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Post EU Referendum

Post EU Referendum

Old Jan 19th 2018, 10:51 am
  #27106  
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Default Re: Post EU Referendum

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee View Post
Let's make this simple.

External border controls are NOT the EU's responsibility. It the responsibility of each member state.
If that's true then why does Frontex exist? It's my understanding that Frontex was created by the EU because Italy wasn't equipped to do the job on its own.

In any case, if the EU is to encourage membership of Schengen and even punish member states from temporarily controlling their land borders like they did with Germany a couple of years ago then the EU needs to take at least some responsibility for securing Schengen's external points of entry.
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Old Jan 19th 2018, 11:03 am
  #27107  
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Default Re: Post EU Referendum

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost View Post
If that's true then why does Frontex exist? It's my understanding that Frontex was created by the EU because Italy wasn't equipped to do the job on its own.

In any case, if the EU is to encourage membership of Schengen and even punish member states from temporarily controlling their land borders like they did with Germany a couple of years ago then the EU needs to take at least some responsibility for securing Schengen's external points of entry.
nope it was expanded in remit due to migrant crisis not created and was as much about Bulgaria as Italy.
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Old Jan 19th 2018, 11:08 am
  #27108  
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Default Re: Post EU Referendum

Originally Posted by Garbatellamike View Post
nope it was expanded in remit due to migrant crisis not created and was as much about Bulgaria as Italy.
Really? Everything I've read has suggested it was to replace Mare Nostrum because that program was costing the Italians a fortune and they couldn't really afford it anymore.
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Old Jan 19th 2018, 11:16 am
  #27109  
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Default Re: Post EU Referendum

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost View Post
Really? Everything I've read has suggested it was to replace Mare Nostrum because that program was costing the Italians a fortune and they couldn't really afford it anymore.
Frontex existed prior to Mare Nostrum which was a specific SAR operation at the tactical level.
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Old Jan 19th 2018, 11:22 am
  #27110  
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Default Re: Post EU Referendum

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost View Post
If that's true then why does Frontex exist? It's my understanding that Frontex was created by the EU because Italy wasn't equipped to do the job on its own.
Frontex coordinates the external border controls of EU member states.

In any case, if the EU is to encourage membership of Schengen and even punish member states from temporarily controlling their land borders like they did with Germany a couple of years ago then the EU needs to take at least some responsibility for securing Schengen's external points of entry.
Not the UK's problem. We're not in Schengen, and despite UKIP and Leave's claims, they weren't coming to the U.K..
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Old Jan 19th 2018, 11:26 am
  #27111  
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Default Re: Post EU Referendum

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost View Post
In any case, if the EU is to encourage membership of Schengen and even punish member states from temporarily controlling their land borders like they did with Germany a couple of years ago then the EU needs to take at least some responsibility for securing Schengen's external points of entry.
"The Schengen Borders Code provides Member States with the capability of temporarily reintroducing border control at the internal borders in the event that a serious threat to public policy or internal security has been established."
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Old Jan 19th 2018, 11:27 am
  #27112  
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Default Re: Post EU Referendum

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee View Post

Not the UK's problem. We're not in Schengen, and despite UKIP and Leave's claims, they weren't coming to the U.K..
I think considerable numbers may have tried actually and succeeded in some cases.
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Old Jan 19th 2018, 11:27 am
  #27113  
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Default Re: Post EU Referendum

Originally Posted by Expatrick View Post
"The Schengen Borders Code provides Member States with the capability of temporarily reintroducing border control at the internal borders in the event that a serious threat to public policy or internal security has been established."
The key word there being temporarily.
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Old Jan 19th 2018, 11:28 am
  #27114  
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Default Re: Post EU Referendum

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost View Post
The key word there being temporarily.
Er, obviously.
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Old Jan 19th 2018, 11:34 am
  #27115  
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Default Re: Post EU Referendum

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost View Post
I think considerable numbers may have tried actually and succeeded in some cases.
Think?

No evidence though! Again!

I realise it must be difficult to use Google/Bing/Yahoo to research your assertions, and to supply sources to back up your claims, but maybe you can find an IT professional to help you.
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Old Jan 19th 2018, 11:39 am
  #27116  
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Default Re: Post EU Referendum

Originally Posted by Expatrick View Post
Frontex existed prior to Mare Nostrum which was a specific SAR operation at the tactical level.
yes and Mare Nostrum, literally Our Seas, was an Italian national operation nothing to do with EU.
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Old Jan 19th 2018, 11:40 am
  #27117  
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Default Re: Post EU Referendum

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee View Post
I realise it must be difficult to use Google/Bing/Yahoo to research your assertions, and to supply sources to back up your claims, but maybe you can find an IT professional to help you.
Pffft.

Extreme lefty organisations the lot of them. And peddlers of fake news.
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Old Jan 19th 2018, 11:41 am
  #27118  
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Default Re: Post EU Referendum

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee View Post
Think?

No evidence though! Again!

I realise it must be difficult to use Google/Bing/Yahoo to research your assertions, and to supply sources to back up your claims, but maybe you can find an IT professional to help you.
I shouldn't need to provide evidence for things that are basically common sense but here you go:

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...-calais-jungle

Gangs smuggling people into UK advertising their services on Facebook and Twitter
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Old Jan 19th 2018, 11:41 am
  #27119  
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Default Re: Post EU Referendum

Originally Posted by Expatrick View Post
Frontex existed prior to Mare Nostrum which was a specific SAR operation at the OPERATIONAL level.
FIFY Mare Nostrum was run from the COI at Centocelle with TACON TO HQ Navy.
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Old Jan 19th 2018, 11:58 am
  #27120  
 
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Default Re: Post EU Referendum

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
I'm not twisting anything. You have made a statement that most countries simply detain, process and deport their illegal immigrants. I have offered you evidence that they do no such thing except with a tiny minority. You have offered no counter examples that prove your statement, but you have added some examples that prove mine. In addition, you complain about the French yet offer no viable solution even by example.

I would also remind you that undocumented immigrants in the US do not only come from Mexico.

5 facts about illegal immigration in the U.S. | Pew Research Center
Originally Posted by DigitalGhost View Post
I know that. In fact I provided evidence to prove that to someone else on here recently.

Mexico is still the main transit route for illegal entry into the US though is it not. America has its airports pretty much locked down at this point but people from all over the world have transited in through Mexico. You can even find warnings written in Chinese along the border in some states.

But you still haven't answered the question as to which country is just rounding up its undocumented immigrants, "processing them", and deporting them as you stated is done. Certainly the US deports some, but then so do the UK and France. Example, please, of a country that actually is deporting in the way you stated?

You are also not clear on how people become illegal immigrants in the US. Despite your image of "locked down" airports and bad hombres crossing deserts and rivers at night, more than half of the immigrants acquiring "illegal status" in the US, at least since 2007 when this research was done, arrived perfectly legally, largely through airports, on perfectly legal, fully-processed visas. In 2014, these people represented two thirds of those who acquired "illegal" status when their visas expired but they didn't leave.

The 2,000 Mile Wall in Search of a Purpose: Since 2007 Visa Overstays have Outnumbered Undocumented Border Crossers by a Half Million - The Center for Migration Studies of New York (CMS)
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