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-   -   Post EU Referendum (https://britishexpats.com/forum/take-outside-67/post-eu-referendum-879308/)

mfesharne Aug 28th 2016 9:08 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by jimenato (Post 12036902)
So basically you haven't got a clue - you're just guessing. You actually have no idea about, and no influence whatever over what is to come.

No more idea & no more influence than you or anyone else because I don't have a crystal ball any more than anyone else does.

My point as I'm sure you understand but try to ignore is that the majority have voted for Brexit so that's what'll happen & the terms of Brexit will only be known when Brexit is complete........ Which is why (IMO) TM needs to trigger A50 asap...... & I see in the media today she's under increasing pressure to do just that.

As with the referendum, the US election & most other things in life, time will tell.

jimenato Aug 28th 2016 9:13 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by mfesharne (Post 12036931)
No more idea & no more influence than you or anyone else because I don't have a crystal ball any more than anyone else does.

My point as I'm sure you understand but try to ignore is that the majority have voted for Brexit so that's what'll happen & the terms of Brexit will only be known when Brexit is complete........ Which is why (IMO) TM needs to trigger A50 asap...... & I see in the media today she's under increasing pressure to do just that.

As with the referendum, the US election & most other things in life, time will tell.

I know only too well that the majority voted for Brexit - basically led by the nose like lambs to the slaughter by a bunch of liars - and now - amazingly, they don't know and, even more amazingly don't care, what the outcome will be.

And you call remainers sheeple?:sneaky:

Red Eric Aug 28th 2016 9:52 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by mfesharne (Post 12036931)
My point as I'm sure you understand but try to ignore is that the majority have voted for Brexit so that's what'll happen & the terms of Brexit will only be known when Brexit is complete........ Which is why (IMO) TM needs to trigger A50 asap...... & I see in the media today she's under increasing pressure to do just that.

So, in your opinion (and "the media"s?), Article 50 should be triggered before Johnson, Fox and Davis & co have finished their dispute (and their tutorials ;))and made up their minds what they want to aim for? And before it's clear who they'll be dealing with in France and Germany owing to the upcoming elections?

Red Eric Aug 28th 2016 9:56 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by jimenato (Post 12036937)
And you call remainers sheeple?:sneaky:

Yeah, but admit it - you laugh, don't you? I mean, it's so witty and original. Like Remainiacs and EUSSR and dictatorship.

mfesharne Aug 28th 2016 10:13 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Red Eric (Post 12036973)
So, in your opinion (and "the media"s?), Article 50 should be triggered before Johnson, Fox and Davis & co have finished their dispute (and their tutorials ;))and made up their minds what they want to aim for? And before it's clear who they'll be dealing with in France and Germany owing to the upcoming elections?

I think A50 needs to be triggered so that the Brexit negotiations can begin but I've said that previously.

Red Eric Aug 28th 2016 10:24 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by mfesharne (Post 12036995)
I think A50 needs to be triggered so that the Brexit negotiations can begin but I've said that previously.

How are the UK negotiators supposed to negotiate if they don't know what they're negotiating for? Should they just go along and ask for the EU's best offer?

mfesharne Aug 28th 2016 10:58 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Red Eric (Post 12037000)
How are the UK negotiators supposed to negotiate if they don't know what they're negotiating for? Should they just go along and ask for the EU's best offer?

Where did I suggest that?

They've had time to get a wish list together & nothing can be decided until negotiations begin so let's get on with it.

jimenato Aug 28th 2016 11:03 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Red Eric (Post 12037000)
How are the UK negotiators supposed to negotiate if they don't know what they're negotiating for? Should they just go along and ask for the EU's best offer?

Don't expect an answer.

mfesharne likes awkward questions but only if they are totally pointless.

Red Eric Aug 28th 2016 11:16 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by mfesharne (Post 12037024)
Where did I suggest that?

They've had time to get a wish list together & nothing can be decided until negotiations begin so let's get on with it.

I thought you were keeping up with the news.

The UK government is at odds internally about their starting position for negotiations, particularly vis-a-vis how much access they want to the single market.

You're saying get ON with triggering Article 50, then we can start the negotiations.

