British Expats

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-   -   Post EU Referendum (https://britishexpats.com/forum/take-outside-67/post-eu-referendum-879308/)

lutonlad Mar 31st 2017 8:33 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by SultanOfSwing (Post 12218432)
60% is fair. I really also think that a referendum (really all elections, too) should be a mandatory vote. The turnout for the referendum was 72%, which was a large turnout, but it still left nearly 14 million votes uncast. For an issue which will impact every single person in the UK, it should be a 95% or better turnout, IMO.



I don't know why there would be fear of a 2nd referendum other than they might feel that the general opinion of the UK has shifted away from Brexit post-vote.

I have to think that if enough concessions were granted, it could send the vote the other way.

Correct. And if meaningful concessions had been achieved by Cameron, Remain would have been the likely outcome.

la mancha Mar 31st 2017 8:48 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Red Eric (Post 12218379)
I don't really see what you mean, no. You could, at a pinch, describe that as a negative comment but you'd be pushing it on the accuracy even then. Government ministers have refused to back up de Pfeffle on his cake scenario and have also distanced themselves from Davis on his equally ridiculous claim as quoted by iano earlier today. Philip Hammond expressly and very publicly ruled out the Cake Plan.

But that aside, no, what ami said most definitely doesn't sound as though she wants the UK (not just Britain - remember? Unless you're expecting another break-up within the next 2 years) to fail. Just being realistic and in keeping with what even this (now) most pro your-type-of-Brexit government has itself admitted.

When someone spends a year posting negative views with nothing to back them up except their own opinions and links to the media for an event which has not happened then, yes, I do think those views sound as if they want the UK to fail. I would not say those views sound as if they want the UK to succeed. Would you?

You can believe what you want to believe and I shall believe what I believe. We have all shown our cards and we can all make up our own minds.

SultanOfSwing Mar 31st 2017 8:50 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by lutonlad (Post 12218485)
Correct. And if meaningful concessions had been achieved by Cameron, Remain would have been the likely outcome.

I still think the whole thing feels kind of rushed into, to be honest.

Annetje Mar 31st 2017 8:59 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 
Just read somewhere a Brexiter who said : I didn't vote to take back control, just to having to start working !!!!! :rofl:

amideislas Mar 31st 2017 9:09 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by la mancha (Post 12218497)
When someone spends a year posting negative views with nothing to back them up except their own opinions and links to the media for an event which has not happened then, yes, I do think those views sound as if they want the UK to fail. I would not say those views sound as if they want the UK to succeed. Would you?

You can believe what you want to believe and I shall believe what I believe. We have all shown our cards and we can all make up our own minds.

Sorry, manch, but the evidence I've provided is hardly in dispute. You, on the other hand, seem to spend your tine discrediting what I say, with nothing more than your opinions, or just downright denial of uncontested truth.

But at the end of the day, the fact remains that nobody wins, everybody loses. And I think even you can appreciate that (although I do acknowledge that it's not in your interests to do so).

There is one very basic question that I've asked repeatedly, and not once have you or anyone else been able to offer any tangible answer to, so, now I'll ask it again;

Where is the tangible upside in Brexit?

I mean tangible, not theoretical or ideological, not an opinion. Just something you can actually quantify. (?)

Dick Dasterdly Mar 31st 2017 10:12 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by la mancha (Post 12218497)
When someone spends a year posting negative views with nothing to back them up except their own opinions and links to the media for an event which has not happened then, yes, I do think those views sound as if they want the UK to fail. I would not say those views sound as if they want the UK to succeed. Would you?

You can believe what you want to believe and I shall believe what I believe. We have all shown our cards and we can all make up our own minds.

Precisely.

There have been far more positives than negatives since the referendum and the widely predicted post referendum Armageddon simply didn't happen.

Personally I find it hard to comprehend the mentality of those who make it so obvious they are so desperate for Brexit to fail.

I can to a certain degree understand the post referendum sour grapes and bitterness of those who expected Remain to win,
but the reason why they continue in that same hateful, spiteful mode, so long afterwards, rather than moving on, is way beyond belief.

:cool:

EMR Mar 31st 2017 10:20 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Dick Dasterdly (Post 12218551)
Precisely.

There have been far more positives than negatives since the referendum and the widely predicted post referendum Armageddon simply didn't happen.

Personally I find it hard to comprehend the mentality of those who make it so obvious they are so desperate for Brexit to fail.

I can to a certain degree understand the post referendum sour grapes and bitterness of those who expected Remain to win,
but the reason why they continue in that same hateful, spiteful mode, so long afterwards, rather than moving on, is way beyond belief.

:cool:

Given your insane anti EU rants, sometimes multiple times a day you need to look up the meaning of sour grapes, bitterness, hateful spiteful etc and apply them to yourself.
.

