British Expats

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-   -   Post EU Referendum (https://britishexpats.com/forum/take-outside-67/post-eu-referendum-879308/)

SultanOfSwing Mar 29th 2017 3:37 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter (Post 12216350)
If ever there were a "whoosh"...

Yeah, for a moment I thought Concorde was back.

Bipat Mar 29th 2017 4:23 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by SultanOfSwing (Post 12216337)
Trade has nothing to do with nationality, that's a complete non-sequitur and it's obvious bait to which I am not going to rise. Go try with someone else.

Whatever Ms. May says or does, you would have to be blind not to see that there was a very strong undercurrent of xenophobia running though the Leave campaign. Cancerous nationalists like Flange et al capitalized on the attitude of Britain First crowd and for some reason succeeded in railroading Cameron into calling the referendum.

.

Your words leaving---"return to Xenophobic, nationalistic exclusionism", indicating leaving the EU is this! In other words leaving this particular trade organisation.

Nigel Farage (is it possible for those who support remaining in the EU to use correct words?:lol:) certainly tapped in to those who already had anti-immigrant views. Those people are a minority of the population.
Worry about total immigrant numbers and wishing for Non-EU and EU to come under same and flexible rules is not xenophobic. (As illustrated by the immigrant origin vote being in the same proportions for Brexit.)

SultanOfSwing Mar 29th 2017 4:30 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Bipat (Post 12216387)
Your words leaving---"return to Xenophobic, nationalistic exclusionism", indicating leaving the EU is this! In other words leaving this particular trade organisation.

I never mentioned trade. You did. To the best of my knowledge the UK traded with the rest of the world while a member of the EU. Trade was just a handy excuse to hide behind because nobody can really give a real good reason for running away from the EU like a sad little backwards-thinking, irrelevant coward.


Originally Posted by Bipat (Post 12216387)
Nigel Farage (is it possible for those who support remaining in the EU to use correct words?:lol:) certainly tapped in to those who already had anti-immigrant views. Those people are a minority of the population.
Worry about total immigrant numbers and wishing for Non-EU and EU to come under same and flexible rules is not xenophobic. (As illustrated by the immigrant origin vote being in the same proportions for Brexit.)

Nigey-Wigey is a national embarrassment and deserves nothing but derision for single-handedly setting the UK back 50 years.

Paranoia is not something that should be normalized. We are a nomadic species at our core, it is in our very nature to migrate. It is part of who, and what, we are.

Bipat Mar 29th 2017 4:31 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by amideislas (Post 12216343)
Well, "trade with the world" was one of the [lesser] Brexit rationales, but Britain already trades with most of the world, so I reckon most people didn't really find that to be their foremost concern.

I've been watching Sky news today, and like any news outfit, they're out interviewing people on the street to get their reactions. The *vast* majority of those who support Brexit speak almost exclusively about aversion to foreigners in one way or another - although not necessarily in those words.

It's usually phrased something like "I just feel we have too many immigrants, and I think leaving the EU will make that better". Those that do talk about anything else seem to mention sovereignty and "making our own laws". I don't think anyone mentioned "trade with the rest of the world". I'd have to believe that's because Britain already does that, so it's just not on their minds.

Of course, by all accounts, Brexit won't change any of that (and likely will make it worse), but it seems that's what most average people in favour of Brexit are expecting: Less Foreigners.

The words were MORE trade with the rest of the world, not restricted by membership of the EU.

I really object to your view that half of the UK has an "aversion to foreigners", such people exist but they are a minority.
Perhaps being a member of a 'foreign' family and having worked with people originating in other countries (including EU countries) I might have more experience about it than you.

EMR Mar 29th 2017 4:33 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Bipat (Post 12216387)
Your words leaving---"return to Xenophobic, nationalistic exclusionism", indicating leaving the EU is this! In other words leaving this particular trade organisation.

Nigel Farage (is it possible for those who support remaining in the EU to use correct words?:lol:) certainly tapped in to those who already had anti-immigrant views. Those people are a minority of the population.
Worry about total immigrant numbers and wishing for Non-EU and EU to come under same and flexible rules is not xenophobic. (As illustrated by the immigrant origin vote being in the same proportions for Brexit.)

Not the immigrant vote just those you call Desi.
You are right about the same rules though, those for who immigration was their reason to vote want fewer migrants from any and everywhere.

