Post EU Referendum
Mar 20th 2018, 10:56 am
Banned
Joined: Jun 2015
Location: Algarve, Portugal.
Posts: 4,478
Re: Post EU Referendum
I’ve already pointed out The Charter of Fundamental Rights of the European Union.
https://ec.europa.eu/info/aid-develo...ntal-rights_en
Have you glanced at it? Taken in the value of it?
This is what Brits are expected so joyfully to surrender next year for a devalued status via promised future ‘care’ of a largely faceless elite.
In summary Citizens have Rights (and responsibilities) usually expressed by written Constitution, guaranteed & balanced by an independent protective organ, normally a Court.
Subjects don’t. Their hobbled liberties are granted by restrictive piecemeal laws - usually totally disproportionate to the actual need of the time, and then discarded in the blink of an administrative eye, like a pet given an occasional inadequate scrap. Without Constitution, power is the sole preserve of the few (the ‘law givers’ chant of the swivel-eyed loons).
In Britain, history shows lots of blinks whenever its non-representative strata considers it suitable to their interests; - enabled by its cankerous lack of oversight and accountability of its head of state.
To name but a few, its restrictive trade union laws, the dependency culture created by an anaemically kept state & money centred further education systems, and finally the restrictive access to justice without money.
What I genuinely can’t understand here is why so many are so keen to condemn not only themselves, but their kids & grand-kids back into social serfdom. I conclude they just didn’t deserve their current status in the first place. I hope you enjoy your chlorinated chicken, fracking and privatised NHS. Truly it's deserved.
Talk about BBC & Daily Mail conditioning...
https://ec.europa.eu/info/aid-develo...ntal-rights_en
Have you glanced at it? Taken in the value of it?
This is what Brits are expected so joyfully to surrender next year for a devalued status via promised future ‘care’ of a largely faceless elite.
In summary Citizens have Rights (and responsibilities) usually expressed by written Constitution, guaranteed & balanced by an independent protective organ, normally a Court.
Subjects don’t. Their hobbled liberties are granted by restrictive piecemeal laws - usually totally disproportionate to the actual need of the time, and then discarded in the blink of an administrative eye, like a pet given an occasional inadequate scrap. Without Constitution, power is the sole preserve of the few (the ‘law givers’ chant of the swivel-eyed loons).
In Britain, history shows lots of blinks whenever its non-representative strata considers it suitable to their interests; - enabled by its cankerous lack of oversight and accountability of its head of state.
To name but a few, its restrictive trade union laws, the dependency culture created by an anaemically kept state & money centred further education systems, and finally the restrictive access to justice without money.
What I genuinely can’t understand here is why so many are so keen to condemn not only themselves, but their kids & grand-kids back into social serfdom. I conclude they just didn’t deserve their current status in the first place. I hope you enjoy your chlorinated chicken, fracking and privatised NHS. Truly it's deserved.
Talk about BBC & Daily Mail conditioning...
Mar 20th 2018, 11:31 am
Democracy advocate
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 11,880
Re: Post EU Referendum
Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee
I must stop drinking coffee when reading your posts. The keyboard keeps wearing it.
Mar 20th 2018, 11:34 am
Democracy advocate
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 11,880
Re: Post EU Referendum
Originally Posted by EMR
Smog apparently is going to join a protest by fishermen and flinging fish ( or get one of his serfs to do it ) at the houses of Parliament.
I cannot understand why they are getting so upset, we are leaving its what they voted for.
I cannot understand why they are getting so upset, we are leaving its what they voted for.
Mar 20th 2018, 11:35 am
Democracy advocate
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 11,880
Re: Post EU Referendum
Originally Posted by 007Steve
I’ve already pointed out The Charter of Fundamental Rights of the European Union.
https://ec.europa.eu/info/aid-develo...ntal-rights_en
Have you glanced at it? Taken in the value of it?
This is what Brits are expected so joyfully to surrender next year for a devalued status via promised future ‘care’ of a largely faceless elite.
In summary Citizens have Rights (and responsibilities) usually expressed by written Constitution, guaranteed & balanced by an independent protective organ, normally a Court.
Subjects don’t. Their hobbled liberties are granted by restrictive piecemeal laws - usually totally disproportionate to the actual need of the time, and then discarded in the blink of an administrative eye, like a pet given an occasional inadequate scrap. Without Constitution, power is the sole preserve of the few (the ‘law givers’ chant of the swivel-eyed loons).
In Britain, history shows lots of blinks whenever its non-representative strata considers it suitable to their interests; - enabled by its cankerous lack of oversight and accountability of its head of state.
To name but a few, its restrictive trade union laws, the dependency culture created by an anaemically kept state & money centred further education systems, and finally the restrictive access to justice without money.
What I genuinely can’t understand here is why so many are so keen to condemn not only themselves, but their kids & grand-kids back into social serfdom. I conclude they just didn’t deserve their current status in the first place. I hope you enjoy your chlorinated chicken, fracking and privatised NHS. Truly it's deserved.
Talk about BBC & Daily Mail conditioning...
https://ec.europa.eu/info/aid-develo...ntal-rights_en
Have you glanced at it? Taken in the value of it?
This is what Brits are expected so joyfully to surrender next year for a devalued status via promised future ‘care’ of a largely faceless elite.
In summary Citizens have Rights (and responsibilities) usually expressed by written Constitution, guaranteed & balanced by an independent protective organ, normally a Court.