Dick Dasterdly Mar 31st 2017 10:32 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by EMR (Post 12218554)
Given your insane anti EU rants, sometimes multiple times a day you need to look up the meaning of sour grapes, bitterness, hateful spiteful etc and apply them to yourself.
.

The only other hate and insanity within Europe at present seems to come directly from Brussels.

I thought they'd already made enemies of just about everyone possible,
East and West, North and South as well as within their own organisation and member countries.

However old Junkie seems to have taken EU insanity to a whole new level, with his virtual declaration of war on the USA !

With the end of WW2, most folk were hoping we'd seen the last of mad, insane Dictators,
but the Eu is certainly proving that belief entirely wrong, by producing a whole new crop all of its own making !

mrken30 Mar 31st 2017 10:56 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Dick Dasterdly (Post 12218561)
The only other hate and insanity within Europe at present seems to come directly from Brussels.

I thought they'd already made enemies of just about everyone possible,
East and West, North and South as well as within their own organisation and member countries.

However old Junkie seems to have taken EU insanity to a whole new level, with his virtual declaration of war on the USA !

With the end of WW2, most folk were hoping we'd seen the last of mad, insane Dictators,
but the Eu is certainly proving that belief entirely wrong, by producing a whole new crop all of its own making !

The big players in WW2 were elected into power

Vexcore Apr 1st 2017 1:22 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 
Seems freedom of speech has been taken away ohh dear...

Nice one Jersey.


You could of at least edited the post then if you didn't like it.


You little dictator (good job)

DaveLovesDee Apr 1st 2017 2:06 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by lutonlad (Post 12218485)
Correct. And if meaningful concessions had been achieved by Cameron, Remain would have been the likely outcome.

Cameron got most of the concessions he asked for. But because he didn't ask for more, he was forced into a corner. Call a referendum, or give into the hardliners.


Originally Posted by Vexcore (Post 12218616)
Seems freedom of speech has been taken away ohh dear...

Nice one Jersey.


You could of at least edited the post then if you didn't like it.


You little dictator (good job)

:ban: ?

SultanOfSwing Apr 1st 2017 4:43 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Vexcore (Post 12218616)
Seems freedom of speech has been taken away ohh dear...

Nice one Jersey.


You could of at least edited the post then if you didn't like it.


You little dictator (good job)

Pushing your luck a bit there, aren't you?

2edgy4me

Assanah Apr 1st 2017 4:53 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Bipat (Post 12218107)
You know that UK trades with non-EU countries under EU rules, why refuse to accept that?
I see stuff in the supermarkets here in that (unmentionable on this thread) country --made in UK!

What do you mean with EU rules? The UK either trades with third countries under the rules of a free trade agreement concluded by the EU on behave of the member states or under WTO rules. That includes trade with the saviour of the world, the fastest growing economy of the world.
Free trade agreements are not negotiated by the EU on a whim. To negotiate the EU has to asked for a negotiation mandate first which lays down the limits and goals of negotiation. This mandate is given to it by the member states. Furthermore, most free trade deals have to be approved by the national parliaments as well as the EU parliament. There is a lot of control by member states with regards to free trade deals. So what exactly are EU rules?

I repeat myself but the UK can trade now with the whole world- including the saviour country- either under WTO terms or free trade agreements. After Brexit it will be the same.

InVinoVeritas Apr 1st 2017 5:57 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Assanah (Post 12218711)
What do you mean with EU rules? The UK either trades with third countries under the rules of a free trade agreement concluded by the EU on behave of the member states or under WTO rules. That includes trade with the saviour of the world, the fastest growing economy of the world.
Free trade agreements are not negotiated by the EU on a whim. To negotiate the EU has to asked for a negotiation mandate first which lays down the limits and goals of negotiation. This mandate is given to it by the member states. Furthermore, most free trade deals have to be approved by the national parliaments as well as the EU parliament. There is a lot of control by member states with regards to free trade deals. So what exactly are EU rules?

I repeat myself but the UK can trade now with the whole world- including the saviour country- either under WTO terms or free trade agreements. After Brexit it will be the same.

I think everyone needs to go away and do a bit of homework about the way the EU mandates trade. There seems to be a general misunderstanding and/or deliberate misrepresentation. And, by the way, free trade is a bit of a misnomer here - it mean trade freely not trade without tariff.

Fredbargate Apr 1st 2017 6:09 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by mrken30 (Post 12218386)
Everything is negotiable. Surely this was thought about when deciding the option to leave the EU? What did you think was going to happen?

That's no secret

From a post I made on 5/5/15

So I would be happy to be out of a club that allows one member to shit on another even if it meant returning to a closed frontier.


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