The two are incompatible. If the UK wants the best deal possible, it's going to have to set out its stall before triggering A50 and then it's still all dependent on how the negotiations go as to how much of that they get.

Advocating that they start negotiations before deciding on their starting position is madness. According to some commentators, autumn 2017 could still see us waiting for Article 50 to be triggered - aren't you happy to wait that long if it would guarantee that the UK team were fully committed to getting a particular deal by then? Would you rather they went in arguing their differences and having that leaked all over the world's press?

Besides, they have yet to decide how Article 50 can legally be triggered ie with or without the consent of Parliament and the House of Lords ;)

jimenato Aug 28th 2016 11:17 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 
The point here is that the leavers have now lost interest in what happens - they don't actually care what the end result of all this is going to be.

Thinking about it, that's probably why mfesharne asks daft questions like "what do you 'like' about the EU" - he doesn't like to think abut the future - can't really blame him I suppose.

Anyway, they haven't a clue what 'Brexit' is (bizarrely as they voted for it) and they seem to be quite prepared to let the politicians get on with it and make all the decisions about the outcome for them.

They have jumped off a cliff with no idea of what is at the bottom. Trouble is they have dragged everyone else with them.

Red Eric Aug 28th 2016 11:30 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by jimenato (Post 12037038)
The point here is that the leavers have now lost interest in what happens - they don't actually care what the end result of all this is going to be.

I've noticed that, too. Their main preoccupation at the moment seems to be finding opportunities to hurl out insults and jibes - wonder how long it'll be before May and her cabinet are the targets of those? I expect the Express or Breitbart or Arron Banks or someone will blow the starting whistle on that any time now...

Wol Aug 28th 2016 11:32 am

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by jimenato (Post 12037038)
The point here is that the leavers have now lost interest in what happens - they don't actually care what the end result of all this is going to be.

Thinking about it, that's probably why mfesharne asks daft questions like "what do you 'like' about the EU" - he doesn't like to think abut the future - can't really blame him I suppose.

Anyway, they haven't a clue what 'Brexit' is (bizarrely as they voted for it) and they seem to be quite prepared to let the politicians get on with it and make all the decisions about the outcome for them.

They have jumped off a cliff with no idea of what is at the bottom. Trouble is they have dragged everyone else with them.

Bizarre post.

I'm afraid that, like the late Ami, you can't stop yourself putting quotes into others' heads.

Brexit is all about regaining control over the people/system that governs us. Frankly, everything else comes second.

If the EU was to reform in a meaningful way I am sure that many Brexiters would accept it. But there is zero chance of that.

It is beyond reform. The CAP, the farce of the fisheries, the Euro pushing some countries into permanent depression, the migrant crises with each state making up policy on the hoof - all these and more are symptoms of a project that can never be alowed to fail and, as such, will eventually cause just that.

jimenato Aug 28th 2016 12:01 pm

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Wol (Post 12037048)
Bizarre post.

I'm afraid that, like the late Ami, you can't stop yourself putting quotes into others' heads.

Brexit is all about regaining control over the people/system that governs us. Frankly, everything else comes second.

If the EU was to reform in a meaningful way I am sure that many Brexiters would accept it. But there is zero chance of that.

It is beyond reform. The CAP, the farce of the fisheries, the Euro pushing some countries into permanent depression, the migrant crises with each state making up policy on the hoof - all these and more are symptoms of a project that can never be alowed to fail and, as such, will eventually cause just that.

So are you happy to go along with whatever the politicians now come up with?

Red Eric Aug 28th 2016 12:23 pm

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Wol (Post 12037048)
If the EU was to reform in a meaningful way I am sure that many Brexiters would accept it. But there is zero chance of that.

The EU has reformed all sorts of things in meaningful ways. It just wasn't presented that way in the UK and the blame for that lies on all sides but most particularly with a combination of a hostile press and a feeble government.

DaveLovesDee Aug 28th 2016 12:40 pm

re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Red Eric (Post 12037063)
The EU has reformed all sorts of things in meaningful ways. It just wasn't presented that way in the UK and the blame for that lies on all sides but most particularly with a combination of a hostile press and a feeble government.

The UK was due to hold the Presidency of the EU in 2018, but that's unlikely to happen now, isn't it.

After all, why be in charge of a club you don't want to be a member of?


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