Subjects don’t. Their hobbled liberties are granted by restrictive piecemeal laws - usually totally disproportionate to the actual need of the time, and then discarded in the blink of an administrative eye, like a pet given an occasional inadequate scrap. Without Constitution, power is the sole preserve of the few (the ‘law givers’ chant of the swivel-eyed loons).
In Britain, history shows lots of blinks whenever its non-representative strata considers it suitable to their interests; - enabled by its cankerous lack of oversight and accountability of its head of state.
To name but a few, its restrictive trade union laws, the dependency culture created by an anaemically kept state & money centred further education systems, and finally the restrictive access to justice without money.
What I genuinely can’t understand here is why so many are so keen to condemn not only themselves, but their kids & grand-kids back into social serfdom. I conclude they just didn’t deserve their current status in the first place. I hope you enjoy your chlorinated chicken, fracking and privatised NHS. Truly it's deserved.
Talk about BBC & Daily Mail conditioning...
Mar 20th 2018, 11:43 am
FreeThinker
Joined: Nov 2009
Location: the moors and levels
Posts: 9,437
Re: Post EU Referendum
Originally Posted by Cape Blue
They are upset because the EU is still the daddy when it comes to fishing grounds during the transition.
Remember - they voted for whatever comes next provided we leave - there were no details on the voting slip which allows the government to do what they want and make it up as they go along. It was pointed out many times that it would be a complete mess but they still voted for it.
Also, oddly, whatever happens they appear to be happy to let the government just get on with it, unlike many remainers who would like a final say.
Their fault.
Mar 20th 2018, 11:53 am
EU and me, happy together
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 22,836
Re: Post EU Referendum
Originally Posted by Cape Blue
They are upset because the EU is still the daddy when it comes to fishing grounds during the transition.
Mar 20th 2018, 12:10 pm
Democracy advocate
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 11,880
Re: Post EU Referendum
Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee
Because that's what the UK agreed to in return for something they wanted. Has the media told us what that was yet?
Mar 20th 2018, 12:27 pm
EU and me, happy together
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 22,836
Re: Post EU Referendum
Originally Posted by Cape Blue
Probably for just agreeing that there will be a transition at all.
But hasn't the UK just agreed to the same deal that was on the table a year ago?
Mar 20th 2018, 12:38 pm
Forum Regular
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 191
Re: Post EU Referendum
Originally Posted by Shard
The majority of the UK are clueless in matters of international trade and sovereignty. If we Brexit and pull away from the EU, many of the citizens disgruntled with the EU foreigners will be equally disgruntled with the global foreigners. Saying that it can all be resolved by electing a new government disregards the hard choices that will have to be made.
Mar 20th 2018, 12:43 pm
Banned
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 26,724
Re: Post EU Referendum
Originally Posted by Cape Blue
They are upset because the EU is still the daddy when it comes to fishing grounds during the transition.
We need access to their waters for the 75 % of fish caught by UK boats that we then export.
EU boats and not allowed to fish our inshore waters under current regulations.
Mar 20th 2018, 12:45 pm
Banned
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 26,724
Re: Post EU Referendum
Originally Posted by Golden Years
The difference between "EU foreigners" and "global foreigners" as you call them is that the UK currently only has control of the latter. After the transition period the UK will have control of both categories.
As you say we will have control of the 200,000 plus who will still come to the UK.
Mar 20th 2018, 1:13 pm
EU and me, happy together
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 22,836
Re: Post EU Referendum
Originally Posted by Golden Years
The difference between "EU foreigners" and "global foreigners" as you call them is that the UK currently only has control of the latter. After the transition period the UK will have control of both categories.
If the government can't or won't reduce the migrant numbers it already has the ability to control, what makes you think future EU national numbers will be reduced?
Mar 20th 2018, 1:48 pm
Reasonable Bitch
Joined: Feb 2011
Location: Mallorca
Posts: 18,191
Re: Post EU Referendum
Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee
Yes the UK currently only has control over the non-EU foreigners, but it's repeatedly promised at election time to bring the numbers down to tens of thousands. That it has not done so lies squarely on the government's shoulders.
If the government can't or won't reduce the migrant numbers it already has the ability to control, what makes you think future EU national numbers will be reduced?
If the government can't or won't reduce the migrant numbers it already has the ability to control, what makes you think future EU national numbers will be reduced?
So, no worries. Conditions in Europe are improving all the time, and there's no evidence Brexit will bring any upside to England... So it's likely European migration numbers will fall quite naturally, without having to kick them out.
Mar 20th 2018, 1:49 pm
Banned
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 26,724
Re: Post EU Referendum
Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee
Yes the UK currently only has control over the non-EU foreigners, but it's repeatedly promised at election time to bring the numbers down to tens of thousands. That it has not done so lies squarely on the government's shoulders.
If the government can't or won't reduce the migrant numbers it already has the ability to control, what makes you think future EU national numbers will be reduced?
If the government can't or won't reduce the migrant numbers it already has the ability to control, what makes you think future EU national numbers will be reduced?
Mar 20th 2018, 1:59 pm
Forum Regular
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 191
Re: Post EU Referendum
Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee
Yes the UK currently only has control over the non-EU foreigners, but it's repeatedly promised at election time to bring the numbers down to tens of thousands. That it has not done so lies squarely on the government's shoulders.
If the government can't or won't reduce the migrant numbers it already has the ability to control, what makes you think future EU national numbers will be reduced?
If the government can't or won't reduce the migrant numbers it already has the ability to control, what makes you think future EU national numbers will be reduced?