SultanOfSwing Mar 29th 2017 4:35 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Bipat (Post 12216392)
The words were MORE trade with the rest of the world, not restricted by membership of the EU.

That largely depends on the actual rest of the world though, not the EU. What does the UK have to offer the rest of the world, other than buying more of their products because they sure as shit aren't selling much of anything.

Bipat Mar 29th 2017 4:36 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by SultanOfSwing (Post 12216391)
I never mentioned trade. You did. To the best of my knowledge the UK traded with the rest of the world while a member of the EU. Trade was just a handy excuse to hide behind because nobody can really give a real good reason for running away from the EU like a sad little backwards-thinking, irrelevant coward.

.

The EU is a trade organisation. Not a social club! It has rules regarding its members trading outside with countries not members of the Union.
Changing the staus quo without certainty it will be successful, is hardly cowardly.

Bipat Mar 29th 2017 4:40 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by EMR (Post 12216393)
Not the immigrant vote just those you call Desi.
You are right about the same rules though, those for who immigration was their reason to vote want fewer migrants from any and everywhere.

That's what they call themselves! They are the largest group of immigrant origin people in the UK.

SultanOfSwing Mar 29th 2017 4:42 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Bipat (Post 12216397)
The EU is a trade organisation. Not a social club! It has rules regarding its members trading outside with countries not members of the Union.

What? An organisation with regulations on membership has rules? Really?


Originally Posted by Bipat (Post 12216397)
Changing the staus quo without certainty it will be successful, is hardly cowardly.

Yes, it is stupid too.

There is no guarantee it will make one bit of difference, at which point the whole thing will be a waste of time. Was it worth gambling freedom of movement for British citizens within the EU and the potential unity of the UK as a whole just for a little experiment to see if the rest of the world still thinks the UK is relevant?

Some things are best left alone and/or fixed from within. Now the EU can change all kinds of rules that will, whether directly or indirectly affect the UK and the UK will no longer have the power of veto it once held. The UK should have striven to be in the driving seat in the EU, not left standing on the side of the road because it didn't like the seat that someone else took when it got out for a piss.

Bipat Mar 29th 2017 4:44 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by SultanOfSwing (Post 12216396)
That largely depends on the actual rest of the world though, not the EU. What does the UK have to offer the rest of the world, other than buying more of their products because they sure as shit aren't selling much of anything.

Obviously depends on the rest of the world. There have been numerous posts and links regarding future trade deals. The UK has plenty to offer, it is not just about manufactured goods.

scrubbedexpat099 Mar 29th 2017 4:46 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 
March the 29th, should now be a National Holiday surely?

SultanOfSwing Mar 29th 2017 4:48 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Bipat (Post 12216404)
Obviously depends on the rest of the world. There have been numerous posts and links regarding future trade deals. The UK has plenty to offer, it is not just about manufactured goods.

It's all speculation. This is the definition of uncharted waters now - nobody can say with any degree of certainty how it should go and I will not apoligise for being pragmatic enough to make a hint of a suggestion that there is a small possibility it could maybe not turn out for the best.

You do realise that once the UK is out, there is absolutely nothing to stop the EU from changing the rules regarding trading with non-EU countries around the world to make it more attractive to trade with them vs the UK, right?

SultanOfSwing Mar 29th 2017 4:53 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Boiler (Post 12216406)
March the 29th, should now be a National Holiday surely?

You already moved to a country that celebrates stupidity, let's not ruin the UK any more than than UKIP have already.

Bipat Mar 29th 2017 4:55 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by SultanOfSwing (Post 12216410)
It's all speculation. This is the definition of uncharted waters now - nobody can say with any degree of certainty how it should go and I will not apoligise for being pragmatic enough to make a hint of a suggestion that there is a small possibility it could maybe not turn out for the best.

You do realise that once the UK is out, there is absolutely nothing to stop the EU from changing the rules regarding trading with non-EU countries around the world to make it more attractive to trade with them vs the UK, right?

I agree with you nothing is certain. Yes, it may not turn out for the best but you cannot be certain that it will not be successful.

Yes, the EU may make more efforts with non--EU countries, just a few weeks ago the largest ever delegation from the EU came to India trying to resurrect the failed free trade negotiations-----they went home--!

EMR Mar 29th 2017 4:57 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Bipat (Post 12216400)
That's what they call themselves! They are the largest group of immigrant origin people in the UK.

But not the only one, so you cannot speak for the immigrant vote.


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