 
EMR---something has happened to your quote!

Apparently you prefer the inequality of more EU citizens coming to the UK?

EMR Nov 19th 2016 8:12 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Bipat (Post 12108847)
EMR---something has happened to your quote!

Apparently you prefer the inequality of more EU citizens coming to the UK?

Nothing happened to my quote, you should check your reply.

I repeat , you want equality, so do all those who want to reduce nett immigrstion to a few tens thousands.
That means tighter regulations for all.
It what you voted for.
88000 skilled and qualified non EU migrants does not look like the inequality you keep complaining about..

Free movement for EU citizens gives EQUAL status to UK citizens, it is also reciprocity for free access to the EU markets.
Anyone would think reading your posts that non EU migrants were a tiny minority when the facts prove otherwise..

DaveLovesDee Nov 19th 2016 8:31 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 
Here's an article on the most common immigration nationalities in 2006. I'll try to find a more recent one.

Most illegal migrants likely to be white


Long-stay immigrants into the UK from Poland, India and China are outnumbered by Germans, South Africans, North Americans, people from the white Commonwealth and returning Britons.

Official figures show that of the top ten migrant countries in 2008, 137,000 were from the first group and 152,000 from the second group.

There is no debate in the media, among politicians and among the public concerning North Americans and the white Commonwealth.
Control of Immigration:
Statistics - United Kingdom - 2006

EMR Nov 19th 2016 8:55 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee (Post 12108868)
Here's an article on the most common immigration nationalities in 2006. I'll try to find a more recent one.

Most illegal migrants likely to be white



Control of Immigration:
Statistics - United Kingdom - 2006

The Office of National statistics has figures for 2015, which show a significant increase in non EU migration to the UK.
The figure quoted fir the previous 12 months was 193,000.
Visas granted India at almost 89,000 was just behind China in second place.
Again little evidence of inequality.

DaveLovesDee Nov 19th 2016 9:16 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by EMR (Post 12108876)
The Office of National statistics has figures for 2015, which show a significant increase in non EU migration to the UK.
The figure quoted fir the previous 12 months was 193,000.
Again little evidence of inequality.

I don't think Bipat is looking for equality of numbers, but of equality in terms of requiring the same visas to enter. Which isn't guaranteed to happen post-Brexit.

ONS Migration Statistics -August 2016

EMR Nov 19th 2016 9:25 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee (Post 12108884)
I don't think Bipat is looking for equality of numbers, but of equality in terms of requiring the same visas to enter. Which isn't guaranteed to happen post-Brexit.

ONS Migration Statistics -August 2016

The brexit immigration claims are about numbers , only numbers and as you suggest those looking for equal treatment between EU and non EU migrants may well find that the rules get even tighter for non EU migrants.

Red Eric Nov 19th 2016 12:37 pm

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee (Post 12108732)
If the UK brought in national ID cards for UK nationals, like most EU countries have for their countries (and have many countries worldwide), then working out who is illegal would be much easier.

The UK already issues Residence Cards to EU and non-EU nationals. All it takes is political will, which we don't have.

Good idea - that'd sit very snugly indeed with the new Investigatory Powers Act. In fact, why not make it compulsory to carry the card around at all times and give the police the powers to arrest and detain anyone not complying?

Lion in Winter Nov 19th 2016 1:04 pm

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Red Eric (Post 12108974)
Good idea - that'd sit very snugly indeed with the new Investigatory Powers Act. In fact, why not make it compulsory to carry the card around at all times and give the police the powers to arrest and detain anyone not complying?

Armbands. Require identifying armbands. So much quicker than getting a card out and it would allow members of the public to join in the fun. Besides, we know it works because it has been used before...

DaveLovesDee Nov 19th 2016 1:19 pm

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Red Eric (Post 12108974)
Good idea - that'd sit very snugly indeed with the new Investigatory Powers Act. In fact, why not make it compulsory to carry the card around at all times and give the police the powers to arrest and detain anyone not complying?

ID cards and the new Investigatory Powers Act are 2 entirely separate issues, but as you've demonstrated quickly enough, too many in the UK see ID cards as a tool of a Police state.

Most of us already carry photo ID in the form of a driving licence. There'd be no need for arresting people for not carrying an ID card, but an ID card would make it easier to prove identity to open bank accounts, prove identity for employment/benefit applications, and many other things where we're asked to prove our identity.

I do agree that such a system could be mis-used, but it works well across Europe. But maybe that's also part of the problem, because many don't see ourselves as European. In Malta, Residence Cards were free. I suspect they are in most countries where they're mandatory.

Lion in Winter Nov 19th 2016 1:35 pm

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee (Post 12109005)
ID cards and the new Investigatory Powers Act are 2 entirely separate issues, but as you've demonstrated quickly enough, too many in the UK see ID cards as a tool of a Police state.

Most of us already carry photo ID in the form of a driving licence. There'd be no need for arresting people for not carrying an ID card, but an ID card would make it easier to prove identity to open bank accounts, prove identity for employment/benefit applications, and many other things where we're asked to prove our identity.

I do agree that such a system could be mis-used, but it works well across Europe. But maybe that's also part of the problem, because many don't see ourselves as European. In Malta, Residence Cards were free. I suspect they are in most countries where they're mandatory.

Our rights not to have to carry ID are still protected. You don't have to carry your driver's license, but if you are stopped while driving the officer has the right to ask you for it. If you don't have it, you have to show it in person at a police station within 7 days. That's quite enough for me thanks. Governments should be there to support the public good and work for us, not monitor us. We already have cameras watching in cities everywhere. So "no thanks" to any more of that sort of thing.


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